Isaac
Years ago

United vs Breakers, Dec 4

Hardly would've thought in the pre-season that this might be 6th vs 8th, but here we are. Breakers have lost three straight, while Melbourne have won their last two.

This game is on SBS I think, starting shortly.

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Zodiac  
Years ago

Webster's back

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Mike  
Years ago

Ware from the carpark

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Magnificent crowd for true basketball supporters.

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Tom  
Years ago

Abercrombie is playing so poorly why is he playing. If he can't get to the hoop get him off. We have shot half the number of shots Melbourne have in the paint.
Pledge seems to be ignored.
Thank god Abercrombie has picked up 4 and has to leave.
Somebody get to the hoop.

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Tom  
Years ago

OMG its true, last place in the league.

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AKA  
Years ago

Why is DD'S son on the bench? He's not on the coaching staff is he?

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Mike  
Years ago

Perf and Un Zud holding up the table

Well done league for dismantling the status quo

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SteveK2  
Years ago

United really lucked out getting Ware. He's the cog driving this new United group.

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Mike  
Years ago

Mitchell getting his jam on

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je  
Years ago

I don't really mind Vukona, and you gotta respect his longevity in the league and in international play, but he does seem to throw in a fair few cheap shots for someone with an 'honest tough guy' reputation.

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LV  
Years ago

A lot of yak yak happening. NZ really not liking losing to Mel.

Was Penney getting into it with the crowd before? Looked like it.

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LV  
Years ago

United's chosen a good time to hit form. Needed some confidence heading into a 3 game road stretch.

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ME  
Years ago

Wasn't exactly my favorite game. I can't say I have enjoyed many games that involve New Zealand.

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KET  
Years ago

Adelaide have NZ next, that's annoying. NZ are due for a win now

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LV  
Years ago

It's an odd season, not only because of how close it is, but consider that Adelaide and Brisbane both have a better away record than home record.

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Benno  
Years ago

Vukona copped it from the crowd. Dominating win by Melbourne its great to see Perth and NZ playing shit isnt it!

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cats 4 life  
Years ago

Sad for people talking the way they are, Not our fault other clubs couldn't keep up to the standard both teams have set.

I'll be laughing if one of us wins it again.

Perth and Nz not done yet.

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Tom  
Years ago

This would rank with one of the poorest displays a Breakers has ever put on a court in the NBL...........EVER...EVER....EVER.
Defensively we gave up uncontested layups. I have to wonder if some of the players know what a split line is OR help defense. Giving up an extra 20 free throws highlighted our inability to contain Melbourne.
We get no hi post / lo post action when our wing gives up ( after the first glance) on trying to get it into the low block.
Our on-balls are just a mess. Webster fiddles too much and it is impossible for a team mate to anticipate what he might do. Penney lacks the handle and decision making / passing ability to exploit and Abercrombie is low on confidence to auto shoot and also lacks the handles to get to the hoop.
Our offence is cluttered around the 3 point line with no one wide open and generally we end up shooting a contested shot that invariably misses.
There is space a plenty inside but it does not seem a a priority to get it in or it gets to Vukona who is really just looking to pitch it out to a shooter. He is undersized so teams mark him one on one and guard the 3.
Akil Mitchell has size and athleticism but sometimes he thinks he is a guard longing to go coast to coast for a monster jam and most of the time he is just a fouling magnet.
I'm not sure what Stockton's job description is. Is he a shooter, a scorer, a passer, is he supposed to penetrate and dish. He scored a bundle last week in a losing cause and tonight he couldn't throw it in the ocean and what is worse he didn't try to do anything. What is his role? Defensively he doesn't look like he could mark anyone. Ware made him look like a school boy.
Turnovers are contagious and this leads to sinkhole to get out of. This never works out. I honestly don't know what Paul Henare will do or if there is anything he can do. This is not band aid time this is major surgery time. The only saving grace is that we are only a couple of games out of first place.

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Zodiac  
Years ago

The only saving grace is that we are only a couple of games out of first place.


And that you're playing the 36ers next!

Our defensive schemes might help get Abercrombie out of that form slump too ;)

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Ben  
Years ago

I was also watching Webster today thinking how his ball dominance ruins movement and stagnates the offence. Kind of like the NBL's version of Dion Waiters.

Wonder if th Breakers would be bold enough to cut bait when he's off contract.

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LV  
Years ago

Breakers do not have a lot of scoring depth. Of the 4 bigs Mitchell is individually the most dangerous offensively, but he just doesn't appear to be on a level where he can consistently hit 15ppg. Plus, he shares minutes. But none of the 4 bigs will regularly win games with their scoring. This means for NZ to be successful they need big-time scoring from their guards and wings. It isn't happening for Webster, Abercrombie is in a slump and whilst Stockton has shown signs, he hasn't had the impact of the likes of Ware and Trice.

