Anonymous
Last year

#41764

Diamond Valley join SEABL

Locked in and on the move for 2018 Season.

Both Men and Women will play in the SEABL competition.

Big V = Bush League, CEO = Incompetent.

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known
Last year
08:00 10 Sep 17

Reply #646341

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

won't happen.. not this year


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GM
Last year
09:11 10 Sep 17

Reply #646342

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Is there any genuine team expansion underway? Who are the obvious Associations that could do it?


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ex coach
Last year
11:13 10 Sep 17

Reply #646343

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Diamond Valley- 8th in SCM and 10th in SCW in 2017.
I'd say that if they go into SEABL, they will be stacking their teams with non-DV players.
I've never had anything to do with Diamond Valley, but from the outside, this may take focus away from a consistently strong junior representative program and a growing club. And for a yield that is virtually non-existent, except for the rent-seekers.


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Anonymous
Last year
12:15 10 Sep 17

Reply #646344

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

When do Knox go back into the seabl comp?


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Anonymous
Last year
13:12 10 Sep 17

Reply #646345

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

DV seems to have a lot of ex-Eltham types getting around in their polos in the last few years.


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Anonymous
Last year
18:54 10 Sep 17

Reply #646350

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

big mistake. they'll be making up the numbers


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Anon
Last year
19:01 10 Sep 17

Reply #646352

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Well that's an absolute joke lol. They struggled in SC both men and women, especially the women, they had their only half decent player leave because they couldn't afford to pay her what she wanted, the coach was atrocious, then Went on to head the UN19 women to an equally dismal finish.how will they afford SEABL quality players

What bright spark decided this lol


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Anonymous
Last year
19:50 10 Sep 17

Reply #646360

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Diamond Valley can Take Frankston's spot and coach in SEABL women!!


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I
Last year
04:32 11 Sep 17

Reply #646367

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

People said the same thing about the Tigers but they got better as the season went along. And theynwilmhe better next season


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I
Last year
04:33 11 Sep 17

Reply #646368

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

* they will be better next season


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Anonymous
Last year
06:54 11 Sep 17

Reply #646371

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Tigers have little to no money and a poor coach. Unlikely to get better.


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Anonymous
Last year
07:28 11 Sep 17

Reply #646375

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Melbourne beat Albury Ballarat and Frankston and then had that one freak win against Hobart by three points

thats not indicative of a team that's improving lol

But their will always be cellar dwellers in all comps , it's just baffling why teams that are already cellar dwellers in a much weaker comp would ever consider the jump into a competition that's clearly well above their ability , especially when the financial outlay between the two leagues is also vastly different
The teams that are clearly winning in bigV SC are the ones who should be pushing to go into SEABL, not the teams sitting at the bottom lol


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ex coach
Last year
07:49 11 Sep 17

Reply #646378

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

But why should teams push up into SEABL if it means that expensive senior playing spots that are filled by their own graduating juniors are now going to be more expensive and filled by graduating juniors from other clubs.
It's not like SEABL gives you a higher profile in the wider community. SEABL is as absent from the newspapers as the Big V.


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Anonymous
Last year
08:29 11 Sep 17

Reply #646379

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Think it's called challenging yourself , you know trying to get to reach your highest potential
The difference between the standard of SEABL and BigV SC as far as playing is concerned is streets apart.

That's like saying why should they go play WNBL or even NBL ( though they get a bit more exposure than the WNBL) neither league gets much through the normal channels, most comes via internet access to sports coverage, they may get Fox Sports now but this is the first time in years for the women
You cannot measure the strength of a competition by how much media exposure it gets lol

You speak to any player who has made the jump down to BigV from SEABL they will tell you it's well below what they are used to, so it stands to reason that making the jump up for those who are winning at SC level makes more sense than those sitting at the bottom of SC


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X
Last year
08:33 11 Sep 17

Reply #646380

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Keep adding teams = Dilutes talent of SEABL

SEABL should say no


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Reality
Last year
08:44 11 Sep 17

Reply #646382

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

SEABL said yes to Melbourne so based on that DV easily would get accepted.

Really SEABL should be looking to add a team from the outer North East (Massive Growth Region) so a DV, Eltham, Hume makes alot of sense in he medium term more so than the ever Tigers did.

