Anonymous
Years ago

To 36ers and BSA: please reschedule juniors

We all know this is the biggest game of the season this Friday.
Dean you need to ask BSA to transfer this Friday games to Sunday,just for this once,BSA transfer games wont lose any money.

I hope you Dean ,a passionate basketball manager,put this matter on top of your agenda on Monday morning,i like to see sellout at the Dome,first time we hope to achieve this since Brett Mahers last game.

Get more people come to game this Friday ,get publicity like Adelaide United has done.Big game Friday.

Topic #33148 | Report this topic


Anonymous  
Years ago

Agreed!!

Reply #445446 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

It's been explained many time before on here why they don't move games and the fact BSA does actually lose money.

Reply #445448 | Report this post


Hendo8888  
Years ago

There's no way they are going to change a schedule 5 days before the game.

Reply #445450 | Report this post


Isaac  
Years ago

Why not email them directly?

Reply #445457 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

re-schedule 200 games for the benefit of one..makes sense..

Reply #445459 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

1)Read the NBL draw way ahead
2)Schedule junior games differently.
3)Offer the U12 and U14s discounted family tickets.

Reply #445461 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Its only one game not asking for whole season change
Reschedule to sunday isnt too hard to do just change time if game at 6pm change to 830am its easy ,how they lose money i have no idea.

Even my 8 year old son can change schedule in 3 hours .The problem with this BSA organising schedules,is that they are lazy,an inside source told me they dont do much in the office everyday.Guys like Neal and Mike never been to a Sixers game.if they have the passion like Dean they would change.

Reply #445463 | Report this post


Jack Toft  
Years ago

448,
That is a myth that is wrong. Please provide additional information. There have been come who claim BSA would lose $20K per reschedule - to those I say "please provide the numbers to backup your ridiculous claims". Even if they "lose money" it shows that they have very poor accounting methods in place to recover their costs.

I assume the latent claim is based on the loss of court hire for club training. We have also heard outrageous claims on here previously that BSA over schedule games at Wayville because "they don't pay court hire"

Let's get this straight. BSA have long term court hire contracts on several stadiums. They pay $X/yr to secure the stadiums. Now, any competent organisation seeks to secure revenue of $X + % on that investment. Anyone who has a departmental budget to manage or their own business knows that if you pay an employee $30/hr you have to pay Super, uniform, tools, computing, phone etc and by the time you take out the AL, LSL, training days, SL, PH, you need to charge them out at around $70/hr to recover costs, $75/hr to make any money. Let's not forget you can't charge out every single hour, so there is usually a downtime % to be considered.

BSA need to be doing the same if they do not already.

The competitions committee organise the games. The nomination fee of around $200/team/season should cover the court hire for the season. If the going rate is $35/hr for court hire, then for a 13 game season the fee should be 13 x 35 = $455/2 teams/80% = $284/season. If BSA have secured a long term deal and can charge themselves for less than that rate, then they still need to charge out stadium hire at a commercial rate, not at a rate of $20/hr because that it what is costs them.

The same with court hire for training. If BSA are only charging out court hire at a rate less than commercial rates then they are only setting themselves up for a fall. In determining the rate a certain inefficiency needs to be taken into consideration. That is normal business practice. If BSA secure stadiums for a rate less than commercial rates, they still need to charge out stadiums at commercial rates. It's like a business securing a good deal on goods and then selling those goods to customers at the same deal. The business needs to make a margin on that deal and so do BSA.

At the end of the day, the claim that BSA lose money is incorrect. What is correct is that BSA have a reduction in their opportunity to recover costs.

Reply #445465 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Well said Jack Toft...........BSA losing money is incorrect.

Reply #445467 | Report this post


Eastern Mavericks  
Years ago

Nomination fee is not for court hire, it is for admin costs of administering the competition. The fee for entry to play at each game covers the court hire and cost of referees.

By moving games to Sunday, the same "game revenue" is still gained as would be the case from a Friday night game. However, revenue from training hire for Sunday's is lost as the games replace them.

Reply #445472 | Report this post


Isaac  
Years ago

Difference in bar/canteen revenue potentially too? Plus notifying all parents/players concerned at short notice.

It's possible that the 36ers are well aware of this scheduling issue in advance but know that Friday games are usually televised and might be worth taking for that alone as a means of getting sponsors in front of a larger audience.

Reply #445473 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Also, lots of people have other things they do on Sundays and would not be able to play/coach/referee.

Would be forfeits everywhere and BSA would not be able to then charge clubs for these forfeits and would need to reschedule all those games.

Reply #445478 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Typical sooky minority trying to get things changed to suit them at the expense of the majority...

Reply #445481 | Report this post


Annon  
Years ago

GAMES ARE RESCHEDULED EVERY SUMMER DUE TO HEAT POLICY !!!!!

