Anonymous
Years ago

Summer season, phases etc

Hi can someone tell me how long summer season will work? from my understanding the club nominates teams for each division then the phases relegate and promote teams through inter divisional groupings A-D?

My question is how many games for the summer season and how many phases? Also at the end of summer, why does summer phasing determine where team will be division wise? Surely the club should get the opportunity to nominate new teams for winter? Should summer not be experimental?

Topic #29162 | Report this topic


,  
Years ago

usually summer is around 15 rounds - no finals for pro/rel groups but finals for those with mot.

starts around second week of october and finishes late feb / mid march.

around 6 weeks off for christmas.

pro/rel is usually for div 3 and below teams - there is no div 4-5-6 all.

a good div 3 team will nominate for pool A and i think it is based on previous results in the lowe age group as evidence.

a div 6 would say nominate for pool d or e.

each pool plays around 4-5 games (each other once) then the top 2 from teh pool move up - i.e from D to C pool and the bottom 2 move down - after several rounds the comp sorts itself out for winter gradings

Reply #377186 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Clubs have proven time and time again that they should not have the power to nominate where teams play.

Reply #377191 | Report this post


,  
Years ago

should be pro / rel accross the board.

agreed with previous statement - some clubs are realistic and put their teams in relevant divisions.

more likely to get more from these kids long term

some others do not - get flogged and kids quit after one / two seasons.

pride before the fall

Reply #377194 | Report this post


,  
Years ago

should be if a team gets lower than 33% - i.e one third of their opponents score and does win 10% of games 1 in 10(none by forfeit) - moved down a grade - no questions - just do it.

if a team wins 90% of their games and has % greater than 150 (ie 1.5 times opponents) in the division lower than this team they should be offered their place.

if the team does not have this strong record - they do not go up and the division above relegates the poor team and that comp plays with one less team.

Reply #377195 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

I saw some pretty lopsided scores over the season in various grades seems mostly U16 down. When you say "Clubs have proven time and time again that they should not have the power to nominate where teams play." is it just the putting teams not capable of matching it in higher divisions or also the other way around?

Reply #377196 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

It is both - but more often a club exposing players to a level in which they cannot compete.
I am not singling out one or two clubs - a majority of them have done it over the last few years in one grade or another.
The grading phases have helped remove most of the "lowballing to win a title" efforts in the lower age groups - but these did occur in the past (or clubs sometimes had no concept of how strong a team is comparitively to others around it).

Unfortunately, the end result too often is that a clubs pride is put before the development of it's players, who often end up quitting due to copping beltings more often than not.
I'm not talking about finishing bottom - someone has to - but where they routinely lose by 30+ points.

Reply #377206 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Just came across this one. West U12 div 2 boys.

0-18 on the season. For 136 (avg 7), against 1117 (avg 62) for a total F/A % of 12.

Can't help but feel that club has done them a disservice by playing them in a completely inappropriate grade, as well as those clubs who have strong div 3 teams (I think div 3 sides came 5th & 6th at state champs) by not allowing those kids to play at an appropriate grade.

Reply #377241 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Wow, yeah I saw the last game for these guys 18 against Sturt 99, the kids kept trying and behaved well unlike Sturt gloating in bloated distate.

U16 Dv2 Woodville Warriors
0-15 loss plus 3 forfeit. For 252 (avg 36) Against 1325(avg 88)for a total F/A of 19.02%

And before people get uppity I'm neither a disgruntled parent or ex Sturt anything or the likes, but a bystander who takes great interest in junior district ball. IMO from several seasons of watching with interest Sturt who had nothing to gain from that onslaught other than demoralising young kids, disregarded sportsmanship and continued its reputation within the District Community.

Reply #377269 | Report this post


My Europa  
Years ago

So perhaps they shouldnt be in that grade.If they were in the appropriate grade it wouldnt happen.

WHy should Sturt pull back and stop trying when people like you would just bitch about them not trying and treatng them like jokes.

And if Sturt teams stopped trying each time they won by heaps they would create a habit of not trying and ont create the success they have.

Its an elite competition and if you dont like it you should drop down into a grade where you are ocmpetitive.

Reply #377280 | Report this post


Anon  
Years ago

Well stated!

There are no mercy rules in District competition. If you want someone to stop scoring then put up some defense.

These lopsided contests happen in Div 1 because some teams clearly do not belong there. The top teams in Div 2 would be more competitive... Hang on - this is Pro/Rel.

Reply #377310 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Anonymous - I would say it is West who is demoralising these young Bearcats, not Sturt. It is not Sturt who is exposing these boys to a level of competition they are not able to match - it is West.

But hey, keep making it all about Sturt with your blinkered jealous vision, instead of the topic at hand...

