Mystro
Years ago

Cedric Jackson interested in playing for TallBlacks

The night after he sunk the Wildcats with a half court heave on the buzzer, Cedric Jackson has publicly expressed his desire to play internationally for New Zealand. He made the comments on the Campbell Live current affairs television show and they have been backed up again in the media with comments from Breakers Boss Richard Clarke saying the club is hopeful of fast tracking his residency.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/basketball/news/article.cfm?c_id=21&objectid=11403148


Topic #36511 | Report this topic


paul  
Years ago

Would make the TB's legit.

Adams/Pledger/Loe
Vukona/Fotu
Abercrombie/Henry/Te Rangi
C Webster/T Webster
Jackson/Tait

I've heard Penney may be done internationally, though that hasn't been confirmed, so left him out for now.

Reply #515921 | Report this post


GWB  
Years ago

When are the Aus/NZ squads announced?

Reply #515925 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

henry and trangi wont be playing for the tb's

Reply #515932 | Report this post


Mystro  
Years ago

Penney has been a bit up & down in Spain where as Isaac Fotu has been consistently solid.
Wouldn't be surprised if Penney retired from international basketball & to be honest Vukona probably isn't far behind him.

A full strength Tall Blacks side with Jackson steering the ship would spoil a few teams tournaments and would most definitely be "legit".

Reply #515933 | Report this post


Uwe Blab  
Years ago

Is Vukona the most-capped player, or is that just in NBL live scores?

Reply #515934 | Report this post


Mystro  
Years ago

a single conviction as an under 20yo is not the end of TeRangi's international career Anon.

Reply #515936 | Report this post


paul  
Years ago

Haha!

I think Vukona will play through 2016 as he has never played at an Olympics and they're a huge shot at qualifying one way or the other.

He was also the TB's second best player in Spain and still arguably the most important given how good his D is amongst a mostly inexperienced frontcourt.

Reply #515937 | Report this post


Tornado  
Years ago

CJ will make the TB's better no doubt but what do you mean exactly by legit?

Reply #515940 | Report this post


paul  
Years ago

Well, they've been a top 16 team consistently, but if they have Jackson and Adams with their good young core I see no reason they couldn't go even better.

The line-up I listed above, with good coaching, is at the level of the majority of good international teams.

Reply #515941 | Report this post


paul  
Years ago

I should say 'will be at the level of most good international teams by 2016'.

Reply #515942 | Report this post


Tornado  
Years ago

Even with those additions I cant see them beating Australia who I dont see as being legit either.

Reply #515948 | Report this post


KET  
Years ago

The problem for NZ is Australia is getting better as well, NZ might still need to get into major tournaments through alternative means than Oceania Cup

Reply #515954 | Report this post


paul  
Years ago

NZ have long been better against European teams than against Australia. It's a bad match-up for them, Aussie are used to the point of difference that makes them difficult on the international stage.

I wouldn't write off their chance of beating Australia altogether (who knows which players will be available for each team), but I would give them a solid chance of getting through the repechage with a full team.

The one question mark is how well they replace a superb coach in Vucinic.

Reply #515956 | Report this post


PlaymakerMo  
Years ago

I was under the impression that the Tall Blacks (marginally) over-achieved at the 2014 World Champs. While they might improve with CJ, I can't get over the "legit" tag. Are they likely to beat a handful of these nations in a row?

Argentina
France
Russia
Lithuania
Turkey
Croatia
Serbia
Slovenia
Greece
Angola... ;)

I'd still find it difficult to definitively justify ranking New Zealand above Finland, Puerto Rico, Mexico, Brazil etc. Top 8 is their ceiling, IMO.

Reply #515965 | Report this post


paul  
Years ago

Top 8 is legit for mine.

Reply #515966 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

There probably should be a 30 for 30 doc on the Tall Blacks finishing 4th in the 2002 World Champs.

Just amazing.

Reply #515968 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Why do NZers made these threads its just retarded.. and im a kiwi

Reply #515987 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

I'd still find it difficult to definitively justify ranking New Zealand above Finland, Puerto Rico, Mexico, Brazil etc. Top 8 is their ceiling, IMO.