Reply #445489 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Jack that was nonsense.

It is you that has no understanding.

Nice try.

Reply #445495 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

True, games are cancelled on the day for the heat policy.
I say the 6ers are HEATING UP so come on people lets do it.
Not as if we are cancelling for netball, we are all basketball

Reply #445498 | Report this post


catching fire  
Years ago

heat policy is well explained and expected.

what about refs availability, other family plans, travel plans etc

wont happen

Reply #445503 | Report this post


Jack Toft  
Years ago

495, nice to see you attempting to contribute to the debate, albeit without actually explaining your position. What part of the discussion do you have trouble comprehending?

It's very simple.

BSA secure courts at an annual rate. They pay $X/yr regardless of use. They need to recover that cost plus a bit over the duration of the year. They recover those costs by hiring out the stadiums for games, trainings and events. Although they have secured the stadiums at a good rate, hey need to hire out the stadiums at commercial rates to make the deal worthwhile. This includes game nights as well.

Therefore, knowing the actual cost of the court hire, knowing the commercial rate, BSA then need to determine a minimum number of hours they need to charge that stadium out over the duration of the year. With court hire, it is unrealistic to assume a 100% charge out rate of the available courts. When preparing the operating budget for a court or stadium, BSA need to allow for a % of downtime in the budget.

495, I know you are trying to defend a position, but either you have not been involved in financial aspects of a business, or are playing dumb. Consider a electrician. You pay say $80/hr for a electrician, but that doesn't mean they get $166,000/yr as they can't charge out 100% of their time. At best they charge out say 75% of their time meaning they bring in around $125,000/yr and by the time you take out the overheads, they probably get paid $60K. If you need a 100% charge out to recover costs, then you are coin g it wrong.

495, consider your own working position. How does you employer recoup the cost of employing you? Those days you are on AL, PH, SL, LSL and not bringing in any revenue need to be accounted for in the OPEX budget. Those days you are spent in training or other administrative tasks need to be considered.

To claim BSA lose money on reschedules is bad accounting. I reinforce that it is not money that BSA lose, it is the opportunity to make money.

Reply #445517 | Report this post


HO  
Years ago

Its an interesting/implied notion here that the needs of the privately run (for profit) NBL club should take precedence over the regular activity of the not-for-profit junior competition.

Is there not an equally compelling argument that if the Sixers want to take advantage of this then they should ask the league to reschedule their game?

I acknowledge Isaac's point about the Sixers knowing in advance the clash and the possibility that the value of their sponsor and on-air recognition might outweigh the crowd value.

Reply #445518 | Report this post


Camel 31  
Years ago

Be good if a hot day was forecast for Friday.
A little bit of excitement and build up here.

Reply #445521 | Report this post


paul  
Years ago

I love the bit about the club being run for profit!

Reply #445522 | Report this post


Isaac  
Years ago

Onus should be on the 36ers to either reschedule or provide an incentive for juniors to adjust to suit them.

Reply #445527 | Report this post


Jack Toft  
Years ago

Isaac, I think that is true. The Sixers and BSA need to find some common ground and negotiate from there. If the NBL has a generic schedule of four games per round, 1 x Fri night, 2 x Sat night, 1 x Sun afternoon, then one should expect 25% of the games to be held on a Friday night. (I know that is not 100%), therefore the Sixers should play 25% on Friday night which means then play say 1 in 8 games at the Dome on a Friday, which is say 3 or 4 per season. With clever programming some could be scheduled in school holidays leaving 2 "clashes" to be resolved

Reply #445530 | Report this post


KB3  
Years ago

BSA couldnt catch a cold at a child care centre.
No capacity for them nor the inclination to help out the 36ers who largely inspire kids to play the game in the 1st place

Reply #445532 | Report this post


ricey  
Years ago

I remember when in under 14s we would have games postponed with a weeks notice at the most because of a 36ers clash. Nobody would moan because we got to go see the big boys play and have a good time. Also, the games would be played weeks later at a weekend date I'm guessing that wasn't being utilised. What the hell happened to juniors and BSA from 11/12 years ago? People got lazy and complacent that's all. I'm sure Dean would love to be able to make this happen, but let's be honest this is out of his hands really, and I'm sure he's probably tried to organise stuff for the crossovers in advance.

Also people who think its about a private company taking on BSA, it benefits them both in the long run and if BSA don't see that, then they are idiots

Reply #445535 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Why is the onus on BSA?

Sixers know the BSA schedule when they approve the NBL schedule. Sixers should ensure the only Friday nights games are during school holidays.

Sixers didn't so they're the ones to blame.

Reply #445536 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

LOL, the 36ers inspire kids to take up basketball?
Kids want to be the next Lebron, not the next Jason Caddee!