At the moment the SEABL in Melbourne is effectively a Sth East Suburbs league so a natural attraction is location.

Obviously DV would need to spend money to get a great import pairing particularly in the mens plus recruit a couple of better Australian players....perhaps they will chase NBL level guys with the new season structure ;-)

Womens level at SEABL DV can compete by only adding two key pieces (they won't play finals) to be better than the Albury type clubs.




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ex coach
Last year
09:08 11 Sep 17

Reply #646385

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

re: anonymous
You answered my questions about joining SEABL from a player's perspective in terms of rising to the challenge.
I was asking the question from a club's perspective- what does the club get in joining SEABL?

That is why, despite the criticism that the Melbourne women's team receives on this forum in terms of results, they should be applauded for fielding a team that largely uses players who graduated from their junior program. At least that way, the club gets a yield from the enormous financial subsidization that it provides to its senior teams.


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known
Last year
09:44 11 Sep 17

Reply #646389

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Ultimately SEABL is a better league and offers more to its participants as far as exposure and talent that's why you do it. If you don't like the league your in you find another league. SEABL is the only other league. Its an indictment on BIG V.


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Reality
Last year
10:07 11 Sep 17

Reply #646391

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Both big V & Seabl have a place...really teams like Ringwood & Waverley should be pushing each other to rise and play in the SEABL comp as the aim is to compete at the highest level possible whilst providing good pathways for your juniors to hopefully play at the highest level they can. (If the juniors are up to seabl they can move elsewhere.)






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Anonymous
Last year
10:22 11 Sep 17

Reply #646393

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

What is the Big V CEO doing to improve the top level of Big V?? Seems to be more focused on Divy 2 men and women.

SC comps need a bit of TLC


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Anonymous
Last year
10:24 11 Sep 17

Reply #646394

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

10 years ago SCM was not that far off the standard of SEABL been in a steady decline ever since.

If they allowed a third import to each team it would improve the standard of the league and Big V might even attract SEABL teams.


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Anonymous
Last year
10:39 11 Sep 17

Reply #646398

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Big V CEO is only interested in inclusion. She has no interest in the greater sport or improving the standard of the Big V league.

Did she actually attend any of the Grand Finals this year?

She would make a very good domestic club president. That is all.

The Big V board should be held accountable also for renewing her employment contract last year.

She should go back to Government policy writing and leave Basketball alone.


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Bear
Last year
13:24 11 Sep 17

Reply #646420

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

I think Knox and Dandenong could both adopt the Geelong model of a youth league - Senior BigV - SEABL pathway easily enough. Others could follow as the benefits are many, for players, spectators and the clubs, as long as it is done right.

SEABL and Big V (and all State leagues) should be working inclusively to cooperate, promote the game and expand the competition, not butt heads due to inflated egos!


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Anonymous
Last year
13:36 11 Sep 17

Reply #646423

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

How does Geelong do Big V & SEABL? $$$?


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Anonymous
Last year
14:00 11 Sep 17

Reply #646424

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Geelong SEABL and Geelong Big V are separate associations.

Other SEABL clubs could buddy up with smaller associations and do the same thing.

For instance why don't Nunawading and Blackburn, Dandnenong and Keysborough, Kilsyth and Sherbroke, Frankston and Chelsea, Ballarat and Melton all work together?


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Anonymous
Last year
14:33 11 Sep 17

Reply #646432

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

I thought it was the entity Basketball Geelong which covers both SEABL & Biv V as the only other association in the area being Corio Bay?


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Reality
Last year
14:49 11 Sep 17

Reply #646435

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Would make sense to have the three tiers.

YL > Big V > SEABL

The jump from YL to SEABL is hugh so the step in the middle for a season or 2 makes really good sense rather than a kids riding the bench in SEABL while not really developing when they drop back and dominate other kids.


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Anonymous
Last year
14:54 11 Sep 17

Reply #646437

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

There is too much logic and common sense in this thread. Can someone please say something stupid.


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Anonymous
Last year
15:18 11 Sep 17

Reply #646442

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

The YLC in big V are really not much less in ability than the SC teams in many cases, if a club can't field a decent SC team they won't ever get a SEABL team together without spending big on all players not just a couple of imports .



