junior fan
Years ago

district winter junior teams

now that the summer season is over, how do think teams/clubs will fair in the real season?
will the teams stay pretty much the same?
I've been told that west u18 boys might lose a few players to Forestville.

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comment wally may  
Years ago

we don't even know what is going on this weekend ! Not even a news announcement i.e "first five rounds will be released by COB Tues 17th for Fri / Sat" appreciate some results need to influence pro/rel - but some priority needs to be given to this week being the final round and decisions need to be made.

Reply #521421 | Report this post


comment wally may  
Years ago

can only hope the competitions committee and schedule programmer have met today or meeting tonight and someone does some overtime and gets something up on sportingpulse.

Reply #521422 | Report this post


anon  
Years ago

Any sign of a warrior u18 boys d1? Or has that boat sailed. I guess sturt could fill the hole. Div 2 comp will still probably have 2 sturt teams. It will mean that some clubs will play sturt four times (and loose) in an12 team comp over 18 rounds. Will BSA spread the pain or concentrate it on a couple of clubs.

Reply #521430 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Warriors boys were bad in div 2 so I couldn't imagine them going up to div 1.

Reply #521434 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

U12/14 Div 3. How do you grade on 2/5 games which depends on who younolayed in your group.

Reply #521436 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Sturt have two teams in u18 div 2 as Eastern hasn't fielded a division 2 team. If eastern was to field a division 2 team then sturt would only have 1 team.

Reply #521449 | Report this post


comment wally may  
Years ago

it's all supposed to be 1 team per div now - only get second team if a member club doesn't nominate.

IMO it's all wrong and it should be teams earn their spot in every division - regardless of club or how many teams.

How teams can develop if they win or lose by 70 points most weeks is beyond me.

who gets the second team if western nominate and a member club also wants it ?

get ready for another season of lop sided results in lower grades

Reply #521476 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

10 team comp is destroying junior basketballs potential along with lower divisions in lower age groups playing sat mornings which cuts kids out of trying othr sports or playing with school friends then why would they stay to get smashed. yet kids who get the best courts and coaches to train and fair competition and develooment opportunities play friday and still get to try other sports and have time with family and friends. It is all back to front. BSA needs to have a customer focus and user lersoective to grow the sport and revenue to expand stadiums. As it all stands now there is no drawcard to keep players. Don't get me started on school basketball !!!

Reply #521481 | Report this post


comment wally may  
Years ago

exactly - pro / rel rounds get abandoned and never rescheduled - when there were 2 sundays available to reschedule rounds. Then pro / rel means nothing as it gets down to 1 team per member club per div - I am sure if Friday nights were abandoned they would have been rescheduled quick smart.

Reply #521483 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Sturt U18 Div 2 already lost a player with more very unhappy with ludicrous game plan of copying Kentucky and subbing 5 for 5 every 2 minutes. Hopefully the talent gets spread to other clubs and get the chance to play at their correct level instead of a silly policy of only 2nd years playing div 1.

Reply #521486 | Report this post


:  
Years ago

Isn't that what everyone want from all this to make people move clubs i.e. play d3 one club and move and play d1 at a struggling club?

Reply #521489 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Here is the kicker for us. We live closer to the club we are at than the jumpers from a weaker club who jump the que even though our kids were div 1 or developing to make it. How is it fair that we have to take out kids talent somewhere much further away and also leave all the friends we and our kids have made over the past 5 years. Basketball is the most toxic environment full of selfish individuals and its the players jumping ques that are destroying clubs by leaving with their talent not the other way around. Club spirit and community is non existant. The 2 dominant clubs for every successful story there are many other unhappy players just playing in the hope they may get an opportunity but now the tables are tuning and through neglect the results are waning and BSA's plan to push people to other clubs is failing as people are just leaving the sport instead. Clubs that are rapidly expanding are doing so by tapping in to the school program at their club and we are now hearing that it is so big that kids see no pathway. It has all become too much about the coaches and not about players and their families and individuals for coaches to get their hands on and everyone else has to dance around them. So many kids being used and spat out and parents disrespected all over basketball. Too much power in coaches hands. Thats fine at div 1 level but leave evryone else alone so they can enjoy the sport.

Reply #521490 | Report this post


Red  
Years ago

#521486

You do know Sturt has 2 first year players playing Div 1?

Reply #521494 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

yes and that cuts out 2 2nd years who will be dropped down to lower divisions and most leave the sport disenchanted and as a human being upset as they have be defriended by a third party - the club - to develop a couple of individuals. Happens all the time especially in the you ger age groups and wonder why people leave the sport. 1st years will get their chance. Kids are more than just a pawn in the coaches plans of grandeur. I have never seen a sport so soul destroyingg at a local level. Normally that happens when you hit fthe higher levels but basketball does not have the same pathways other sports have. Ego's and shirt fronting everywhere. Club to club and club to association, it is like high school all over again.