Reply #377320 | Report this post


Jack Toft  
Years ago

, "some clubs are realistic and put their teams in relevant divisions. more likely to get more from these kids long term some others do not - get flogged and kids quit after one / two seasons. pride before the fall"

You are quite correct with that statement. Player turnover is a cancer at clubs. I looked at a group of kids from U12 to U16 and there was a strong correlation between success and retention. The top 3 teams had much higher retention rates (80%) than the next 3 and the bottom 4 teams basically had a 20% retention rate.

Some say it's chicken and egg scenario as well. Is player turnover a symptom, or an issue? The more success, the more motivated players are to continue, whereas the lack of success means lower motivation, breeds dis-interest, they quit and other players need to be found. New players need to catch up to teams that have been together since U10, they can't, a spiral of doom starts.

The best games are those close, tightly fought games. Players never learn by getting whipped by 50 points a game week in week out.

Reply #377324 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Agree partially, Yes the team shouldn't be in that Division so how come Pro/Rel didn't work in this Division? If BSA step in Pro/Rel two teams a division and then what? convert their games played to a bye and stuff ladder for those that played them?
I've seen that happen and that isn't exactly fair there's a division this season where I think 10 teams where one dropped out and was replaced 5 teams had wins converted to byes and lost points, 5 other teams got to play a full 18 games.

To those of you who agree with no mercy rule you should be ashamed of yourself not a fine example to set children no SPORTSMANSHIP.
This is not WAR or ABL this is JUNIOR competition, sure if getting that score means scraping into finals so be it. The example given Sturt are top by 6pts + and I'm sure the gloaters are saying and that's why they are top so I say when did you become a monster and choose success at the expense of children's well being. These children are NOT professionals, neither teams gained any real experience from a game like that, I wonder if the coach even tried to implement a strategy like lets see if we can get the ball to X to shoot for practice to even provide or practice running set plays.. Hmmm I doubt it.

Reply #377325 | Report this post


Jack Toft  
Years ago

But with one club, it is "WAR"

Reply #377333 | Report this post


Hopscotch  
Years ago

This is the "elite" junior competition. These kids are representing our state at National championships. and if they under perform at these tournaments, coaches and players miss out on National opportunities.

The people at fault are the ones who not only nominate team for a division that they are not able to compete in. But then are deciding that the second dv 2 teams should move down to div 3 for home and away. Meaning there will be more blow outs.

If people want a low cost, friendly competition, they should go to a domestic competition, or nominat in an acceptable grade.

Reply #377334 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Um why do we keep blaming the club nominations? isn't summer Pro/Rel responsible for determining where a team sits? so why all of a sudden do we get issues like this occur in winter?

Hopscotch no one here has complained about cost and demands friendly competition? Sportsmanship is about respect and Responsibility, I take it you would be quite comfortable to have your child on the receiving end of a thrashing? what wise words would you impart to your child after that?

Reply #377341 | Report this post


Hopscotch  
Years ago

anon,

Pro/rel doesn't go to div 2 which is where the main problem exists.

I wouldn't be putting them into a grade they werent capable in, in the first place. No problem if they came bottom if they have a good games each week and won a couple here and there.

I would talk to my club about grading them reasonably, and not persisiting with a philosophy that obviously doesn't work.

I would explain to my child that sometimes there are winner and losers and that this shows they need to work harder on their game and do a better job at training of listening to their coach. and that obbviously the other teams does a better job of that.



Reply #377349 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

When does summer season start?

Reply #377377 | Report this post


Anon  
Years ago

and when does it end so we can get on with the competition that counts?

Reply #377395 | Report this post


,  
Years ago

first or second weekend after the october long weekend

Reply #377400 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Haha anyone who believes the SA junior competition is Elite is absolutely kidding themselves.

Reply #377403 | Report this post


Phases r crap  
Years ago

Phases r crap in men's comp. Doesn't matter where u come u r still asked to nominate. Can basically play where u like. BSA don't care as long as the $ role in. U basically play the crap phase system cause u enjoy playing. But competition wise, complete balls up! Will it ever change probably not. Will they ever listen. Probably not. Was there anything wrong with the old comp, no pools, no phases , a season just like winter and finals, few games shorter, no. So why change it? Cause it worked I guess.

Reply #377468 | Report this post




You need to be a registered user to post from this location. Register here.



Close ads
Little Streaks - The fun and interactive good-habits app designed especially for kids.
Serio: Tourism photography and videography

Advertise on Hoops to a very focused, local and sports-keen audience. Email for rates and options.

Recent Posts



.


An Australian basketball forum covering NBL, WNBL, ABL, Juniors plus NBA, WNBA, NZ, Europe, etc | Forum time is: 8:45 pm, Fri 29 Mar 2024 | Posts: 968,026 | Last 7 days: 754