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Anonymous
Last year
19:19 11 Sep 17

Reply #646479

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

#646432
There is Geelong Basketball Association (seabl) and Geelong Amateur Basketball Association (big v) both associations use "Supercats" and the same colour scheme.

Corio Bay is completely separate.


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Bear
Last year
08:19 12 Sep 17

Reply #646521

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

@Anon#423 - If you are asking me that $$$ question, it is no secret that the Supercats have been doing it that way for years, the difference now is that SEABL and the BigV are allowing more flexibility for any Association to adopt the same model without too many restrictions.

As for how they do it on a budget, well the Supercats this season has zero imports in their Big V, yet almost made the grand final in both men and women, they do have SEABL imports, but obviously manage their finances properly.

The answer lies in how you manage the $$$, how many decent sponsors you attract, how large your domestic club competition is and all of this is just common sense in the way an Association approaches it.

That's why I suggested Knox and Dandenong should be the next two to adopt the same pathway, I feel they are big enough and should be smart enough to do it without too many issues.


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Spot Up
Last year
10:22 12 Sep 17

Reply #646535

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

"The YLC in big V are really not much less in ability than the SC teams in many cases, if a club can't field a decent SC team they won't ever get a SEABL team together without spending big on all players not just a couple of imports"

The second half of this sentence makes complete sense. The first half is waaaay off the mark.

Anyway, regarding teams like Ringwood and Waverley, whilst their Senior SCM teams are probably at SEABL standard, the associations sitting below are considerably smaller than some nearby associations like Knox, Kilsyth, Dandenong, etc. The costs associated with playing in SEABL long term wouldn't really work for these associations I wouldn't have thought.

Knox are obviously an exception to this whole discussion, they'd still be in SEABL if a few things hadn't happened over the last couple of years..


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Spot Up
Last year
10:29 12 Sep 17

Reply #646536

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Is there actually any truth to Diamond Valley entering SEABL?


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Anonymous
Last year
12:13 12 Sep 17

Reply #646548

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

@Bear very interesting, thanks. What a good model.


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Anonymous
Last year
12:52 12 Sep 17

Reply #646555

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Bear ,Rangers struggle to pay those they already have in SEABL the women in particular, players actually get better money in BigV SC than they do at SEABL level in most instances, hell many get paid better in DIV1 lol
.
The Rangers BigV YL players dont get a cent, hell they dont even have the big budgets other WNBL teams have since Wright departed, so no way would they be able to get another level into that mix, regardless of how successful they may be as a club, their is only so many dollars to divide. The men SEABL program are better off than the women and they wont want to take any part of that budget for another division thats for sure

Spot Up, I disagree that the first part of that sentence

"The YLC in big V are really not much less in ability than the SC teams in many cases, if a club can't field a decent SC team they won't ever get a SEABL team together without spending big on all players not just a couple of imports"

most SC teams have a couple of good players the rest could easily slip into a lower div and still struggle,where as those who play in Bigv YL struggle at SEABL level to make any impact on a game in general, their are always exceptions, but when you average it out across the division the first part of it is about right.


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Bear
Last year
13:50 12 Sep 17

Reply #646564

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

^Anon you obviously know the Dandenong program well and I will not dispute what you say, obviously they are in SEABL men and WNBL women, so the dollar is already stretched.

Big V isn't cheap, so of course I understand that they wouldn't want to overshoot their budget, just thought a senior team in between was a better pathway.

I think Werribee could do it though, huge growth area and new stadium, just have to work with their council to get more support financially and they could definitely go the three tier model IMHO.

There would be quite a few here in Vic and I am sure similar model interstate could be adopted, with SEABL as the top tier, just a consideration.


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Anonymous
Last year
03:12 13 Sep 17

Reply #646592

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Bear, thanks for using the word "their" correctly !


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I
Last year
09:33 13 Sep 17

Reply #646599

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

http://seabl.com.au/seabl-to-welcome-diamond-valley-mens-and-womens-teams-in-2018/


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Anonymous
Last year
11:58 13 Sep 17

Reply #646609

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

The team name reminds me of this classic:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZlG1I7OEfUE


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Reality
Last year
12:26 13 Sep 17

Reply #646612

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Great result of DV now they just need to recruit two new senior teams as they can't put those same rosters out in SEABL or it will be worse than the Tigers teams.

