^me

If United don't have the $ to find a decent import, Burston would make a good addition to round out their roster.

But its the player points system that keeps these mid tier guys out of the league?!!??!!?

^ I agree. Burston is rated as a defensive centre; he also brings some offence to the court. Breakers could potentially use him, too, as Rob Loe is more of a stretch 4 than a 5.

This is the fall out from the league allowing an extra import and therefore having higher standards of its Australian players.

The Breakers last spot is going to an Import 4 that can bang bodies and hit the boards

Each Team still has 8 spots for Aussies.

Perhaps its just the fact that younger and better players are coming along? Not everyone gets to play forever and retire on their terms.

It's unfortunate for Burston (and the others mentioned), however surely it's a good sign for the league overall that decent contributors like these guys are finding it harder to win a spot on a roster?

Burston might end up at Sydney as he'd be a great backup for Khazzouh. He's still a very good player.

^ Smith, Sydney have Maric as well as Khazzouh. That's probably enough.

Burston's had what, a 16 year pro career? That's pretty good by most standards. He'll be 34 this season.
If anything the 11 man squad has provided additional opportunities for "end of the bench" players. Plus in the modern era, there are far less naturalised players in the NBL, and greater opportunities for Aussies to play O/S. So I really don't feel people can whinge about lack of opportunities.

It's probably mostly due to the marquee rules and the additional cap space that creates.

We've seen locals like Penney, Khazzouh, Bairstow, Kickert, Lisch (now naturalised), Jawai, Maric, Andersen, Newley all return to the league. Goulding played one season overseas and then returned home.

The standard of local/Australian players in the NBL has greatly increased in the past 3 years. Rewind to even 2013-2014 and make a list of the best Australians in the league, and compare this to the new list with all of the above players added in.

This of course squeezes out some of the other Australians like Walker and Burston.

(and other factors play into that as well, like Economics, value of the dollar, etc, likelihood of actually being paid etc).

Dazz, there will be just over 50 Aussies in the NBL this season. I'm pretty certain that is the fewest number there has ever been. If that's not a lack of opportunities I don’t know what is.

By my quick count there are less than 20 Aussies playing full-time pro ball overseas, meaning about 70 pros in total. Australian rules footy has a similar male participation rate to basketball but has more than 10 times the number of professional opportunities.

Comparing to AFL is a bit ridiculous though... it's like comparing chalk and a cow...

^ Dazz: "If anything the 11 man squad has provided additional opportunities for "end of the bench" players."...

Burston was a starter last year, mate.

"I think a MINOR reduction in aussie talent"

Since 2008 there has been a reduction of almost 50 Aussies playing in the NBL. That isn't really MINOR.

I get that Free Throws but Maric is starting next to Khazzouh so who's their big coming off the bench? Tommy and Hill are both stretch 4's who struggle with post defence.

We need another 2 teams to boost the number of Aussies playing, no question... the problem is how to get there without losing any of the 8 we currently have. The strategy to boost the quality of the product on the court by teams spending a ton of cash could go either way - we have a couple of great seasons of basketball and we get 2 more teams, or the arms race has no real winners and we lose 2 more teams.

Better talent doesn't necessarily mean a better spectacle. The talent level went through the roof from the early 90s to the late 90s but pure entertainment value went down.

Had a good chuckle at anon trying to reduce the loss of around 50 Aussie jobs to Childress in for Carter! The more teams you have the more import spots there are too. Funny.

What's the point that you're trying to make though, paul? iS it that there needs to be more teams? (everyone would agree) or are you arguing that with 8 teams there shouldn't be a third import? (I'd agree with you on that)

You're throwing around stats about loss of playing spots without actually making any clear point... The losses of most of those spots can be attributed to losing teams out of the league, what can we do about it? Make a more exciting product so there are more people wanting to go to games which justifies more teams like Angus was saying? That seems like common sense to me...

Saying that pure entertainment level went down is fairly subjective, I think... I didn't get to watch any 80s games, but I watched a lot in the 90s and I was pretty entertained...

Burston might remain in QLD still, Brisbane could do with another big.

The issue is that fringe players salaries are not that much greater than a 'normal' workplace salary, so it must get to a point where if they can't earn $x playing basketball anymore, they'll just get a real job and earn $x-1 for the next 30 years.

Wookie, my point is very simple, a rebuttal of Dazz's comment that "I really don't feel people can whinge about lack of opportunities".

