Anonymous
Years ago

NBA Defense, or lack thereof

Does anyone else think the NBA is becoming boring?

Granted it has the best of everything in the basketball world (the best players/athletes, coaches, highlights/big plays, arenas/facilities etc), but the recent changes to the game's officiating have made the defensive part of the game almost an after thought.

Instead of showing pride in stopping (or even slowing) their opponents, NBA teams focus little of their efforts defensively and simply try to out score one another in all out shoot-a-thons. This is evidenced by some of the ridiculous individual scoring we are seeing (Harden today with 60pts and 10assists, Booker with 70 last year and so forth) along with historic 3-point shooting numbers across the league.

But it’s not just on the perimeter, defence in the paint is for the most part awful too. I watched the Sixers vs Thunder game the other day and it had 15 dunks! 15 dunks woohoo, everyone loves dunks right!? True, but almost all of them were uncontested. On a few of the Westbrook ones, the defence he faced going to the rim was disgraceful... literally zero effort from the Sixers. It might as well have been a warmup layup line before the game.

In my opinion, the intensity shown by players (at both ends) was one of the central reasons basketball became such a popular sport to watch. Take away the D, and you only have half a game. Ultimately, I think this recent shift will be to the detriment of the game long term. Rant over :-)

Thoughts?

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Haz  
Years ago

I agree with all of that. NBA has become boring with its no defence approach. I was looking into team scoring averages, and comparing it to the early 2000' where defence was much more important and the scoring differences were huge.

This season pretty much every team is scoring over 100ppg with a good number averaging over 110ppg. 15 years ago there were teams struggling to get to 95ppg. Its opened up way too much and is just an offensive spectacle now.

Do players hold back on D to protect themselves from injury - and therefore protecting their multi million dollar contracts?

Ive pretty much lost intetest in watching the NBA now.

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Haz  
Years ago

Only 5 teams are averaging over 110ppg this season, but 28 of 30 teams are averaging over 100ppg. In 2003, only 2 teams averaged over 100ppg. Thats an obvious shift in focussing more on scoring. Watching the NBA is pretty boring when teams are only engaging on one half of the court.

Been off the NBA for a while now as the effort levels look lazy to me.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

They have intentionally biased the reffing strongly in favour of the offensive team in the name of entertainment and this is the result. More people than ever tune in but basketball purists start falling out of love with the game.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

agree. have been saying for years that americans don't defend in their league. i find nba boring and cant get into it that is why i reckon nbl is more exciting.

much more even competition thanks to the fact we actually defend.

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koberulz  
Years ago

I've barely watched an NBA game since the lockout.

Reply #669693 | Report this post


proud  
Years ago

I've mentioned on this site before that NBA is basically watching ISO plays every possession and when it's not it's Pick and rolls but it genuinely feels like you have a star player get the ball ignore his 4 team mates and then he puts up a stupid shot (sometimes they go in - and the commentators bang on about how he is unguardable) whilst his team mates have their backs turned to the ball and are already running down the other end of the court.

It doesn't feel like the players are trying to protect their multi-million dollar contracts (and lets face it almost everyone in NBA has made $2m or more) but I think the issue is the schedule and the 82 game season, that won't change but when you have sports science people (that are ruining all kinds of other sports) they are bound to try and discourage any player from overexerting themselves as they have to play 4 games a week for 5-6 months, it's why the average player in today's NBA look like they are wearing pyjamas under their uniform, it's aesthetically ugly.

The ONLY reason to watch NBA is to see your team or to watch Australian/New Zealand players and be biased in hoping they succeed even if they are facing one another and that just ain't basketball

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MACDUB  
Years ago

I struggle to be amazed by personal statistics now; back in the day when you saw players like Nash, Bryant, Iverson and Lebron (2007 performance vs Pistons for example) (and even T.Parker for me) you were amazed and in awe. Nash averaged 18 and 10 his MVP year (which is very low in the modern NBA); yet watching him play was magical.

Now players like Westbrook and Harden (with all due respect) and others can rack up assists quite easily without making too difficult of passes or doing anything
ridiculously special apart from the odd crazy pass/rack up easy rebounds too/and get easy points from the FT line and/or bad defence. Feels like their numbers are just a product of ball usage and high ball retention. And I get particularly bored by the love with the 3 point game to the extent I refuse to watch GSW games/Curry highlights.

[Saying that however, Harden's performance yesterday was crazy, although I didn't watch it]

Maybe I just grew up; who knows? Sport probably always feels more magical when you're watching as a kid/teenager.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

It's easy to look at the scoring averages and just say there's no defense being played, as the averages have gone up.
However, the pace of play has skyrocketed, and furthermore, offenses are just ridiculously efficient these days in the analytical era, and it is borderline impossible to stop.

I find the ISO comment interesting, given its usage is dropping dramatically in favour of the ball movement offenses, again which is a lot harder for defenses to stop, leading to more efficient offense.