They should target proven SEABL imports and try and get a couple of players of the leading Big V payers combined with a few SEABL players from Nunawading/Kilsyth etc


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Anonymous
Last year
12:33 13 Sep 17

Reply #646613

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

and some half decent coaches,problem is they didnt want to pay their SC BigV players , how the hell will they get decent imports, they dont play for nothing


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Anonymous
Last year
13:24 13 Sep 17

Reply #646615

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Oops.
"known said
Earlier this week
08:00 10 Sep 17
Reply #646341
re: Diamond Valley join SEABL
won't happen.. not this year"


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countofhoops
Last year
13:57 13 Sep 17

Reply #646616

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

"I'd say that if they go into SEABL, they will be stacking their teams with non-DV players. "

Love this quote DV already stacks its Big-V teams with "non-DV Players" both seniors and youth.


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Reality
Last year
14:23 13 Sep 17

Reply #646618

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

They lacked talent to compete in Big V last year so you;d guess tey will be piushing hard to recruit.

SEABL season changes might make this process a bit easier perhaps they are chasing 2 imports plus NBL level talent...although that doesn't come cheap.

Certainly only 1 or 2 of the current team would be able to play a role at SEABL level


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Anonymous
Last year
14:31 13 Sep 17

Reply #646619

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Zoe Carr to coach the womens team.


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Flow
Last year
14:58 13 Sep 17

Reply #646621

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Is she leaving Melbourne after 1 year?


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Anonymous
Last year
15:48 13 Sep 17

Reply #646623

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

I hear Ringwood is in the process of investigating entering SEABL although might not be able to get it done this year could be more likely 2019 season

Is there any truth to this?


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Flow
Last year
16:02 13 Sep 17

Reply #646624

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

The issue will end up being too many Melbourne teams. It's good diamond valley and melb got it when they did


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Anonymous
Last year
16:07 13 Sep 17

Reply #646625

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Yes. Zoe Carr. No idea.


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Anonymous
Last year
16:23 13 Sep 17

Reply #646626

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Zoe won't leave Melbourne Tiger after 1 year.
Wouldn't Dee Butler coach as she coached DV SCW this year??


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ex coach
Last year
17:58 13 Sep 17

Reply #646631

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

So, Diamond Valley enter SEABL but are going to import most of their players.
Seems an expensive investment for a small gain.


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Anonymous
Last year
19:15 13 Sep 17

Reply #646636

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Another team of easy beats. Just what the SEABL needed :(


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Anon
Last year
19:16 13 Sep 17

Reply #646637

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Zoe won't leave Melbourne Tiger after 1 year.
Wouldn't Dee Butler coach as she coached DV SCW this year??


Dee butler was abismal in SCW as a coach, same as she was for un19 Gems, if they are going to go to all the expense and pay big for imports and others to fill a SEABL standard team you would hope they would look to get a coach who could get the job at least half done.


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Anonymous
Last year
19:18 13 Sep 17

Reply #646638

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

This is more to get away from Big V and that awful CEO rather than wanting to play SEABL. What else can clubs do if that CEO remains?


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Anon
Last year
19:28 13 Sep 17

Reply #646640

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Sorry but the CEO is not responsible for the standard of team or the ability of the coaches who pick them.

If it's a bad comp it's because of who plays in it not who runs the whole thing


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Anonymous
Last year
20:01 13 Sep 17

Reply #646642

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

In 2004 when I coached in SCM, DV did not pay any players, but they were still a tough matchup. Despite a rough year, I am impressed with what DV has become. That requires people with amazing vision, huge work ethic and an absolute desire to be elite. I hope they are able to be successful and find their place in SEABL.


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Anonymous
Last year
20:09 13 Sep 17

Reply #646643

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Let's hope they can afford it and keep affording it and be a competitive team from the outset, lets hope so.


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countofhoops
Last year
20:31 13 Sep 17

Reply #646644

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

#646642 - Pretty fun post.
Having watched DV's SCM & SCW over the last few years the number of "fy in fly out" imports has gone up while the results have gone down, not sure how this qualifies as "people with amazing vision"


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Anonymous
Last year
21:52 13 Sep 17

Reply #646653

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

To the Dee Butler hater here, many including myself (ex pro player) think she has the potential to become a good wnbl coach. And I am not family or friend.


