Looks like we may lose to nz in the boys..

its a qualifying round game, so as long as we win the other two games its ok we will be in the final. The only game that matters is to win the final.

if we lose that then we are out and the guys at BA with there great planning should be out as well.

BA you need to lift your game, better & earlier talent identification more opportunity to develop via exposure to higher levels of competition.

well its official the australian u16 (for the U17 world cup) just copped a 19 smack down by NZ.

This Aussie team has only 1 guy at the CoE. They have had only 2,3 short training camps (one of which was funded by a community group?) with no games played competitively prior to the qualification tournament.

What has happen to our development process this is crazy and it truly lacks the planning & development that was once our strong point. The U17 world cup has been around long enough now for us to get it right?

Think back to how close it was for us with the last U19 qualification. Basketball Australia is asleep at the wheel.

Then there is the fact that NZ is actually closing the gap on us too!

I was not there, so I can only look at the livestats also. It is obvious that NZ controlled the boards and probably this allowed them to control the game.

We seemed to have shot poorly, so maybe we took bad shots or maybe NZ just pressured us well and we couldn't get good open looks, or maybe we didn't pass it well and were too selfish?

I don't know as I said, I wasn't there, anyone there care to share their thoughts?

Hilarious people having opinions without seeing the game

Why can't someone wake an opinion based on livestats anon^? You have made an opinion that you feel people are hilarious because they have an opinion, yet you also have one, based on nothing!

Olgun Uluc is my go-to-guy for reporting on games based on box scores.

Fakira only played 4mins?
Starr hasn't performed aswell as expected?
Griffiths over dalton?

Some odd choices.

Currently the starting lineup is..
Dent
Elkaz
Fullarton
Johns
Colina

Definitely unexpected.

Yep Olgun will make something up based on the stats and a photo borrow from someone.

Then you guys can add your own interpretation of that. Won't have any connection to the actual event.

It's not easy to work out exactly what went wrong just looking at the stats were New Zealand bigger ? Or are there players chosen in the Australian team who have under performed ? Will they be able to come back in the GF
The girls look like they're on the right track and has less preparation time then the boys so what's going on

Watkins and Schueller, that's what's going on :(

BA have invested in coaches that no longer actually coach and are trying to implement a system that takes a long time to perfect.

Watkins..nsw
Dent
Zunic
Elkaz
Fakira

Schueller..vic
Bines
Johns
Griffiths
Colina(Coe)

Others
Mudronja-sa
Starr-usa
Fullarton-qld(Coe)
Froling-qld(future Coe?)

^ what's your point?

794, they just won a silver at their last campaign. They are missing Jamie from Country Victoria though and I'm not sure on the guy they replaced him with????

Interesting comment, about BA implementing a system that takes a lot of time to perfect, especially at this age group. They have been implementing a system for a while now, at NITP, NPP and CoE camps so one would hope these players have been paying attention.

There is of course a theory about system, does the system need to fit the playing group or have we scouted players that can adapt to the system.

Our system at junior level has got us some good results, or has it? I beg to differ and say it has been some incredible players and lucky shots that may have had as much to do with our junior international success as the system.

Another thing, who actually knows what this 'system' is? Is the system a phylisophy of play or is it some set plays and rotations, because the system seems to be short of the NZ system at the moment?

I tend to agree with the need to coach these kids on how to play basketball, before we turn them into system based robots, but then I guess the coaches know better at BA than I do.

Well I am staying positive until tomorrow, lets hope the boys and the coaches learn from this. Although I would look at starting 5 as I learn towards Bines.

Girls are currently losing in the final...

Girls up by 3 points with 1 qtr left...
Hope we can hold on...

Magbegor taking over...

Girls are through to the big show!
Magbegor with 23 points, 16 rebounds and 5 blocks.

I reckon will see a few changes happening to the squad over the next 10 months.
Goodchild in for one.

Best 5 throughout tournament was imo:

Shelley
Simmons
McLean
Pizzey
Magbegor

with a grand total of 4 assists for the whole game, that would be a good area to start looking at for the changes needed.

The first thing to do is stop the brendan joyce plan of having mature age CoE members and get back to a full group of the best talented juniors getting the best development, its has been to the detriment of the development of future opals...