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paul  
Years ago

Agree to an extent with anon above, especially about a lot of NBA teams now running better team offences, but it's important to note that good defensive teams can make it difficult for opponents to play at pace. Some (GSW, Adelaide as examples) actually want oppo to play quick, but that doesn't work for everyone.

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Isaac  
Years ago

More three pointers would open up the court a bit and make it harder to pack in and defend effectively. Plus there are some very team-oriented and difficult to defend offences being run by the smarter teams.

I don't have time to watch entire games so can't judge more than that. We have a TV and League Pass in the office but mostly just watch close finishes to games.

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Reality  
Years ago

Its only getting worse with teams only really putting in come playoff time when scouting etc is better and the players have more time to lock in


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Alpha  
Years ago

The rules are such to improve the offencive efficiency and in general pace of the game so it is more entertaining, these rules don't help defence at all - no real defensive help, no split line defence, no real trapping; just iso play and even pick and roll is frequently used to create a mismatch for a ball handler.

As Reality said - probably worth watching during playoffs.

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Smith  
Years ago

Agree.

The americans whinge about players like Delly because he actually plays D.

I like the hustle and scrap of the NBL but still can't quite stop watching the NBA either.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

It's because Kawhi's injured.

Seriously though, I think there needs to be a shift back to a better balance between offence and defence because it really does diminish the excitement of the game. I mean they changed the all-star game format because the score last year was what? 192-182 or something? And that was with literally no defence being played, so when you're getting scores like 148-128 (Cavs-OKC, IIRC), I think it's reasonable to wonder how much worse it can get. And I don't think the balance would be that hard to find. The freedom of movement adjustments for ball-handlers are good and I think to go back to seeing guys just being constantly held and jostled on the perimeter would be disappointing. But why not eliminate the defensive 3 second rule? Let teams at least mix up switch-heavy man coverages with some zone stuff that challenges the offence to decide whether they're going to settle in the mid-range, finish against a decent contest, or find a genuinely good pass. Or change the foul rules so that offensive players have similar cylinder/verticality constraints as the defence. If contact occurs outside the cylinder of the offensive player, it can't be a common foul - only flagrant if that's warranted. The offensive player's cylinder could be defined instantaneously, rather than facing the same "established position" hurdle as the defence. That would most affect Harden's ridiculous flailing, but it would make it easier for refs not to reward the leg-kicking jump shooters and other drama queens.

You could also call travels like the recently scrapped fiba interpretation, so that offensive guys didn't get a freaking runway everytime they want to make a play, but obviously that's never going to happen.

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Rabbit41  
Years ago

Yeah, it's gotten boring. Absolutely no defense at all.

NCAA and pretty much every decent international league play stronger and more physical defense.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Agreed 100%
People mention tempo of games, but defensive efficiency numbers (which include pace) last season and this season show that for the first time in NBA history no team has a defensive efficiency below 1.

I blame in large part of this on the Warriors. No doubt every team is trying to copy them with pace and 3 point shooting. Problem is, no team has the skill set to take advantage of it like the Warriors.

I have never seen a team completely fool and trick the entire league into playing the way they want them to play.

There is also a culture of that because there are so many possesions, why waste energy defending when you can just get it back on the other end.

The OP is right, there is no intensity in games.

That is why i dont get excited when i see the numbers Ben Simmons puts up.

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MACDUB  
Years ago

NCAA would be the best league to watch in the world if it didn't have so many timeouts/stoppages.

The idea that you can have 14-16 total timeouts in 40 minutes of play is laughable (but obviously the TV/sponsors are paying good cash).

Europe would be great to watch too if it got more coverage over these ways.

Better than NBA IMO anyway.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Agree with nearly all the sentiments expressed above - I don't watch the NBA anymore but love the NBL, and prefer watching college over the NBA, and even Euro leagues.

A few factors responsible for my lack of interest in the NBA:

- In an 82 game season no individual game means anything. Teams can write off entire months and know that talent will normally 'correct' their record over a long season - you may as well simulate the seasons on NBA Live. The physical toll of getting through a season also obviously means players are very rarely going at 100%, and hardly ever on defense.
- Compare that to the NBL, or college, where an (approx) 30 game season seems to be the perfect amount. Each game means enough, teams are usually close in standings, and as a result half the league doesn't put the cue in the rack halfway through the season. (If the NBA insists on keeping with 82 games they should at least go to a season-end tournament for some of the lower playoff seeds, which would drive interest in the waning months of the season and raise the costs of tanking).
- Rule changes in the past 15 years, as discussed above, have obviously benefited offense more than defence in an attempt to make the game 'more exciting'. Yes, this has resulted in an army of 13 year olds in Steph Curry jerseys hoisting 40 footers, but I do agree that for people who know and love basketball, there is less and less to appreciate in an average NBA game.
- Lesser contributing factor: 'copy the winner' mentality which has lots of teams trying to play like GSW, when very few have the personnel and talent to do so. This can be great to watch, but tiring when everyteam plays like this and leads to a general emphasis on the offensive side.