Reply #521499 | Report this post


Green45  
Years ago

Wally may the 18b div 2 still has 12 team comp until summer 2015/2016. Probable second sturt team (history) and possible second eagles team (also following history and summer season where they topped pro reg in group A of the last phase). If either teams have first years they will have to be cut at end of winter 2015. #486 and #499 have a point. Perhaps Warriors can recruit a very competitive div 1 from sturt ranks.

Reply #521500 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

the kids don't want to leave their club and why should they. They have relationships nd may have been there since u10 and close to home. But because other clubs failings the overall comp in Compromised and the smashings occur. If they do leave to pursue a higher division then they end up in teams with players who are not as strong as them and coaches that are not qble to challenge them. Its a catch 22 for these kids. They should all be able to play in a division with a team that matches their ability no matter which club they are from. If there are multiples from 1 club so be it. It wll insoire clubs to work harder to build talent and keep kids playing and less disenchanted. Surely playing Div 1/2 and getting smashed does not develop kids as they never get to be in the game or they leave because it is just not fun or they drop to a lower grade or Saturday morning and can't koin in their school or other sports . BSA have it all wrong.

Reply #521502 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

warriors are an example of the politics and coaching that has driven players away and then he comp suffers due to magic issues and players expanding their non assoicated club. that in turn insettles div 2/3 with div 1 or top ate teams smashing teams so how is that different to the 2 major coubs smashing teams. central
now guilty of the same not challenging to develop top sides so drol them to grades they can win and look where that is not getting them at senior and Premier league level. they should be sorted out too and BSA strong enough to say no, field a 1 team. magic should only be allowed in div 3 and below to allow 1st years in div 2 to develop at all clubs. div 3 is often stronger with many 2nd years who miss a shot at div 1 so more apprpopriate for magics teams of 2nd years ex associated club players who ate playing below their standard.

Reply #521503 | Report this post


comment wally may  
Years ago

nothing like trying to force kids away from their current club / friends and start from scratch again - make the parents pay for new uniforms.

Reply #521511 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

anon#521502

So you are saying that every div 1 team should be full of only top age players even when kids a year younger are better and have more chance of being elite level players.

Not to mention its better for the team and the opportunities of all the players in that team to attend classics.

Mate...get a clue

Reply #521514 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

there it is, there Are a few first years that are better than the 2nd years and then the others are in div 1 because they will be in div 1 the next year so they play together with the super stars to build a team. all about the elite and classics. this is why we need the victorian model so those players deemed not be in the coaches eyes worth developing in their own age and will miss out due to this practice can play with and against their own age in a separate competition. This is the only way to maintain a positive fun playing environment and remove politica dor the bulk of players who are constantly affected by the needs of the elite or potential elite. And before anyone says district is for that purpose there really is no other option in our sport but to go to district as their is a lack of that mid tier competition and school basketball just doesn't cut it. they may as well just play games at school because that too is affected by elite olayers dominatig school comp.

Tell me above poster, have you lost any players that had potential as a second year in div 1 leave at winter start because 1st years have come in and changed the dynamics for them as well !!!! Especially in girls sport as they look for something different and put equal importance in the game with friendships Most girls needs a buddy hey relate too. Remove the buddy and they will eventually lose confdence.

I say all this not to stir triuble but highlight where our sport is going wrong for both the elite and local level, competitive or social. We need to ackowledge all concerns from every level and not just think of elite. If there is only div 1/2 at competitive club level but a loval domestic comp in every region then there is no fall back to play competitive basketball at club level for those 2nd years say who are displaced. They can either go to abither club or play tegional domestic. This option will daw more oovement rather than take the fall back to div 3 waitihg and hoping for an opportunity to llay 1/2. it forces the hand without displacing thise in the lower grades who would have their own levels to compete for. A much better and healthier player and family friendly option.

Reply #521517 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

In U18s, I heard a few Southern leaving for Eastern. A few West looking to leave to Forestville and South.

Reply #521524 | Report this post


comment wally may  
Years ago

why are we putting anchors on junior sporting talent here ? If a club / age group have enough talent for 2 or even 3 teams per grade - so be it.

Reply #521528 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

why do clubs accept players from other clubs when they dont have room for them? Works both ways. All good to say clubs have the talent so promote them but often those teams are made up of players that have moved there or been recruited to play there.

