OK so
minimum of 10 home games
1.2 mill cap that does not include admin or coaching salary

so with those included lets say it is 3 coaches and 3 admin for 500k. Sixers current office runs with more but lets say 3 is the magic number.

so 1.7mill in salaries plus 700k annual membership fee means it is now 2.4 mill to run a team . We are yet to cover running costs( flights / accomodation / stadium hire)

So lets leave the cost at 2.4 mill even though it will be higher than that.

Without sponsorship that means you need to generate a net profit of $240,000 per game over 10 games. Adelaide has a stadium of 7500 so that equates to a net profit of $32 per ticket. That is not the cost but the net profit required.

Now lets factor in Stadium hire say a budget deal is struck and you get the 10 games for $20,000 per night that equates to another $200,000 that needs to be covered. And we still have not covered getting the team to away games yet.

Lets hypothosie that we get an amazing team sponsor who drops 1 mill a year for naming rights.

So ball park that leaves 1.6 mill needed over 10 games. $160,000 per game and lets assume that you sell all 7500 seats means you need to make more than $21 per ticket. When was the last time 7500 were at the Dome?

If you use the more common figure of say 5500 this equates to $29 net per ticket

And this still has not covered getting the team to away games yet.

My questions is how the hell is this going to work? how the hell are teams that play out of 3000 seat stadiums going to work? and how much are tickets going to be?

No way will this model work if they only allow 10 home games. Needs to be more like 20 home games to get some scale out of the costs.

This is just a quick synopsis as i see it so in now way does it mean it is how it is. Please feel free to comment or change the figures if i have missed anything

Ten home game season?
Sounds like close to half a season, so I guess the Salary Cap has increased more than face value

So Basically nothing has changed, accept they are just asking if anyone else wants to come in, and there are a few more fees and a higher cap. Sounds like something the NBL would come up with

Annual membership reads collective $700k. Doesn't it?
About $70k per team .. I think

Yeah, that bit seems a bit odd. Reads as though it's $700k from all clubs combined, but is $70k as an annual fee too low?

Even if you ignore that and assume sponsorship could negate coach/support/admin and some other costs, and you try to cover the salary cap with 10 games, that's $120k/game which is 5000 fans at $24 each.

One of the biggest mistakes on that 6 page document is having Chuck Harmison available for questions. In the past 2-4 years he has shown that he is not the right person to be involved in this sort of new venture. It certainly will not bring confidence to investors.

I agree with Ben, I just can't see this working, maybe if someone had a few million to burn, but that would get boring after a while and then where would we be at?

I just wonder if there is anyone in Adelaide that has the funds and the foresight to take this on?

Existing clubs will have to fund(or declare spending

$320,000 more for players
$70-120,000 annual fee(depending on # of team
$300,000 marketing Fee(unsure about this$)


So some $700,000 annually more than this year (officially).
So if no more guaranteed income thats an additional loss to each club of arround 3/4 of Million?

If your a new entity then it will cost you another $1 million for the License

Hard to justify spending if your in Business.

If it is true that all games will be on fox, then it will make it a lot easier for clubs to get sponsorships then it has been in the past couple of years. However I guess you need to look at the economic climate, some AFL teams can't even get sponsorship although they are looking around 1.5m a year compared to around 300k per year for NBL.

Soooooooo, what exactly has BA done to ensure more people go to games in order to cover the additional costs? Higher salary cap means better imports no doubt, but unless someone is tempted away from their NBA contract or a recently retired great comes over, the people who weren't interested in basketball before, or were only interested at one stage aint gonna suddenly turn up. Hows the opening of import restrictions thing going? Oh i know, they'll give away free pizza hut pizzas to 10 lucky people at half time, that'll bring them in.

The secret to a successful national league is in generating interest in it.

The EOI memo talks about the financial requirements, which are important, and states its goals to be:

13. The New NBL will:
a. provide a career path...
b. showcase elite...
c. enhance ....
d. improve facilities...
e. improve links...
f. strenghten....

The NBL still seem to think it is all about basketball. The NBL does not sell basketball just as the A(V)FL does not sell Australian football.



The NBL sells entertainment. Basketball is the medium through which is sells entertainment.

Telstra does not sell phone calls, they sell communication solutions.



I am more interested in how the NBL will market the league and sell entertainment.


Marketing is the key! Who on that board has an MBA or a marketing degree?

I would like to see them go with a Star player option, similar to the A league, where that player is Cap Exempt.

Pay players more ??
Why so more teams can go bust?

Crowds attendances don't cover the cost of running a club.

10 Home games x (additional)2000 @ $10 revenue = $200,000

Even if you could double that then you end up with $400,000 which doesn't cover the Salary cap increase and the anual fee let alonany marketing fee???


Seems very strange , expecting investors to fund this???

I guess '8 teams' was around for a while. So has increase in salary cap, reduction in home games and bank guarantee.
There's been consultation on this, with owners who are paying $1.2m now, and are aware of the above.