Finland, Puerto Rico and Mexico? Really? New Zealand thrashed Finland without Steven adams..

Also neither New Zealand nor Australia is better than Brazil, they have 14 NBA Players

Reply #515988 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

scratch that ^ brazil has 9 NBA players, 5 unactive

Reply #515989 | Report this post


paul  
Years ago

Just to clarify what I mean by legit, I see the top tier in international as the USA and Spain, then after that there is a big group of teams who can all beat each other on any given night:

Lithuania, Argentina, Croatia, Serbia, Greece, Australia, Brazil, Russia, France, Slovenia, Turkey etc.

New Zealand have been just below this group with teams like Puerto Rico, Italy, Macedonia etc, but I think with Jackson in, assuming Adams plays, they can move up into that group of contenders.

Reply #515995 | Report this post


Dazz  
Years ago

Forget the TB's if he becomes Naturalised The Breakers are going to become unstoppable

Reply #516000 | Report this post


MACDUB  
Years ago

Our lack of a point guard has really hurt us.

Tait has done an admirable job but Ced is just on another level.

If we had Ced, Webster, Fotu, Loe(or Vukona) and Adams we would have an NBA and Euroleague level starting 5.

Reply #516022 | Report this post


MACDUB  
Years ago

P.s. I'm still not sure about Te Rangi.

The last time his footwork was any good was the night of that pub fight.

Reply #516023 | Report this post


Nobody  
Years ago

I would have thought naturalisation was years away for Jackson.
Are the Kiwi rules different to Aussie rules?

Reply #516029 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Australia will naturalize anyone in a snap if they can win us a medal in international sport.

Reply #516032 | Report this post


MACDUB  
Years ago

New Zealand will fast-track citizenship by grant if you are an elite sportsman. I was lucky enough to benefit from it.

All it requires is a formal letter from the national sporting organisation (i.e. Basketball NZ) essentially 'endorsing' the athlete and saying they have a good chance of being selected for the national team.

Ced would have to get residency however, as I'm not sure whether he has gone from a Work Visa to Residence or whether he still operates on a Work Visa.

Mystro, at least we won't have to put up with the Casey Frank v Horvath battle as to the naturalised playing position - although both are/were close to retiring in any event.

Reply #516049 | Report this post


PeterJohn  
Years ago

Anon - absolutely correct. Cricket Australia got the laws changed to be able to naturalise Fawad Ahmed.

"Immigration Minister Brendan O'Connor introduced an amendment to citizenship law ...[to] give him discretion to grant citizenship to residents who have not lived in Australia for the four-year minimum, including Ahmed.

To be eligible, ... 'an applicant must be engaged in a kind of work of benefit to Australia.'

the legislation was drafted in consultation with Cricket Australia"

The bill was passed through Federal Parliament in late 2013.

Reply #516074 | Report this post


Uwe Blab  
Years ago

How does it work if the person applying has not been in the country for consecutive years? Not looking at re-igniting the loyalty discount debate, just curious because I vaguely recall someone I know needing to remain in the country for consecutive years to be considered eligible.

Or will fast-tracking the application overrule any standard laws?

Reply #516076 | Report this post


MACDUB  
Years ago

Therein lies the problem.

There is conflict between a country's nationality laws and FIBA regulations.

Correct me if im wrong, but FIBA states that you simply need to be a citizen of the country.

That's all well and good, except that countries have different criteria and as above, many (if not all) have discretion to give citizenship out willy-nilly.

Andray Blatche is a classic example; he was "naturalised" by the Filipino Government, yet he had spent no time whatsoever living there.

The funny thing was that he couldn't compete at the Asia Games as he was disqualified for not having met the three year residence requirements, yet he was perfectly eligible for attend the FIBA WC's and performed exceptionally well.

Reply #516078 | Report this post


paul  
Years ago

... and helped deliver great TV ratings for FIBA's affiliate broadcaster in the Philippines. Money talks, so I can't see FIBA doing anything about it.

Reply #516083 | Report this post


MACDUB  
Years ago

Yes, well you can imagine FIBA would like more of a spread of NBA-level talent to make the events a bit more competitive.