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Anonymous
Last year
22:52 13 Sep 17

Reply #646657

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Ringwood to be confirmed within a month as also moving to SEABL


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Flow
Last year
03:11 14 Sep 17

Reply #646660

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

No slight to you or her just curious about what results in her coaching career makes you think that?


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Anonymous
Last year
05:29 14 Sep 17

Reply #646662

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Zoe Carr. Press release. Carr has resigned
As Melbourne coach. Finished.


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Anonymous
Last year
07:08 14 Sep 17

Reply #646663

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Also have to question the poster who claims dee butler is WNBL calibre.... on what do you base that ?

Her track record so far isn't reflective of that conclusion, just because someone was an ok player does not always transfer to being a high calibre coach

And now DV bring another coach that's way off the mark from being a SEABL level head coach right now , if in fact this rumour is true.




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Anonymous
Last year
08:43 14 Sep 17

Reply #646665

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

From what I have heard Zoe Carr was zero
Influence on the tiger girls. The club was happy for her to leave the club.


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Reality
Last year
09:13 14 Sep 17

Reply #646666

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Ringwood are also looking to move up....unhappy with the standard in Big V.

This happens when the league focuses on quantity and not quality at the top end.

Bringing in teams.clubs to SC/SCW that aren't ready or equipped to compete has really made that division pretty weak outside of really 2 perhaps 3 teams each season.

Its great some of there Big V clubs want to make the move as they have solid infrastructure to make it work in the medium term particularly Ringwood when they make the jump.

Melbourne made the jump into SEABL without much of the club support/infrastructure that DV/Ringwood have so pending them recruiting well it can only be a good thing for SEABL


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Bear
Last year
09:38 14 Sep 17

Reply #646668

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

@Reality, I agree with your comments for the most part, however did the BigV bring teams in or did they just approve teams that wanted in at Champ level?

This may be semantics, but I feel the qualification for teams entering needs to be better monitored and properly assessed before new teams enter.

Even then, a team may be presented that looks great on paper and an Association may tick all the boxes, but it is later found that they are very thin and won't last at the top level, so moving down should not be looked at as a negative it should be an easier and more accepted process.

At SCM/SCW level it isn't always that most teams are not up to that standard either, it could be that the top teams are just too good or too stacked and should actually move to SEABL.

The fact that this pathway is now readily available and more options are there for clubs can only be a good thing, if managed properly, that is...


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Anonymous
Last year
10:31 14 Sep 17

Reply #646675

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

So Reality if we follow your theory of teams being dissatisfied with the quality of the competition, these same teams as in Melbourne and DV getting hammered and sitting on the bottom rungs of the sc comp, the way to fix that is to move those teams into a much harder competition

All that will now do is bring down the strength of SEABL , if BigV teams cannot secure and hold onto good players how on earth will they do that in SEABL when BigV actually offer more money to their players in most cases than they could get in SEABL

Unfortunately this will be a no win situation for either league, reducing numbers of inferior teams from one and pushing them into another only brings down the standard of the one those weaker teams join unless of course those clubs are going to buy an entire team of elite players, one or two mediocre imports from no name div2 colleges will not cut it


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Flow
Last year
10:47 14 Sep 17

Reply #646678

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

How about going to SEABL creates a better pathway for juniors. It allows them the opportunity to play in a national competition and travel and play against some of Australia's best every game. Why would you want the highest level your kids can play at to be a state competition. DV will retain more players and attract others who want to play in the second highest league in Australia which effects the bottom line. So Losing or not it's smart and it benefits the club long term in attracting juniors from the area as well as players returning home from college. Why do you think dandy continues to rip the best juniors from other clubs?? The lure of WNBL. The higher the level you have to offer the better quality of players are attracted to your program..


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Reality
Last year
10:59 14 Sep 17

Reply #646682

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

@Bear - Its a bit of a build it and they will come theory for the SCM/W comps in the last few years. But what a number of reasons the general standard has dropped off significantly and one key reason is diluting of talent at the top end to SEABL/Div 1 teams etc.

@Anon676 - Agree both Tigers/DV will most likely struggle in SEABL early doors but you'd have to say at least DV have the infrastructure to make a better go of it in there first few seasons.