Reply #521529 | Report this post


Green45  
Years ago

#524

Clearances are listed on Sporting Pulse under each club (except nothing for Centrals and Tigers). Have tobe processed today I gather to be available for games this friday.

Reply #521532 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

That is quite simple.

Cause they are running a business.

Each player that enters a club pays fee's.

If for every 10 people who enter a club 50% drop off you are better off and more profitable, not to mention performance improve.

Reply #521533 | Report this post


comment wally may  
Years ago

would not rely on sporting pulse for official clearance updates - best to be in direct contact with club secretary - sometimes seen clearances recorded weeks after they have officially been done. Would like to see all clearances recorded in one spot on sporting pulse - not under each team.
Eastern don't also have clearances recorded on sporting pulse.

Reply #521535 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Hope they don't put much importance on Phase 3! Some 5 team grades had teams play one game, miss 3 due to the heat and had a bye. I see one Under 14 team only played one game, won by over 60 and are placed 3rd on the ladder. If clubs believe they have 2 teams up to a certain division and would thrash teams in a lower division they should be listened to.

Reply #521543 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

anon#521517

If a player is not in the top 9 or 10 as a top age player, then realistically, they aren't a part of the elite level pathway. The number of spots in Premier League, Div 2 men and YL1 are limited to perhaps 25 total per club. But each club has 9/10 player from Div 1 coming out each year. And realistically there is only room for 2 or 3 of them. So any player in that situation is actually following the correct pathway into YL2 etc.

If you are arguing double div 1 teams, I will agree in principle. The competition would be much better if teams were graded according to ability in order to make sure that each player plays at their ideal level.

However, this would only create a situation where again at senior level not all players can fit into the elite pathway anyway, cause of a lack of positions.

Reply #521548 | Report this post


Green45  
Years ago

u16b div 3-6 and girls div 3 schedule up on SP. That's thursday dealt with

Reply #521581 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

It's a joke! Two days out from div 1 and 2 games and still nothing.

How can they run things so badly??? Surely they would be able to get a fixture out in quicker time? Div 1 and 2 didn't have phasing so why couldn't that have been settled prior to the last weekend of summer? That way they could focus all the attention to the fixtures that they we're waiting on results for.

Poorly run from office to the court and families spend a lot of time and money on this sport.

Reply #521607 | Report this post


Green45  
Years ago

I think you'll find that it was this time last year the fixtures were released late on the 18th. Thurs draw first, then friday then sat. Should see it by 7 tonight all going well. No matter how much anyone complains the fixtures wont come any sooner. Chill out and enjoy untwisted nickers tomorrow.

Reply #521609 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

I can't see why basa doesn't extend summer so grand finals and end of phases are week before easter giving themselves 2 weeks to get out schedules. Same applies for winter finals where it doesn't clash with the show ruling wayville out of action.
It doesn't affect myself and a lot of people probably but when families have multiple kids playing Friday it does become a headache in terms of arranging transport etc. Div 1 and 2 at the very least should be up by now.

Reply #521611 | Report this post


.  
Years ago

they should have a draft template - i.e. 8 team comp, 9 team comp, 10 team comp ready and just put the teams / allocate courts in once the final results in.
Wouldn't be easy as there are a lot of games to organize.

Why do we have pro/rel when it means nothing ? And it defaults back to 1 team per club.

Again this season we have seen juniors train regularly and deliver results, finish high in pools - only to see promotions go to ramshackle teams offering walk ups opportunity to play high level basketball !








Reply #521618 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

I'm not sure why anyone is surprised that BSA is incapable of following even their own timelines for information...

We as clubs allow them to do it ever year without holding them to account.

Piss poor by BSA...but worse from the club.

Reply #521635 | Report this post


.  
Years ago

I am very disappointed that we have juniors dedicated to basketball, club and team - make a commitment to the sport and deliver as requested in pro / rel and then we see clubs offering spots in higher grades to anyone off the street - who will put a uniform on.

There is no justice in this and basketball will reap what it sows here.

It will never develop catering for the lowest common denominator day in day out.

Reply #521642 | Report this post


Well Read  
Years ago

Friday fixtures are up as well.

Reply #521651 | Report this post


.  
Years ago

HA - what a joke - u18g div 2 - LOL - wait to you see the results there - same with u14g div 2 - have Div 4-5 social teams playing against div 1-2 teams.

Reply #521656 | Report this post


Chewie  
Years ago



Pretty disappointing for some of the junior teams that had numerous hot weather games cancelled, to have no game this weekend due to scheduling issues with the country carnival.