Still, they could all get their confidence back in a game. A quarter even.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Stockton only dribbles on right hand.

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paul  
Years ago

"Breakers do not have a lot of scoring depth."

If you look at the numbers, along with Melbourne the Breakers have the best scoring depth in the league.

NZ's issue is most obviously turnovers and defence. When you keep taking the ball out of the net it puts a lot of pressure on your half-court offence, and when you keep coughing it up it puts a lot of pressure on your transition D.

I wonder how long they persist with Stockton, his defence is a long way off the mark and that leaves the front door open. And while offensively he's a good individual talent, he's not doing a good job of organising their sets and he is turnover prone.

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paul  
Years ago

An interesting note from this game, Melbourne's crowd of 10,300 surpassed Perth's of 10,255 on Thursday.

When was the last time the Wildcats played at home and didn't have the largest crowd of the round? Probably in the Challenge days I'm guessing.

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Wilson Sting  
Years ago

It is clear Webster is the problem with NZ. He exudes a bad attitude, hogs the ball and it puts the guys like Stockton and Mitchell in two minds as to where they should be or what they should be doing.

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LV  
Years ago

What numbers do you use to measure scoring depth, Paul?

I do agree though, that there are several teams without much scoring depth. This is a factor in favour of Mel and Sydney (Lisch and Newley have been a two man show but Cadee will find his stroke again eventually, Whittington and Powell are handy scorers and a new import you would think might replace Blake at some point. Plus Khazzouh, if he returns may add extra scoring punch). You generally need good D *and* good scoring depth to compete for a championship.

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paul  
Years ago

I look at things like number of players scoring above a certain mark.

NZ have five averaging in double figures (more than GSW and SAS have in 48min games)and seven averaging more than 7ppg (more than GSW and same as Spurs), which is outstanding.

Perth and Adelaide are the only teams that I would say lacks scoring depth, but some of the 36ers' young players are starting to contribute more.

Overall, for some time the NBL has been a league with excellent scoring depth due to the even level of talent across rosters and the league.

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paul  
Years ago

... and the fact teams move the ball through hands a lot.

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LV  
Years ago

Overall that's just a function of them playing more guys for more minutes, though. They have 7 players averaging more than 20 minutes a game and 8 playing more than 15 (Those stats are real gm- not including yesterday's game yet).

I haven't checked the numbers but I doubt any/many other NBL teams would have that many guys averaging 20 minutes. It's because NZ lacks depth and doesn't play the kids much. So of course, they will have "scoring depth" if you talk about players scoring 9ppg, 10ppg etc.

My point was more about number of guys who can really step up and score at a high clip. Penney is still a prolific scorer but has slowed down a little compared to last year and is gradually becoming more one dimensional as he loses the ability to score off the dribble, Webster isn't having a good year. Jury still out on Stockton.

Like I said- they may well turn it around. They certainly have talent. But right now, I don't see enough individuals really stepping it up, like say Ware and Goulding have been for Melbourne in different games, Trice for Cairns, etc. Stockton was outstanding against the Hawks on Friday, I did see that game...but still not enough to get them the win.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Rob Loe needs to play more.

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LV  
Years ago

NZ clearly do have issues at both ends of the floor, which is usually the case when a team strings this many losses together.

It will be interesting seeing how they go vs Adelaide. They will feel confident because they destroyed the 36ers last time, and the 36ers are a bit loose defensively. Stockton will want to tighten things up though, going against Randle

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paul  
Years ago

"My point was more about number of guys who can really step up and score at a high clip."

God you make some stuff up in the hope it's right! They've had six players score 20 or more this season and 10 score in double figures.

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LV  
Years ago

No need to be rude- just my perceptions from watching 2-3 games a week- I don't spend my life writing articles and reading stats, so stop being so patronising. I'd much rather be wrong than be a condescending douche.

Having said that, now that I've had a chance to actually look at the stats: Pledger got his sole 20 point performance in an overtime (ie: Extended game, more minutes to get your 20) win over a severely depleted Melbourne. Webster's done it twice, and one of those was in a huge win at home against an undermanned Adelaide. In fact Webster has failed to even score 15 points in all but 3 games. And he's supposed to be their best scorer.

In 8 of NZ's 14 games, no one has scored 20 points. That's a worse percentage of games than almost every other team. This supports my observation that individuals simply haven't been stepping up enough and winning them games. (It's better than Melbourne, but that doesn't count for much since Goulding's missed half the season and Ware has only played 3 games).

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paul  
Years ago

No, that shows they have a spread of scorers, despite having a lot of players capable of scoring a lot of points.