Camel 13


It doesn't mention the bank guarantee in the documents?


So there cheating

The documents contain financial guarantees and working capital , that 8 owners would would be aware of and have the means to comply and have been paying paying $1.2m, this season.

Camel 13 where was that?

On nbl.com.au is the statement re finacial gurantees and working capital.

( There has been previous statements that they have been working thru this with all parties , including owners, re 8 teams and fox etc etc... It can't say anything about owners paying a bit more than the salary cap, of course.)

Thanks Camel 31

Sorry for 13

Camel can you post a link to where what you mention is, i cant find it.

Thanks

What I mention is only partly covered by nbl.com.au
' new league underpins future ' In para 6 = financial guarantees and working capital.

Then the rest has been comments over the last few months in relation to working through all this with all parties , including owners.
And, HO , on here that owners have already spent a lot of their own time and money on this, and are not going to walk away from it.

Thanks for clarifying Camel, what i dont understand is that if the model they are proposing is fataly flawed as per the above comments no matter what guarantee or working capital you provide it is still doomed.

Or another way.

If there is not enough money coming in the front door to cover what is going out the back door eventually the funds that are topping the shortfall up will run out or go elsewhere.

I agree with KC and Jack in this instance as there does not seem to be too much to like about where this is all headed.

So you need $1.2m in ticket sales and $1.2m in sponsorship.
My understanding was that were 8 owners aware of this and could comply.

Would the clubs recieve any funds from the potential Fox deal?

"club will have at least 10 home games"

I'd say the above was included as a minimum requirement to guard against situations such as arose in Singapore, where venue availability threw the entire schedule into chaos.

Anyone nominating for a licence must have a venue available for at LEAST 10 games.

I'd assume the number of home games will be similar to this season.

How do we get to the 2.4million for a clubs expenditure?
Most based on the posts here and OZhoops say they are spending that already or more.
This OEI states they will pay $700,000 more than they are currently so you will need aroound a minimum of $3,000,000 of income to make the losses they are making now?

it is a rocky road ahead,it would be a little more comforting if chucky and co weren't steering the ship.

if it is hard for us to be positive imagine how you would be feeling if it was your million dollars they were talking about,those words(1 million dollars) seem to roll off the tongue's of these guy's very easily.

the business world need's to trust the league's people.

where is the new ceo??

like jack toft said it's about business and marketing,but you have to confidence in the people you are investing in!!

Yes Skull

I find it easier to Say 1 mill quickly, glad its not my $

So using a bit of an obscure analogy...

The league are saying we have a road you can come drive on. If you already own a car you dont need a new one just use the one you already have and pay us a toll.
If you dont own a car - but want to use our road we can sell you one for 1 million and you then pay a toll too.
Cars that use too much petrol are not allowed.

Ok thats great - but they dont tell us anything about how they are upgraging/maintaining the road or even where the hell it goes?

So much for a major change.....

Nice work Statman,
but you also missed out that the road may be windy and un-even. Pavement may be missing in some areas and roadworks may be undertaken at any time without notice.

Fiveaa are gonna talk to Gaze about it, ' after 6pm tonight ' ( guess that could be just after 6 or closer to 7 )

i have a picture in my head of pirate chucky with his old headband,eye patch on and steering his
"ship of fools"

So you can put in a non confirming bid.
Clubs that haven't defaulted are in.
Hard to see 36ers etc. not being there or much change, after listening to Gaze.

you know whats crazy about all of this ... the nbl hasn't learnt a thing! FREE to air BASKETBALL is the Key!!! MArketing is another KEY. Its funny, with the A league going well - BA emphasises that they WILL NOT follow the same plan ... fair enough but heck, at least the A leauge is a success.
Max. 2 teams per city. (best is just 1)
Above it was mentioned that BA needs to emphaise the entertainment being offered - i totally agree. basketball venues will get packed if people feel they are being entertained - not just by the basketball but everything else around it (atmosphere, music, prizes ... FUN!!!).

Nic, a while back on here I provided a number of arguments why the a-league is NOT a success. More recent history suggests those arguments to be well founded. The a-league is not yet a success, in fact its far from it, and the signs are that it is rapidly falling in a big big hole...even quicker than I thought it would.

Not a single a-league club is expected to make money this year. That would be zilch....zero.....nada....and that even with the foxtel disbursements they receive.

Sydney is expected to lose millions, Queensland in trouble, the Victory have publically stated they will lose money this season (memberships are WAY below target). Average crowds are in free-fall..something like 20-25% this year. FFA are already rolling out the "apologists" lines.

NRL clubs warned last year that a range of changing conditions threaten their viablity....Melbourne, North Melbourne and one or two other AFL clubs are on league life-support.