So it pans out they get no game this weekend.
Double game next weekend
No games - Easter the following weekend again (unless they are promoted to tournament squads)

Fixture has issues. Trying to keep kids motivated when all they are doing is training and not playing is challenging, and I'm gathering it has cost some clubs across the board some players.

I'm gathering the 1 team per division statements being made are strictly a div 1/2 policy?

Just looked and some div 3 comps have up to three clubs having two teams playing. Example, Sturt two teams, Norwood two teams, South two teams in a div 3.

Reply #521754 | Report this post


anonymous  
Years ago

Agree Under 18 girls div 2 is a huge joke. Can not believe there are so many teams in there. Then there is no div 3 . What will they do after 5 rounds. Go Ohh lets take the bottom 7 and make a div 3?? Not fair for those that actually deserve their spot in div 2

Reply #521769 | Report this post


Green45  
Years ago

Looks like the u18b has lots of interesting arrangements. Div 2 is still a "12 team" competition (11 with a BYE). This looks like two teams from Sturt (as usual) and a second team from Eagles which looks like it came up from div 3 group A (pro/rel works!).

Souths has total of 9 teams with 3 teams in D5 and D4. Souths will be making use of their new home courts (Pasadena 3 and Morphett Vale 4). Interesting that second Eagles team in Div 2 came from div 3 grp A. That group also had two South teams. Why didn't the south team that finished second in Grp A get moved to Div 2 so that there would be no BYE? A real opportunity missed there to give all teams a game each round.

Reply #521772 | Report this post


Confused  
Years ago

Seems like there's been a swing to pull teams up rather than push down, a lot of teams might be saying we are in too deep. Surely this can only be a good thing?

Getting spanked each week? maybe time you got serious!

Reply #521777 | Report this post


Shrek  
Years ago

anon #521517

I really like the ideas, your passion and the discussion you are having about the club hoppers and what is the correct way to move forward.

The VJBL have their own problems but they do not like to see it as a real problem because it is a large revenue stream for them. Just before the start of the season proper 829 players had requested clearances to go to another rep club.

A lot of players leave their smaller junior rep clubs because of the carrot of playing Championship level is so bright and shiny and the age group at their club will not make it. In the VJBL the first team is generally picked on ability so you can have bottom aged players. The thing about leaving a smaller club that there still is the opportunity to play in Championship in the 2nd team at the larger clubs.

I would love to see Victoria adopt what you have that only one team can play Champioship and one team in Championship Reserve. You would probably have to have four conferences in Victoria and only teams that have two teams in each and every age group 12's to 18's boys and girls would play in the Champ and Champ Res.

Clubs who have more than 2 teams in an age group would go through grading to play against like ability in a step below. Would this kind of idea be of benefit to the senior club? Knowing that each club was going to play the highest level would players come to the smaller clubs to even out the competition? If players wanted to play at highest level would it be a shift in parents thought processes?

Junior Basketball has issues, if you read a lot of what college coaches of many sports are saying they like kids who have played a variety of sports. In the VJBL it is almost a 12 month commitment. When do the rep teams train, Sunday which is junior football day in metropolitan Victoria during autumn/winter. Saturday is netball, cricket (summer) and junior domestic basketball at the larger associations.

Every state has their own set of issues, but it seems like SA could do with more stadiums to try and keep all the junior basketball on a more even footing.

Will the decision makers get out in the real world and care about the long term prospects of the game and more importantly the juniors that participate in it? Junior sport organised by adults for what suits the adult on the basketball boards, not often suiting parents or kids.....

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Even out the competition? All your concept would ensure is multiple blowouts and a ridiculously uneven competition where the best teams rarely play each other! How will that help develop elite basketballers?

Reply #522538 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Shrek

Basketball South Australia has gone along this track and it is leading to a decrease in its performance and a loss of females in the sport especially in the U18 age group where teams are getting beaten by 50+ points every other week.

The idea that people will move to these clubs has been proven wrong, and in fact all you get is kids from both ends leaving the sport.

Reply #522552 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

It doesn't work because there's no consistency.

1 team per Division 2 grade over summer, then in winter let's promote clubs third teams.

Why would any player move for opportunity when BSA keep changing the rules.

Reply #522559 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Cause they can play Div 1.

But more players leave div 1 teams to play div 2 with good coaching and training's than leave div 2 and 3 teams to play div 1.

and more again leave the sport altogether.

Reply #522561 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

For all those that canned BSA for combining Div 2 and Div 3 in Under 18 Girls stating the Div 3 teams would get thrashed

I notice that in the first 2 rounds there have been three wins by Div 3 teams over Div 2 teams.

And Sturt forfieted the second week?

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