They are third in scoring, first in FG% and first in 3p%. When they execute their offence is the best in the league.

Their problem is they keep turning the ball over too much, and their transition D is poor at covering for those turnovers.

Anyway, I'll leave it at that, and I'll file your NZ don't have scoring depth along with your Sydney then daylight and Illawarra are clearly the worst team in the league!

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Anonymous  
Years ago

I totally agree that their D is weak. I watched both of their games over the weekend. I was only commenting on one thing. Pledger and Vukona aren't talented scorers, Mitchell can tick the scoreboard over a bit but has limited range, so is still fairly one dimensional. Loe is similarly one dimensional, cos all he does is pop 3's. So my view is that the 4 main guys from 1-3 need to seriously step it up for NZ to be successful. Whether that happens, we will see.

I can recall a few weeks ago you raving on about how good NZ are. They've had a better run with injuries than pretty much anyone else, they've had a consistent lineup save for their point guard change, yet they're on a 4 game skid and are currently putting the S in Struggle. So maybe your expect opinions are off the mark sometimes too ;-).

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LV  
Years ago

^ me

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paul  
Years ago

I think I actually said no other team is a clear favourite over Perth and NZ until they show they can beat them in the playoffs due to the sustained success of those two teams.

The four-game losing streak coincides with changing over both their PGs, which is a massive disruption. Same thing is happening with Perth. The Hawks struggled with Norton out.

Cairns is the impressive one in they've produced some very good performances without Trice.

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LV  
Years ago

There's no point worrying about who can beat NZ in the playoffs if, you know, NZ don't even make the playoffs...

Melbourne has won 3 in a row after changing point guards mid season too. (However, admittedly that did coincide with Goulding's return - he has been brilliant).

Still, plenty of teams have performed well in the face of injuries- Cairns, Adelaide being two. When you factor in overall performance alongside disruptions, scheduling etc- NZ has, to this point, been the most disappointing team of the season.

Cairns is indeed the impressive one, though. They are currently in the strongest position of any team, with a 6-6 record and 10 of their remaining 16 games at home. Not bad for the pre season wooden spoon favourites!

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LV  
Years ago

I should add, Cairns is pretty much the only team I haven't really wavered on. They have been rock solid all the way through, even when losing their first 3 games.

Just goes to show, occasionally I do make a smart prediction too ;-)

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paul  
Years ago

Certainly their past four games have been poor, the six games before that they won five and were close to the best team in the comp.

That's the thing with this season, things change quickly, that's why you cop so much for silly comments like Sydney then daylight or Illawarra are clearly the worst team.

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paul  
Years ago

Comment above was about NZ obviously. Yep, Cairns have been solid, but they're right in the pack with everyone else. Two games from top to bottom when we're approaching half way is just ridiculous!

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LV  
Years ago

(Well, I haven't wavered on Melbourne either. It's more that injuries kind of got in the way a bit there. But with a 6 game CG43 winning streak and Ware turning out as good as advertised if not better, things are looking up! Even though DD is still at the helm, they will to the top 4 if Ware keeps playing like this)

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LV  
Years ago

Yes, it is incredibly close but Cairns have had 8 from 12 away games, and their best player Trice missing plenty of games. Plus the guy I consider their second best and second most important player- Jawai- missed games too and took a while to get comfortable. So whilst it is close, they appear in the best position to make a run at a top 2 position from here.

And Cairns have never really had a sustained period where major concerns have arisen about their team. Very few other teams can say the same, in this even league.

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LV  
Years ago

PS: I'm happy copping heat on an internet forum- all good fun for discussion. If daylight becomes the catchphrase of the season, I'll happily take all the credit, all in good fun ;-)

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paul  
Years ago

Melbourne have a big week coming up. They've played 9/13 at home but are 6-7, so you'd think they will have to pinch a number of road wins to make the playoffs.

Dropping two this week would leave them with a big challenge ahead, and while neither Perth or Sydney are full strength or in form, they will be tough to beat.

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LV  
Years ago

Melbourne are still way behind the 8 ball. No doubting that. Despite their 3 wins in a row.

But in their favour- they are 6-2 with Goulding, 3-0 with Ware. At full strength they look a clear top 4 team, so that gives one confidence that they'll get the ones that really matter down the stretch.

Interestingly, away teams have won 21 of 52 games this season. Or 40.4%. That seems high.

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Manu Fieldel  
Years ago

Bolstered by the results these past two weeks

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paul  
Years ago

It is high, and the past two rounds I think it's 6/10 road wins going into tonight's game.

We'll know more about Melbourne after next round. They're good at home with Goulding and Ware, but they'll need to be a good road team to make the playoffs.

No reason they can't be, their possession game stuff is improved on last season and they have great depth.

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