what the
Years ago

limit 1 Div 1 team per club

well - here we are at the end of the first season with this new intro of only 1 div 1 team per club.
What are your thoughts?

Another point i would like to raise is that 2 bech players from a Div 1 junior team - should be allowed to play Div 2 - many big clubs have 10 on their div 1 roster and the last 2 often get little time. It happens in seniors - why can't it happen in juniors.

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basman  
Years ago

PROBABLY cos they play on the same night.

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what the  
Years ago

only u16 up play the same night - and then if they only get 5 min court time in a higher div they could play later or drive down the road to another stadium.
I am sure a u18 Div 1 male benchy - who gets 5 min court time - could and would benefit from playing 15 min with the Div 2s the same night - obviously some nights it would clash - but generally on the whole it would work.

bring it on....

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Libertine  
Years ago

I'm sure they wouldn't. What about the players who are good enough to play div 2 but miss out because there are 'benchies' wanting more court time? It only works in Seniors where the system has been in place for awhile.

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Phil Magera  
Years ago

This idea is useful for discussion but nothing else. There is no possible way that it could be applied in reality and furthermore, i doubt that the players would back the idea! I know i would rather play limited minutes in the best team then play more in an inferior team/division. Anyone else?

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Libertine  
Years ago

I'll put it this way - when I was coaching the 2nd division 1 team at my club, some of my players, despite playing upwards of 25 mins per game (we play 32 mins 4x8 min qyarters), still wanted to sit on the bench in the top team, even though effectively they jad a better opportunity to play at the same level against the same players.

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Moochie Norris  
Years ago

Didn't like it. Weakened the 16 boys comp (one of the best/even div 1 grades - Libertines' Norwood side were more than competitive, around mid-tablish I think. Also introduced the bye, and with the tightness of some of the teams it would be a shame if an "uneven bye" scenario comes into the mix. REALLY weakended an already poor (in terms of depth) 14 boys comp - Sturt's 2s were probably around 5/6ish and were replaced by Woodville and Centrals, who surely each must be in the bottom 3. I'd assume girls grades that had two North teams were weakened as well.

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Libertine  
Years ago

That's what we couldn't understand about it - why have the bye in place when the breach could be filled by a more then capable team? All that happened was that parents got disillusioned with the club and BASA and we lost two players to Woodville.

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Libertine  
Years ago

I might quickly add - they only won 3.5 games out of 11 (Sturt, Southern, West, and draw with South). But of their other results, their biggest loss was in the last game against North, by 16, which says alot for the fighting qualities of the team. They still managed to draw (huge 3 on buzzer - win in OT) with West at the Easter despite missing the two guys who left, whilst adding a division 3 player and carrying a player with an injury.

All goes back to the old promotion/relegation debate. Let's hope that with the implementation of some Local Conferencing that the next logical step in following the Victorian model is to implement this system which allows the best to play against the best.

That's not saying my boys are anything special - their results (consecutive losses) in the 2s have proved that, and have got their coach pulling his hair out. Just goes to show the fine line between division 1 and 2 this year ni 16s.

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Libertine  
Years ago

And that with promotion/relegation, anything could have happened.

(I need to learn to think my ideas all at once! Someone wanna do my tutorial presentation at 4pm for me today, I'm struggling somewhere near the start :P)

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saw  
Years ago

1. I don't think there should ever be a bye in Div 1 or 2. in the winter season. If a club doesn't want to field a Div 1 team then invite the best Div 2 team to be promoted.

2. On limited time, Div 1 bench players being allowed to play Div 2, I think this is not necessarily a bad idea. Where I see some merit is in the lower age groups. I think it should be restricted to "first year" players in an age group who are pre nominated as a person to play in both levels. This will give the person the opportunity in the first year to get a feel for Div 1 and what is required, but allows them to play in Div 2 to get game time and develop for the next year when they will probably be a definite Div 1 player getting more time.

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Fat Elvis  
Years ago

Only putting in teams to make up to 10 doesn't fix the uneven games situation. The comp either needs to be 12 teams and 2 rounds (22 games), or 8 teams and 3 rounds (21 games).

With 12 teams you would need to move up enough div 2 teams but I feel that the competition would be diluted.

Reply #2818 | Report this post


Libertine  
Years ago

But what about other players who will miss out on their spot because this player is allowed to play in two teams? Wouldn't then, in theory, would it create a chain effect, allowing the div 2 benchies be allowed to play in div 3 (etc) and so on. All it means is less kids play basketball.

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saw  
Years ago

Libertine,

No perfect solution but what about the first year player getting limited time (and all that kids want to do is play) getting disenchanted and moving onto other sports?

You say that less kids will play and you might be right but I also see this as a problem with the current approach....you're in div 1 and can play five minutes or play football for an hour or so.

Reply #2836 | Report this post


Libertine  
Years ago

I see your argument saw, but having been in the situation as a first-year on the end of the bench many moons ago in 16s, I'd rather be in the top side playing against the best (when I eventually got on) then playing in division 2. If its a problem than we might as well do away with district ball as a whole and let everyone have equal time till they get to seniors.

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Doc James  
Years ago

Jirachi,

The origins of the 12 team competition go back to when clubs could nominate multiple teams in division 1. The reason for it where that it fits in the yearly calendar with a maximum number of games. As much as i would like to see it, the 18 game season cuts back on BASA revenue too much. The 8 team format works because you lose a game plus a finals round in the mani season but pick them up in the summer season, if you run a three rond 6 team promotion/relegation series. That is 15 games plus 23 for the pro/reg, and 13 plus 25 for the 12 team.

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saw  
Years ago

My point is that an 11/12 year old kid can train for 3+ hours a week and get 5 minutes court time. How is he going to develop fully without more court time.

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Doc James  
Years ago

What is stoping him fom playing school/social basketball. Player do not improve duing games, they merely implement what they have been taught and practiced at trainings. This is the 5th and final step in the learning process. Is that players leaves the sport, then they probably don't have the ability to deal wityh adversity that is required to be an elite level players in the first place. What is required then is a good standard domestic comeptition fro them.

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