Reply #516084 | Report this post


XY  
Years ago

There is still a limit of only one naturalised player per team, which prevents you from drafting a whole team or entirely skewing the likely result.

Reply #516093 | Report this post


paul  
Years ago

You can make a case that allowing players like Jeter, McCalebb and Blatch to play makes tournaments more interesting because more teams can win on any given night, but I think there needs to be some common sense about it.

Dontaye Draper played for Croatia, but at least he'd played his club basketball there for a couple of years, the handing out passports to players who've never set foot in the country is just taking the piss.

Reply #516097 | Report this post


GWB  
Years ago

Id like to see Cedric play, just because it would make the Tall Blacks more competitive against the Boomers. But I certainly don't see the Tall Blacks winning the oceania series - Unless of course we fall to injuries. We are going to be covered at every position. If bogut does play.... forget about it!

Having said that, yes they have a chance of getting through a secondry tournament.

Reply #516186 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

GWB, if Bogut does not play - who guards Adams?

Reply #516211 | Report this post


Some_Fulla  
Years ago

I think NZ with Adams/Jackson and considering the exp the other young guys got at the WC in Spain are a coin toss against the Boomers.

Don't overrate yourselves Aussie!

Reply #516213 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Jackson/t.webster
Penney/c.webster
Abercrombie/Bailey/Te rangi
Fotu/Vukona/loe
Adams/pledger

Reply #516217 | Report this post


GWB  
Years ago

Anonymous who guards Adams?

Baynes
Bairstow
Jawai
Maric

Take your pick. What else do the Kiwis have inside? With a good team defence inside, I see Adams being negated fairly soundly. Is there a single match up that wont be in Australias favour? Maybe they get the plus for Adams over Baynes, but even that is pushing it.

Reply #516226 | Report this post


paul  
Years ago

It's not a game of one-on-one match-ups, with Adams and Jackson the talent levels won't be that dissimilar, so it will come down to which team performs best.

As I said, the Kiwis seem to do better against good Euro teams than the Boomers because our players are familiar with their style of play. I'd be backing the Aussies but not without a fight.

Of course, we have to see who is actually available for each team, there could be quite a few missing and Jackson mightn't be qualified until 2016.

Reply #516235 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

If Cedric is on the team then Tall Blacks > choking/tanking Boomers

Reply #516343 | Report this post


Train  
Years ago

Patty Mills > Cedric Jackson

Reply #516345 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

yeah but as a team it pains me as an aussie but TB would be strong and outperform our talent in a major tourney.

the boomers unfortunately are masters at choking, not just in recent history but the past two decades, 2000 Sydney a major example at home so close to a medal yet so far

Reply #516349 | Report this post


Train  
Years ago

Full strength boomers would put away New Zealand comfortably. Most of NZ team are NBL players as opposed to the Boomers who are either in NBA or Europe.

Reply #516353 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Train after cwebb and abercrombie leave to europe after thi season only nbl players will be vukona, possibly pledger and jackson if he ever plays

Reply #516376 | Report this post


Train  
Years ago

They still would fall short. 6 NBA players speaks volumes. I'm not saying they are a rubbish team by all means, but adding Cedric Jackson doesn't simply make them better than the Boomers.

While Cedric is good, he still is just an NBL caliber player.

Reply #516377 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

What a joke this is. Let's possibly naturalise a player that seldom lives in NZ.

Reply #516385 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Cedric isnt that good, i didnt make this thread. I was only pointing out that NZ will only use 2 to 3 Nbl players

Reply #516400 | Report this post


paul  
Years ago

Again, how your team plays is just as important as where your players play their club ball. NZ have performed as well as Australia the past two WCs with a team of NBL and NZ NBL players.

Did Dave Barlow get better because he became a 'Europe' player? Did Kirk Penney get better after leaving the Breakers? Do Brazil dominate international basketball because they have a lot of NBA players? Did our 2014 WC team with 10 guys in Europe and the NBA perform better than our 2008 Olympic team with only five?

International basketball is very much about having a team that knows the international game, knows each other, and can perform the roles needed to help the team succeed. Talent helps, but the level of talent is very even outside the absolute superstars.

Reply #516427 | Report this post




 

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