Reply #445541 | Report this post


Playmakermo  
Years ago

Am I missing something here?

36ers were aware of the NBL schedule, BSA were aware of the NBL schedule, and with a little motivation any hoops poster could have cross-referenced the juniors/NBL schedules and phoned BSA over a month ago about postponing Friday games. Instead we have a thread less than one week before the clash...

If you have an issue with this but failed to do anything but whinge at the 11th hour, you're just as lazy as those you criticize.

Reply #445546 | Report this post


Isaac  
Years ago

I don't get the impression that the 36ers (currently and historically) have gone out of their way to provide for local clubs so there might be animosity which is hard to build past. Gets to be very much a "what's in it for us" situation and no one wins there until one side makes consistent sacrifices to win over this generation of administrators.

Maybe the Sixers need to go to BSA/clubs and say "We want Friday to be basketball night in Adelaide. Getting TV games helps us a lot. What can we do to make it worth your while?"

And maybe the answer is player appearances, affiliate system for ticket sales, free promos, district game at half-time or beforehand, etc.

I've been surprised to never see clubs solidly promoting their intake at 36ers games. Want to play basketball? Find out which club is nearest you and try out, or join the domestic comp, or play social, etc.

Reply #445576 | Report this post


HO  
Years ago

I agree it might be a lofty goal Paul, but if it happens I am guessing they will take it!

Reply #445593 | Report this post


catching fire  
Years ago

it was worth a shot but logistics just too much.

a bit more time and maybe it could have happened.

Reply #445594 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Hopefully it will be 40 degrees on Friday!

Reply #445597 | Report this post


Dr6  
Years ago

http://www.basketballsa.com.au/index.php?id=62&tx_ttnews%5Btt_news%5D=880&cHash=e74ac10d96

Reply #445600 | Report this post


Isaac  
Years ago

Recent media reports noted that Basketball SA had received a formal request from the 36ers management on the weekend to reschedule games for this Friday in an effort to increase fan availability and ticket sales to this weeks' double header blockbuster games featuring Adelaide Lighting Vs Bendigo Spirit and Adelaide 36ers Vs Perth Wildcats. We wish to notify everyone that after giving the matter consideration, Basketball SA will not be rescheduling District games to accommodate this request.
More info at the link above.

Reply #445619 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

"The problem with this BSA organising schedules,is that they are lazy,an inside source told me they dont do much in the office everyday.Guys like Neal and Mike never been to a Sixers game"

Pathetic they don't do much PLUS never been to a Sixers game? What sort of bball ppl are they.

Reply #445622 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

ffs sake..don't bleat about BSA causing the MOTR clash with juniors..let's talk about the Sixers requesting appropriate schedules with the NBL..

Reply #445629 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

They left it till the weekend to ask? Did someone in the 36ers office only look at the schedule this week? Absolutely horrible work by management.

Reply #445630 | Report this post


Camel 31  
Years ago

36ers beat NZ on Friday, I'm glad they made a formal request to see if the kids wanted to see them, but seems no interest.

Reply #445649 | Report this post


well im confussed  
Years ago

what does the scheduling of games have to do with the referee director and referee rosterer and development officer? or is it that these are the only two names you know from BSA and want to sound important?

as for their passion for the great game of basketball, havent seen many people put in over 40 years to keep this great sport alive. if you would like to keep this great sport alive then there are many courses available for you to further your basketball education and help continue to have an important input into the game.

Reply #445708 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

NO point of advocating anymore BSA didnt take Deans request,heard Hubbard had a plan but didnt want Sixers to interfere with Juniors.Only 5000 expected Friday ,so much hype leading up to game only to be setback by a MONEY HUNGRY BSA

Reply #445790 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

I can't believe I am actually saying this.........well done BSA for not bowing down to the minority who expects the whole world to revolve around them.

Reply #445791 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Well I hope that the posters that are happy that the juniors weren't rescheduled won't complain about the crowd figure.

If you find asking yourself where is everyone when you are at the game then the answer will be that they are at junior basketball

Reply #445794 | Report this post


Muzz Buzz  
Years ago

who is the minority anon 791 ? just confused by your post

Reply #445797 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Sad state of basketball in Australia when juniors are considered higher priority than the professional game.

Reply #445799 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Juniors obviously aren't a higher priority than the 6ers but I'm not going to say to my kids that they can't play Friday night as we are going to the 6ers instead.

Reply #445807 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Has any other state postponed games due to an NBL clash?

Some of you need a little perspective.

Reply #445816 | Report this post


KB3  
Years ago

BSA are incompetent on too many levels to even acknowledge that the 36ers are an important part of the Basketball landscape in this state.