Money in the Big V has some guys chasing paper in lower Divisions which has hurt SCM but if that's your soul motivation for playing ball at the Semi-pro level its a sad life you living!

Most hungry/competitive guys will embrace a team in the Northern suburbs so DV should be talking to the best Eltham/DV/Hume players and chasing 2 solid imports and 1 NBL level talent and they should be in a position to compete. As we have seen with MT G you only need to have 4 top line talents and then 3 solid rotation guys to be successful.







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Bear
Last year
11:17 14 Sep 17

Reply #646684

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Here's the thing, I speak to many parents of young kids coming into a club for the first time. Basketball competes with many sports, so what will club officials say to these parents?

1. Yeah come play with us until your kid turns 18, then I'm sorry but you will have to leave and choose football/netball and just play domestic hoops with your mates if you want to stay with our club and still play basketball. But, if you are really good and come back from college or something we could have a spot for you, maybe!

OR

2. Come play with us and here is the pathway, VJBL is an option, then if you want to stay and work hard we offer YL Big V, also you can remain and continue in the BigV as a senior and we even have SEABL if you progress to that level.

I know not everyone wants to play at that level, but I can tell you that parents at least want to hear that there is options and a progressive pathway for their kids and as the kids grow, more of them will potentially choose to stay with the sport.

I applaud the Associations that are looking at improving their pathways, mostly because there are more and more kids that want to play, we just need to get the message out to them, in a positive fashion.

Play for fun first, but if you want to get serious stay with us, we can cater for you!


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Anonymous
Last year
11:58 14 Sep 17

Reply #646692

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

I applaud clubs who have pathways that they actually do use for their players, ....but the truth is the very elite levels like WNBL and NBL rarely fill their teams with players who come through the ranks, you might get token players or ones who return, but not one team out their can say they are giving those opportunities to juniors that have come through, they are out to win and if that means bringing in imports and others from outside of the club then so be it.

#Flow, SEABL is not the place for young juniors to be pushing older more experienced players out of playing spots, this is the problem, if they were more focused on keeping them in age appropriate divisions imagine the strength they would have , but I get that at least having better pathway to aim for might be more of an incentive to stay at the club. By the way Rangers keep their SEABL for mostly Rangers, few if any haven't played as a junior at the club,they would also be one of the few that do channel one or two into their WNBL program but they dont always have them every year, and when you look at the percentage that actually get to a roster spot its not too many out of the hundreds that pass through the junior ranks of Rangers.


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Bear
Last year
12:07 14 Sep 17

Reply #646696

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Anon^, the home grown player retention issue can also be helped by the league, by implementing a rule that a certain percentage of the team must in fact be home-grown.

Also, your comment about the very top elite level of NBL/WNBL isn't quite the same as State level like the SEABL/BigV pathway.

All top tier national sport is now about drafting the best players from anywhere, not necessarily home grown, which is what should be driving the State level competition, even at SEABL level.

I know SEABL isn't a home grown league, but that doesn't mean it can't be slightly amended to suit the pathway.


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Reality
Last year
12:20 14 Sep 17

Reply #646698

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Not sure why people are so obsessed with senior teams being "home Grown" surely its about putting the best product out on the floor every year to try and win senior titles.

Pathways are great and if your club supports and nurtures talent through the pathway if the player is good enough they will force their way into the senior team, if the player isn't good enough they won;t make the team..its tough but thats life!


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Bear
Last year
12:35 14 Sep 17

Reply #646699

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

I wouldn't agree that people are 'obsessed' with home grown players, however that is a much bigger consideration in country areas than in the city, where you can play at several Associations due to far easier logistics.

I guess to some degree I always tend to consider country and metro as one and that any rules or improvements need to suit the whole league, not just have a narrow minded approach such as has been in past decades.


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Anonymous
Last year
13:01 14 Sep 17

Reply #646704

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

So DV & Ringwood in SEABL = how many teams total next season?


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Bear
Last year
13:06 14 Sep 17

Reply #646705

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

That would make it 19 clubs, not sure if every one has male/female teams, but currently 17 Associations/clubs.


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Anonymous
Last year
13:11 14 Sep 17

Reply #646707

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Wow, an odd & high number.

But this may mean they play 18 times only, once per team? and then alternate home/away the next season. It would be a solution to a long season. Thoughts?