Completely agree...
More about talent.

Locks.. 2016?
Shelley, Simmons, simons, McLean, pizzey, magbegor

Fighting for positions:
Point guards
Cubillo, George, Abel, McDowell white, heal

Guards
Goodchild, lehmann, dangelo, Satie, Schweizer

Small forwards
Rowe, mole, c.bourne, McKay, fisher

Power forwards
Cochrane, mcspadden, batish, motuga, I.bourne

Center
Rees, Burke

Amongst others...

How are the boys going who's playing well

Should they look at taking some of the squad through to the AIS is it lack of time together or lack of talent

Coaches fell in love with small ball playing Tahiti, thought it may work in the final too - massive malfunction. Teams with strong guards will trouble this team as guards are vulnerable defensively.

here's a great photo of the boys team pre match

https://instagram.com/p/6ZeANjRylBmIAZxTuZ4FZcXyZgPcjuQrUuZPc0/

Its shows Bines and Elkaz have both grown taller guessing 196 & 197cms

still wondering why dalton wasn't picked (crazy)

No doubt... Dalton should have been starting..

If they manage to get through ?? Will there be changes made in the team for next year

Is there a big size difference between New Zealand and Australia

Dalton, runnalls, garang, ocarroll, Matthews-Hampton, lutula to get look ins for next year possibly..

Just a guess..
Dent/zunic
Fullarton/bines/Elkaz
Garang/johns
Froling/dalton/runnalls
Fakira/Colina

which would mean mudronja, Starr, Griffiths out of the current squad.

^"Should they look at taking some of the squad through to the AIS is it lack of time together or lack of talent"

Yes they should have a few more there now, its a matter of development. the talent continually comes through in Australia but it must be developed and the CoE has been the place (in this country, others are now going direct to the US).
The boys have a big opportunity with a good number of talls that need development

^"Is there a big size difference between New Zealand and Australia".

The rebounding wasn't in our favour but we are reasonably matched in the bigs it may have been more about physicality (hard to say without vision).


I would tell everyone to have a look at the following link to the just finished boys U16 European Championship and check out the rosters
http://u16men.fibaeurope.com/en/default.asp

Bosnia and Herzegovina beat Lithuania with a very big team
turkey beat Spain for bronze with a big team.

we need to get over playing small ball

The next year we will probably see..
Bines and Elkaz 6'5-6'6
Fullarton and garang 6'6-6'7
Johns and Griffiths 6'7-6'8
Froling, dalton, runnalls and fakira 6'9-6'10
Colina 6'10-6'11

So if Star is out why all the big write ups of how good he is

Garang what's the go with his paper work will it be
Resolved

Starr an American comes to play for Australia? = different = storyline?

Watch his YouTube clips... His ok. Doesn't stand out amongst the crowd though..

Sorry, I started the small ball theme and that was about the coaching malfunction in the girls game tonight.

Who played in small ball for girls?

Nz junior programs are based on fundamental skills like dribbling the ball, defence and shooting.

Aus style is flooding young brains with strategy and plays drawn out on whiteboards.

We only win because we have a larger talent pool and usually it's only two or three players that get us over the line.

Fundamental coaching is poor in Australia

I was surprised when our u17 girls got their medals.
It looked like mcpadden and cochrane were the same size or even taller than magbegor.. Am I wrong?
And Shelley was almost as tall as McLean which would make her 5'10-5'11?
A lot of girls where bigger than I expected.

Both Samuel and fotu are far more physical than our bigs.
Colina and froling may be taller but they are sticks in comparison.
Fakira looks to be the better rebounder atm.

We could be in trouble because there starting 5 is better than ours for sure.

Macdub... That's not the case anymore.
They have changed a whole bunch in the last 2 years.

Cochrane easily the tallest, followed by McSpadden. Cochrane must be 6'5" if you accept Magbegor is 6'3".

One tall 14yo.

Few changes I would make to u17 girls.. But hey just an opinion...
Quite a few from 2000 born I know...