There are the fewest opportunities for Aussies in the NBL's history, and just over half as many as there were eight years ago, so there is clearly a lack of opportunities.

The three-import rule hasn’t really impacted it because the league has added an extra roster spot to each team to cover. The lack of teams is the biggest factor.

^me

If the number of spots available for Australians is the same, how can you also say, as you did above, that it's the lowest it's ever been?

In fact, given not all teams will be running with three imports, and the number of roster spots has increased, surely the number of Aussies in the league will go up?

My point above is that, if the number of teams in NBL remains constant, then the marquee rules and increased salary cap will result in a reduction of Aussies playing professionally. That's what's happened in the past 3 years.

Paul's point about the number of teams is obviously valid too, and that speaks more to the reductions from say 2008 to 2014.

My previous post was directed at paul, LV must have posted while I was typing.

Although a counter argument to my argument, would be to point to Aussies who have gone from NBL to Europe in past 3 years, like Magden, Steindl etc. But I suspect more have come back the other way from Europe to NBL.

Although I would be interested if someone did compile a list. Comparing 2013-14 NBL season to 2016-17- numbers of Aussies now in NBL compared to Europe/elsewhere professionally... off the top of my head:

Penney,
Khazzouh,
Kickert,
Lisch (now naturalised),
Jawai,
Maric,
Andersen,
Newley
Barlow
Markovic

Another category would be those who started an professional career overseas but then came to the NBL in the past 3 years, like Majok Majok, Rob Loe, Cam Bairstow. In years gone by, they perhaps would have been more likely to stay overseas rather than join the NBL. This also means a reduction in overall Australians playing professionally, if number of NBL teams don't change

Dazz, there will be just over 50 Aussies in the NBL this season

Burston was a starter last year, mate.

33 dudes past it, Its a business no excuse to be mad at cairns for this. There is much better younger players that would play for his contract

Koberulz, here's the breakdown from last year to this year for Aussie players.

Some rosters aren't finalised, so I've based whether they're signing another import in that spot or not on what I've heard, meaning these numbers could be slightly out either way in the end:

Adelaide 8 to 8
Cairns 8 to 8
Illawarra 9 to 8
Melbourne 8 to 7
New Zealand 1 to 0
Perth 7 to 7 (one naturalised)
Sydney 7 to 7 or 8 (one naturalised)
Tsv/Bris 7 to 8

Total 2015/16 = 55 including one naturalised
Total 2016/17 = 53 or 54 including two naturalised

I expect the league breakdown to be 53 or 54 Aussies, 11 or 12 Kiwis, one Guamian and 22 imports.

The only way the number of locals drops is by naturalisation or Oceanians. Neither is worth worrying about.
Splitting hairs over kiwis is similarly puerile.

Now as usual, the same old people insist on re-writing the argument, to avoid admitting they're wrong.

This thread is about Cairns cutting Burston.
The claim was made that this was due to the league allowing an extra import. Which is clearly wrong.

Pointing out that 7 Aussie teams is less than we once had, is beyond nonsensical.

Furthermore, the implicit suggestion, that the league should have "more teams to provide more opportunity" is simply mind-boggling.

Spot on Dazz.

The only thing more idiotic in this thread than arguing for the sake of arguing is how many posts a minor topic like this got.

Burston has had a very long career and was probably fortunate to still be in the league at this point. The Taipans decision not to re-sign him has nothing to do with footy, Guamanians, the entertainment level of 90's NBL or even the number of teams in the league.

"Furthermore, the implicit suggestion, that the league should have "more teams to provide more opportunity" is simply mind-boggling."

I'm not saying that. What I was pointing out was that you were completely wrong in saying there was no justification for players complaining about lack of opportunities.

For various reasons there have never been fewer Aussies in the league. That's a fact, one you weren't aware of. Just admit you were wrong and move on.

Re Burton, he had a horrific run with injuries and did incredibly well to last this long. His time has come but he can look back on his career with pride, a very good defensive big man who had incredibly soft hands for a centre when he was in his prime.

He could be someone who pops up as an injury replacement during the year, a contending team could do worse than to bring in his experience during the season if they need a big.

But there are the same number of opportunities for Aussies that there have been since the Blaze folded.

And?

The shortage of opportunities is producing deep rosters and super intense basketball. This year could well be the best of all.

And?

Has anyone suggested top players coming back to the league is a bad thing?

Koberulz, you're not seeing the woods for the trees. There was a severe lack of opportunities in 2012/13 (and for a number of years before that) just as there is now. This isn't a new issue.