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Bear
Last year
13:12 14 Sep 17

Reply #646708

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

They are split into two conferences anon^, not an issue...


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Anonymous
Last year
13:14 14 Sep 17

Reply #646710

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

I understand that. But with more teams the conferences may go by the wayside? I know other state leagues are looking at shortening season/amount of games.


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X
Last year
13:15 14 Sep 17

Reply #646711

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

How many teams will be in SCM and SCW? Surely they need more than 9 in the top division??


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Anonymous
Last year
13:17 14 Sep 17

Reply #646714

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

SEABL have two conferences, though Im sure I read they were doing away with that and making the season shorter, hope Im wrong, but if not that actually makes no sense if they are increasing the amount of teams, each team needs to play each other at least twice for H/A advantages, seems common sense is loosing ground at SEABL level.

it should be a system where those teams who consistently produce wins at BigvSC level can apply for consideration to move to SEABL, and those at SEABL level who constantly sit on the bottom can apply to move down to BigV sc or below


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Anonymous
Last year
13:29 14 Sep 17

Reply #646717

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

The obsession with "home grown" is that it should be they way clubs operate at the semi pro level.

Most senior teams are funded by the junior programs, then only for the senior teams to be full of players from other clubs who they had to out bid someone else for. A lot of money gets spent on these senior teams and very little is given back to the juniors.

I've seen many talented 19-22 year olds passed over to bring someone from another club in at that spot. Like playing the young kid the 5-10 minutes you give the new player is going to ruin the season.

How many clubs have been sucked dry trying to compete by buying players from other clubs?

Fill your team with locals/past juniors first, then plug in the holes with imports and recruits. Today the imports are the first signed and then the recruits and the locals/past juniors are the after thought.

Too many coaches come in bring their own players, give back very little to the club and juniors (usually burning bridges with people/sponsors along the way) then to move on and leave the club picking up the pieces.

Just my 0.02c


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Anonymous
Last year
14:10 14 Sep 17

Reply #646727

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

@Reality - Saying people being are obsessed with senior teams being "home Grown" is not the issue CEO's saying that SEABL is a great "PATHWAY" for our juniors when in reality (no pun) no junior from the club has a chance in hell of playing!!!!


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Luke
Last year
15:11 14 Sep 17

Reply #646742

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Many juniors simply aren't good enough to play in their clubs senior teams. And once finished age restricted basketball , players are competing with players several years older and more experienced, so there is simply not enough good players, and not enough spots. If a local player is GOOD enough, they will get a spot. Don't hand spots out.


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known
Last year
15:17 14 Sep 17

Reply #646743

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

There IS a place for juniors in SEABL. Its not like DV are abandoning their youth league teams like Frankston. Those kids will have time to develop until they are 23 and if they never make the transition then at least they had a fair go.


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Anon
Last year
15:43 14 Sep 17

Reply #646752

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Let them develop in youth league, this is the problem players want to run before they can walk


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Anonymous
Last year
16:12 14 Sep 17

Reply #646755

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Get rid of big v and scrap u20 vjbl and just have


Seabl-senior league (over 21)
Div 1
Sydney, Canberra, Albury, Bendigo, Ballarat, Geelong, Dandenong, Melbourne, Nunawading, Ringwood, Kilsyth, Frankston, Sandringham, Hobart, Launceston, COE.

Div 2
Smaller clubs.
Altona, waverly, Casey, Collingwood, hawthorn etc etc


Seabl-junior league (under 21)
Div 1
Div 2


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Flow
Last year
16:36 14 Sep 17

Reply #646760

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

SEABL is no longer 2 conferences


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Anonymous
Last year
07:24 15 Sep 17

Reply #646800

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

thats stupid then if they want to increase the amount of teams yet not have the two conferences


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Anonymous
Last year
12:24 15 Sep 17

Reply #646838

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Why? Each team plays the other once.


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Anonymous
Last year
12:55 15 Sep 17

Reply #646842

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

They need the home away for each team


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Anonymous
Last year
13:54 15 Sep 17

Reply #646847

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Alternate home and away every two seasons. They want to reduce the length of season plus add a lot more teams so it is the only way to do it.


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Anonymous
Last year
12:51 19 Sep 17

Reply #647115

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Confirmed Zoe Carr Head Coach Diamond Valley SEABL Women.