Pg/sg Shelley 2000
Pg white 2000
Pg/sg 1 of Abel(99), heal(01), Cubillo(99), lehmann(99), George(99)
Sg/pg Goodchild 2000
Sg/sf Simmons 1999
Sg/sf simons 2000
Sf/sg McLean 1999
Sf/sg 1 of Rowe(99), bourne(99), mole(99), dangelo(00), Schweizer(00)
Pf/c pizzey 1999
Pf/c cochrane 2000
C/pf mcspadden 1999
C/pf Magbegor 1999

Magbegor has been measured.
She is 6'4 193cm.
4 players 6'5 by mid next year?
Strength is the problem though.. Not length...
I guess that's why Seebohm wanted batish even though she's only 6'2.

A few players from the u16 vic teams were touted as ones to watch..
Gould, Leydin, Frawley if memory serves...
Couple of sa girls and qld girls from the final also.

Gould would have shone in NZ.

Others not close.

I watched krisome for qld...
Thought she was underrated because of the other talent they had in that squad.
White, heal, Goodchild, motuga etc

It looks like all the teams from Europe are of similar size to us except Greece has a 7fter.

A 7ft Greek girl? Wow

Nah in the boys u16 euro champs.
The tallest guy is 213cm from Greece...

Most euro teams seem to have bigger guards but I think we have slightly bigger bigs.
The average euro big is 204cm or 6'8.5
Average guard seems to be 197cm 6'5'5

Its a new age...

The u16 girls euro champs is about to start.
I looked at the rosters. Most teams front courts consist of players between 6'0-6'4.
Similar to ours...

But 2 of the teams...
Turkey
6'9 (2001) inci Guclu and 3 other players around 6'3-6'4

Serbia
6'9 (2001) Helena mitrovic and 3 other players 6'4-6'6

These 6'9 players are also very large (talking 220lbs plus easily)
Brittany griner size with another 30-40lbs at age 14... Crazy!
Doubt their very mobile but huge presence down low for sure.

Russia and Germany are also very big. Multiple 6'4 players.

Guclu is 99 born. Not that it makes a difference...

And we play small ball against the night of NZ

Serbia is out and Turkey are on their way out...
Doesn't look like they will make the world's.

Russia on the women's side are looking very strong much like the u19 side.
Good program working over there in Moscow.

May take my daughter to Moscow.

What time do the boys play today

Same lineup...
Wtf Watkins!

we seem to be playing better,starting 5 no problem, coaches have done their homework, give them credit!!

I love knockers when we go down, just make sure you are about when we WIN.

Are you about #131

Still here.
You don't think froling should start?

Instead of going big with froling at pf they use johns who is a tweener 3/4.
looks like they switch johns for Griffiths and Colina for froling.
Basically the whole team is straight swaps...?

We only have to,win by 1...

Why do we need to win by 20, win by 1 will do

Clearly Watkins doesn't think much of starr or mudronja. Unless their injured?

Dalton, garang and another guard to come in potentially next year?

What has is this 20 point buffer.
I thought this is a gold medal game

It is. Someone thinks it's best of 2? It's not...

Hat other pg's do we have beside dent and zunic?

Could potentially slide bines over to pg and have
Bines
Elkaz
Fullarton
Froling or dalton
Colina or fakira

Cheers. If we can hold Fotu & Samuel this half we should win.
I think NZ coach has rolled the dice by sitting them with 2 fouls each. We will see!!!

Can any one put up the score & let us know who's playing well ?

How does the team compare to last year?

2014 u17 boys team vs 2015 u17 boys team.
6'0 Owies vs 6'1 dent
6'2 Hodgson vs 6'2 zunic
6'2 vasljevic vs 6'5 bines
6'2 Mcmullan vs 6'5 elkaz
6'3 Wilson vs 6'5 Mudronja
6'4 White vs 6'5 Starr
6'6 Clark vs 6'6 Fullarton
6'6 Noi vs 6'7 johns
6'7 Akintola vs 6'7 Griffiths
6'9 froling vs 6'8 fakira
6'9 Gak vs 6'9 froling
6'11 Humphries vs 6'10 Colina

Elkaz, Johns and Dent for Aussie are doing well, for Kiwi Clinton, McDonald and McRae leading the way.