Cold hard facts are that professional sport in this country struggles to deliver a return at club level in any code. A $200,000 profit at an AFL club one year is a 1.4 million $ loss the next....most (if not all) NRL clubs are dependent on "leagues club" funding...

If BA are not going to follow the A-league plan, that might well be one of their starter decisions. Not suggesting by any means they have a magic wand, but the a-league model is not the answer.

"The a-league is not yet a success, in fact its far from it, and the signs are that it is rapidly falling in a big big hole...even quicker than I thought it would.

Not a single a-league club is expected to make money this year. That would be zilch....zero.....nada....and that even with the foxtel disbursements they receive.

Sydney is expected to lose millions, Queensland in trouble, the Victory have publically stated they will lose money this season (memberships are WAY below target). Average crowds are in free-fall..something like 20-25% this year. FFA are already rolling out the "apologists" lines."

You've made my day :D

14 Home games is the perfect number IMO. It can also still be played over 18 weeks.

8 Team League
Everyone plays each other four time. 2 games away, 2 games at home.
6 Games are played each week.
Keep the Wednesday Night Game.
If NZ is stil in, Keep their Thursday Game too.
2 Friday Night Games
2/3 Saturday Night Games
and 4 Sunday Afternoon games too. (The last Sunday of each month)
If no NZ, Have a Sunday game every week.
Playoffs would be final 4.
1 v 4 - Best of Three
2 v 3 - Best of Three
Winners Playoff in Best of Five Grand Final.
------------------------------------------------------
10 Team League
Everyone plays each other 3 times with one extra game between arch rivals. (Adelaide v Perth, Melb v South etc) or the game could be between who you finished next too on the ladder the previous season (1v2, 3v4 etc)
7/8 games are played each week
Wednesday
Thursday if NZ are in.
2 Friday games
3 Saturday games
1 Sunday game
If no NZ, then an extra Friday game.
The following season, the schedule is flipped. SO if you played one team twice away and once at home, next season would be twice at home and once away.
Playoffs are the same except have 4th play 5th first in a one game knockout first.

---------------------------------------------------
If Fox are only willig to Broadcast 4 or 5 gams a week, then so be it. But it doesn't mean we should only play 4 or 5 games a week.

If what I heard about Fox on-selling games to ONE HD is true, then get ONE-HD to broadcast 2 games a week (Fri & Sat) with Fox showing most of the rest.

Where possible, try to schedule TV double headers with an East coast game followed by the Perth game or a delayed telecast of another game.

Save teams money on flights by scheduling in the Doomsday Double, Sunshine Swing, Melbourne teams double etc.

Bring back an NBL Wrap type show. Have it premiere on Fox with it being shown on ONE HD a day or two later.

Fox shows all the playoff games live, with ONE HD showing them again 1 hour after they have finished.

Im tired.... need sleep....

what ever way the new league is set up,it needs to keep in mind the cost of entry for families in particular.
it all revolves around how much you pay the players to how much you charge entry to if you are profitable.
sure you can charge the courtside punters whatever but mum,dad,and the kids up in the stands have to be targeted by the newbl.

skip...the 90's history of the legaue suggests that average crowd numbers vary but aggregate crowd numbers rarely do.

So when Sydney in the heyday was drawing 50,000 fans per year, it was doing that whether they played 10 home games or 15....

Similar for the old Tigers/magic etc.

This fundamental will have changed in the noughties due to tiny venues for Tigers etc.

My view has been that the NBL in recent years has too many games, and venue availability means that games will be bunched together making them difficult to market etc.

From a venue economics point of view, and putting aside the Tigers and perhaps Perth, the league is better off scheduling a 9-11 home game season...it adds up to...

- a better chance of getting key games on better dates at busy venues (hisense, SEC (if), BCC (if), TEC etc
- a better chance at marketing critical games properly...allowing a build up to games, particularly big derbies
- less time in travel and therefore more realistic opportunities for the community connection everyone claims is so important
- a genuine chance for clubs to break even on home games with bigger average crowds

The world's most "in demand" professional sporting code, the NFL, plays just an 8 game home season, and that under exposure drives demand.

Your model of 14 games in 18 weekends would be disastrous IMO....families will not pay week in/week out to got to games, cause they simply cannot afford it, and they get bored with the product...its in oversupply.

9 games in 18 weekends would be radical, but much more affordable. 11 probably sustainable.

Spose if it's 11 games @ about $25 a ticket here.

I did look at ozhoops once , about a year ago ,but they seemed a bit outta date with their info, and behind hoops sa..

If they are still saying $700,000 per team for membership.. they should read, on here...

they are not saying 700,000 per team for membership.

the original unifcation documents talked about a structure where the NBL clubs paid 40% of the fees payable to BA. The states currently contribute (combined) less than 1 million (i've mentioned here before that when you break that down on a per capita basis that its a pitiful amount per player and one of the key reasons BA has no money).

so the nbl clubs will be contributing 700,000 combined.