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Anonymous
Last year
21:55 19 Sep 17

Reply #647180

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Looks like more W's for all teams all around. Winner, winner....Welcome DV


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Reality
Last year
09:37 20 Sep 17

Reply #647191

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Home and Away from each team would be the best for league parity


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Anonymous
Last year
11:44 20 Sep 17

Reply #647204

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

So 20ish teams soon, therefore 19 opponents x 2 = 38 games a season. Not happening.


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Anonymous
Last year
11:45 20 Sep 17

Reply #647205

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Which makes the two division rumour sound legit, 10 teams per division = 9 opponents x 2 = 18 games/season. Also reduces the season which was another future goal.


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Anonymous
Last year
17:11 20 Sep 17

Reply #647239

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Makes no sense actually as they already have two conferences which they have said will go next season and now they are increasing the amount of teams
If they split into two divisions as opposed to two conferences how will the division be selected and will it really then be any different to those in the lower division from BigV sc


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Melbourne Boy
Last year
17:55 20 Sep 17

Reply #647242

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

20 teams
19 games
14 weeks
5 double headers


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Anonymous
Last year
18:23 20 Sep 17

Reply #647243

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Short season.


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Melbourne Boy
Last year
18:32 20 Sep 17

Reply #647244

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Thats what they want


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Melbourne Boy
Last year
18:39 20 Sep 17

Reply #647245

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

QBL is a shorter season


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Anonymous
Last year
20:47 20 Sep 17

Reply #647249

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Maybe too short now?


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Reality
Last year
08:54 21 Sep 17

Reply #647260

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

They want a condensed season to attract more Fringe and Bench NBL guys to the league.

Also hopefully better Imports as well


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Reality
Last year
10:37 21 Sep 17

Reply #647276

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Grant Wallace is the DV coach...his great SEABL coaching record in recent times speaks for itself.


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Anonymous
Last year
10:50 21 Sep 17

Reply #647278

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

you only have to look at who DV have as director of coaching to see why they choose such coaches to head their new elite programs lol...speaks volumes


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Reality
Last year
13:55 21 Sep 17

Reply #647308

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Good start to life is SEABL!


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Anon
Last year
08:33 27 Sep 17

Reply #647681

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

The coaches they have signed have proven results at others legit levels. I'm sure they will be fine.


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Reality
Last year
09:28 27 Sep 17

Reply #647710

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

SEABL particular in the men's game has change alot in the last 3/4 years. The style has changed with the succesful teams embracing the change and results showing.

Perhaps the coach will adjust accordingly as recent results show otherwise but we'll see.


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Anonymous
Last year
13:45 30 Dec 17

Reply #663514

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

"Confirmed Zoe Carr Head Coach Diamond Valley SEABL Women."

"Looks like more W's for all teams all around. Winner, winner....Welcome DV"


Yes they will be so terrible with magbegor scherf and wehrung Ive got them pencilled in for zero wins


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Anonymous
Last year
14:15 30 Dec 17

Reply #663515

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Men's team look very avg hopefully they add some more quality players. Luckily a few other teams also look poor this year


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Anonymous
Last year
14:39 30 Dec 17

Reply #663516

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

"Confirmed Zoe Carr Head Coach Diamond Valley SEABL Women."

"Looks like more W's for all teams all around. Winner, winner....Welcome DV"


Yes they will be so terrible with magbegor scherf and wehrung Ive got them pencilled in for zero wins

well Caps havent had much from these three, add to that a coach who was not exactly bagging the wins at Tigers last year, you may just have a few zeros to pencil after all lol


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Anonymous
Last year
15:14 30 Dec 17

Reply #663518

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

yes caps terrible. only team to beat perth in months


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Anonymous
Last year
15:35 30 Dec 17

Reply #663519

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Is Joel Spear signed at DV? Is he better than he showed at Albury last year?


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Anonymous
Last year
16:13 30 Dec 17

Reply #663521

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Not that bad imo.

Scherf
Wehrung
Magbegor
Gorman
Ayres
Gould
Smith
Whatman
Crupi


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Anonymous
Last year
17:26 30 Dec 17

Reply #663528

re: Diamond Valley join SEABL

Spear. NO better.


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