Elkaz almost out of the game... 4 fouls

60-53 Aussie in front nearly 3/4 time.

Kiwi made up 2 points, so Aussie go into last quarter with an 8 point lead. Goannas!

Oh o...
Here come nz!

Zunic and froling not making their shots....

Geez.. Nz don't get much from the bench.

Less than 3 minutes to go and a 5 point game. Goannas missing some 3 pointers!

Pressure................... 1.30 minutes to go and a 3 point game!!!!!!!!!!!!

And the best rebounder at u16 state champs was who?

High scoring game 80+ points per team going to the wire!

Patty Bines hits a 3 pointer, nice assist Fullarton!

Into last minute, Aussie by 6 points....

Who's played well

Sam Froling clutch with two free throws to give Aussie an eight point lead with 24 seconds to go, a win is a win, is a win!

Starting 5 all played well, other than Colina who has struggled, for Aus that is. Bines and Froling off the bench have done well, also Dent, Fullarton, Johns and Elkaz were solid.

Solid starters that is.......................

Will there be changes made in the squad for next year

Wait............ NZ hit a 3 and it's a 4 point game with 13 seconds to go, oh my goodness!

Now we play, foul the ball, Froling one out of two, only 6 seconds to go Aussie 89 - 86 Kiwi.

Great win, 91-86, well done to the Aussie boys and a great effort by NZ too, bad luck again to the Kiwis.

If nzs starting 5 shot better we would have lost by 20.
We were out rebounded by a much smaller team.

Clearly we have to solve that problem!

dent/zunic
Elkaz/bines
Fullarton/garang/johns
Froling/dalton/runnalls
Fakira/Colina

Mudronja, Starr and Griffiths out?
Maybe Colina out, runnalls to centre and add another guard.

Well done the young Aussie men you've done your Country proud and it sounds like a lot of work to build up to the Worlds next year

It was live on Sky in NZ why no TV in AUS basketball TV coverage is such a fail in AU haha

Colina out, don't think so, he is at the COE

Griffiths handy 3/4 6 points in 11 minutes.

What does the CoE have to do with being able to cope with the standard of playing at worlds? Blow all the wind you want about the CoE, he has just arrived and obviously had trouble in this game, so unless they change him completely in a short time they will look elsewhere. BA cuts them like crazy as soon as they see any small weakness is exposed and bring in the next big thing. Hope he can come good with lots of hard work, but don't rely on CoE alone, that's just nuts. He apparently loves his footy anyway!

Olgun Uluc obviously has never watched Johns play if he thinks hitting a 3 pointer is uncharacteristic for him. Another uneducated guess in his game report unfortunately.

The good thing about Fullarton and garang is that they can both play the guard and forward position. Johns is better suited to sf but can play pf small ball which leaves some room for a couple of bigger guys in the post. Dalton and froling should be locks and The others (Colina, fakira, runnalls, Griffiths) will continue to practice their skills and fight it out for a couple/few spots.

Who will stay in for the Worlds and who will likely miss out based on this weeks performance seems like a lot of talk up about Star who didn't even look like he got on at all in the last game how can an Australian team be chosen and players aren't good enough to even get in the court ? What does that say about the selection process

Doesn't Garang have to prove his identity and age before he gets his paper work in order is this correct and not the only one in the squad with the same issue

Would starr even be there if garang was available?

The biggest wtf was dalton not making the team.
A 6'9 pf/c That averaged 20 points, 12 rebounds and 4.5 blocks at u16 and was beat out by Griffiths, Colina and fakira? 2 of which didn't even play at nationals.

Surely he was injured or something?

Anyone know anything about that 15 yo 6'10 kid Nic Tata from channel 10s 'the project'...
What's the story with that guy?

Looked slow and heavy

I think it's perfectly fine to think there will be changes made it's not a given for these players to make a team that could change in ten months time. Wasn't there five players from the last men's team who played qualifying round but didn't play worlds. Like any team it's finding the right combination. I would be interested if any of these kids will be offered a spot at the AIS

I haven't seen Dolton play but it does seem like a lot of question to why he missed out ??

Great work Aussie boys and coaches! You have done Australia proud!

Will we see them regroup in Jan