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swish  
Years ago

At last someone else is saying what I've been thinking for the past few years. The NBA is more about entertainment than about competition. The lack of intensity, the lack of ball movement, the lack of player movement. No wonder NBA players struggle with NBL. They have much more natural athletisism throughout the league, but as has been said earlier, it seems they play too many games to care about them all. I's much rather watch a bunch of kids who are playing for their lives than watch uncontested dunks, wide open 3's.
The NBL teams play to win every game. Its a really good league that jsut needs 3 - 4 more teams to give us more variety. But we can't afford to drop the standard.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Would you want to watch Mournings Heat vs Ewings Knicks and have a 69-67 game. All for defence, but offence sells.

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Duke Fan  
Years ago

History means I continue to watch the Lakers, couldn't really be bothered with other games. Will have it on if there's nothing else to watch

Much prefer college ball and record every game available

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Shot clock to long in college ball, like watching grass grow.

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koberulz  
Years ago

NCAA would be the best league to watch in the world if it didn't have so many timeouts/stoppages.
There's also the slave labour thing.

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ferdterguson  
Years ago

I just finished watching a game from 1990 on VCR. Warriors beat the Nuggets 162-158 in regulation. Not a lot of defense was played unfortunately.

Back to the great games we get to watch in the modern era for me. Can't wait for Bucks v Timberwolves tomorrow.



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Proud  
Years ago

Much like with cricket where the rules have favoured batting over bowling, NBA has favoured the offends over the defence.

But my one last gripe and this may make me sound like a really old man of 33 but I'm sick and tired of hearing how so many players "are future hall of famers" it feels like most NBA games they are giving that accolade to one or more players and then you watch the player and the lack of defense and you so wish that Charles Oakley was still around to knock them on their arse and talk some trash to them... not enough scary locker room leaders and demand everyone plays to their standards (think Damien Martin or Mika Vukona in NBL)

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Anonymous  
Years ago

The game is very boring to watch now and if I didn't bet on games I wouldn't watch. It just seems like there are many teams who know they will make playoffs and getting one extra home game in a 7 match series means very little these days so you have teams coasting for the season trying not to get injuries and not caring if they finish 3rd or 6th. Obviously you don't want to come 7th or 8th because you will be matched up against the very best of teams in the first round.
The players seem happy to put on entertaining high scoring games for the fans pick up a healthy pay check and only get serious come playoffs time.
My prediction- once playoffs start bet heavily on low match scores

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Anonymous  
Years ago

CJ McCollum 50 points in 28 minutes. LOL

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Anonymous  
Years ago

#840 I think that's a pretty sound idea, especially games 1 and 2 when the defensive game plans will be new looks for the offences. Especially GSW, Boston, Minnesota, Toronto and Spurs, at a guess. Not sure that Houston and OKC have the tools to up the ante by a huge amount defensively and that could be Houston's undoing.

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JohnJames  
Years ago

i love how the logic is
more points scored = less defense played

if you compare eras like that then lets look at other stat categories as well

Since 2000
3pt attempts have doubled
this season = 30 points per game from 3pt line
2000 = 14.4 points per game from 3pt line
(+15.6ppg)
*3pt% has only increased 1% since 2000 so its not like more or less defense has been added to change this*

Pace (possessions in a game)
has gone up by 6 per game (league average)
which means an extra 2 or 3 ppg as well (assume teams are shooting 42%)

so on average thats an extra 18.6 ppg based on increased speed and more 3s attempted and made

Yet the league average ppg has only increased by 10... maybe the defenses have improved as well.. its just not physical, punch up defense
maybe the defense is more about speed, technique, positioning? food for thought

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UseTaHoop  
Years ago

JohnJames

So how to compare eras then?

Close analysis of equivalent games (stage of season, teams' standings) using time sampling/ sampling of possessions at similar stages of the game???

Closer stats analysis??.

Different methodologies would probably yield different conclusions.

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JohnJames  
Years ago

well you have to look at the stats deeper than just
Xppg determines defensive output

There are more factors
the NBA offer great tools for data analysis which has shaped the game into a more efficient version

like eg teams shoot 1.5% worse from 3pt line than midrange but the extra point you get negates the -1.5% so teams now take more 3s for the extra point. It is more efficient.

look at Defensive Rebounding, SAC are the worst with 30 D boards this season, in 2001 they would have been tied 11th

but if you look at the league in terms of points off offensive rebounds the numbers are almost identical showing that the higher pace and shot selections make teams more efficient with less offensive rebounding

look deeper into the stats

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Bear  
Years ago

I will play devil's advocate then and say I disagree that the NBA is boring, because already this season I have seen so many great athletic blocks, only able to be done by NBA players at the rate they are able to do it per game.

Already this season I have seen unbelievable plays, super alley-oop dunks and jams that would smash old time back boards in the days of Shaq' and M.J.

Sure, there are always games where things seem a little more subdued, but the sheer amount of teams and high volume of games means they play more than any other league, at the highest possible level and can do the most amazing things on court!

Boring, nope, amazing but sometimes not quite for the purists, sure...

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