Every level of the sport is run like it is still 1955 in this state

Reply #445818 | Report this post


Jack Toft  
Years ago

KB3, It's the enchantment under the sea dance this Saturday night, see you there, except if you have a de Loreon and 1.21 giga watts of power, then I'll see you in 1985, or 1885 if I get struck by lightning.

Reply #445826 | Report this post


Annon  
Years ago

Game is delayed on One HD at 9.30pm. Invite the team back to your place for a fun night. Have parents drop them off with a plate of supper, a sleeping bag, pillow and a foam mat for a sleepover and team bonding night. Go Sixers, and don't
Let the score out on the way......

Reply #445852 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

The only people who think the 36ers matter more than juniors are people not involved in basketball other than watching the 36ers.

Tasmania doesn't have an NBL team but manages to produce Olympic players.

ACT doesn't have an NBL team but manages to produce Olympic players.

Victoria has more kids playing basketball than football yet hardly supports NBL teams at all.

Screw around the junior basketball in this state and you will have an even greater move from the sport. Where will the 36ers be then???

NBL is no where near important because they don't get kids into playing basketball. Junior basketball gets kids into supporting the 36ers.

Reply #445918 | Report this post


PeterJohn  
Years ago

I can't believe there are people saying that watching an entertainment show based on a game of sport is a higher priority than playing the sport itself. Wow!

And Jack, I have to say, much as I agree with your arguments about good financial management, your basic argument is - BSA should act like a business. If they do that, then they make the commercial decision not to disrupt their business when there is no commercial imperative to do so. Why would a business risk disgruntled customers and potential revenue loss if there is no need to?? Arguments about size of consequence (i.e., whether or not they would really lose revenue) are irrelevant. If there is a risk of adverse consequence associated with rescheduling and none associated with not rescheduling, you don't reschedule.

Reply #446006 | Report this post


Barry  
Years ago

HaHaHaHa!!!!!! just shows how out of touch with reality the regular hoops posters are !
You could call all junior games off and i guarantee 99 % of those kids and parents would take the opportunity to have a night off from Bball and stay home !!
Give us cheaper tickets , edible food at a decent price or even a match program so we at least know who our year in year out players are and you might get a bigger crowd.
It is tough enough dealing with the junior basketball programming as it is without the hoopsters calling for changes so they can feel all warm and fuzzy about sixers crowd numbers

Reply #446014 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Sixers fans need to realise that they are the small blip on the basketball radar in this state, not juniors.

Reply #446028 | Report this post


Camel 31  
Years ago

I seem to recall that I would rather play than watch

My son can watch NBA on his phone and training next to Lightning was not pleasant, unforunately

Still glad 36ers asked the question

Reply #446072 | Report this post


Isaac  
Years ago

Reply #446348 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Love how he uses this to further his dislike of BSA.

How about the fact the Sixers accepted the Schedule with the Friday games against junior basketball in the first place? Why aren't the Sixers held accountable for that?

Reply #446368 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

The reasons Boti sooked about are the exact reasons BSA made the right decision. Why should the vast majority of 1500 members be put out to silence the whinging minority who want it both ways??

Reply #446373 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Boti has no idea! He tipped his daughters ABA team to make the finals last year! Won one game and he lost all credibility, yet he bags Steve Carfino

Reply #446378 | Report this post


Isaac  
Years ago

Why aren't the Sixers held accountable for that?
Because it's TV related and Boti gave them a fair serve on other issues (not going through with appearances, etc).
Why should the vast majority of 1500 members be put out to silence the whinging minority who want it both ways??
Read it again. He explained why it was in the interests of both parties.

'378, wow, that's a credible argument built on all of one irrelevant thing. Well done.

Reply #446379 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

But that's it - it's NOT in the interest of both parties. BSA get nothing out of moving juniors, not only that, they lose something.
Just becasue Boti says it doesn't make it so.

Reply #446385 | Report this post


Isaac  
Years ago

Professional leagues and the success of them in general drive interest in the sport. They provide pathways for young players, inspiration or initial interest to play. Not the be all and end all, but a big part of it.

The issue is that while the 36ers will feel a few hundred missing people immediately and so have a more urgent need to do something, junior administrators wouldn't notice the impact for a long time. The impetus isn't there. It's not like the 36ers do everything in their power (AFAIK) to prop up that BSA end of the equation either - the two sides can ultimately help each other.

As I've said already, though I have no current interest in juniors, I don't blame BSA for not moving games and think it's the 36ers who should be making the conciliatory moves first. Make it worth their while now, not hope they consider the sport as a whole.

But Boti's point is that they should be working together and make a short term concession in that interest whoever is asked.

Reply #446389 | Report this post


Barry  
Years ago

these threads are tiresome !
there are thousands and thousands of people in Adelaide that could be at the sixers tonight - leave the junior comp alone !!

Reply #446396 | Report this post




 

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