Taylor kept his place because Moller is out injured, I'm certain the kings would prefer to have Moller out there fit and playing. Cook was not ready to play this week but hopefully Cook and Moller will be available next week and Taylor will be gone.
Lisch's birth certificate says America. He is not Australian. Five imports. Did he give up us US citizenship or is he a dual citizen now? I can go to China and do some test and pledge my allegiance to their country, but guess what, I'm still not Chinese. Just calling a spade a spade. Lisch is American.
Lisch is naturalised. So was fisher reshape and grace. It's topics like this that make it so much sweeter when the cats lose. Their fan base is full arrogant jerks.
Keep on trucking, you’re making up the numbers this season. And I’m not a kings fan, just anti Cats.
Said so well.
I remember some Perth numpty worried about what the Kings would do to them in another topic.
Now the same idiot will be gloating and calling the Kings Violet Crumbles again.
Shame that no Perth fans understand what that is in reference too.
Gee Kings owner Paul Smith is quiet on Twitter today. He came to town bagging everything about Perth up to game time then...nothing? Sounds like he's happy to drum up the hate and banter until his team gets their arses handed to them. Not even a sportmanlike 'too good tonight for us' tweet.
He might be investigating whether they can get a rule change to switch last night's L to a W.
Two years ago
"Lisch's birth certificate says America. He is not Australian. Five imports. Did he give up us US citizenship or is he a dual citizen now? I can go to China and do some test and pledge my allegiance to their country, but guess what, I'm still not Chinese. Just calling a spade a spade. Lisch is American."
To be an Australian you have to have Australian citizenship.
I was born overseas. So were my forefathers for 4 generations (i was the 5th). Before that we (obviously) came from elsewhere. That elsewhere is the Nationality we always claimed until we naturalized in Australia, as a family. I am Australian. Further, if I went to china and took Chinese citizenship, I would (also) be Chinese.
(I was taken aback by this comment so went straight to "replies". If others have written on this, I haven't read them yet. Hope I do see others objecting to this sort of rubbish).
what the hell is wrong with people? Someone starts a thread about Sydney, and immediately you all start carrying on about Perth. You need to seek professional help, your obsession with Perth is unhealthy.
For what its worth, I think there is a lack of transparency around these rules.
I had no problem with Sydney using an import slot to replace Lisch, but it starts to stink when he replaces a bench player.
The other problem I have, and I suspect the reason this was originally prohibited, is that it starts to look like you just have an extra player on your team. You have 12 players instead of of 11 (ignoring next stars) and only play the 12th man for injuries. How can you say that is within the rules?
I questioned it when Perth did it with Dech, using him to replace Cotton and Martin. But that was Dech, somebody unable to get a game otherwise. Not a highly paid import.
Sydney's weakness has always been the age of their players. That goes out the window if they're allowed to keep extra players on tap.
Also, whilst I think it is great that we are seeing Expat Marquee players coming home, I think it needs to be an either/or. I don't think teams should be allowed to stack their teams with the cream of Aussie talent, and then hire 3 (4) imports on top.
I think its pretty clear re the Kings and their imports though. Lisch has played for the Boomers and is naturalised, Louzada is through the Next Stars program and doesn't count against the import cap as is the case with Hampton and Ball. Then Taylor, Tate and Ware are the imports. Thus three imports, If any Perf supporters want I can dumb it down a bit more for them though.
Two years ago
If people stopped biting on the "four imports" crap, then people would stop putting it out there... but until then...
The last couple of posts have been bigly common sense... I agree that some transparency would be great, as previously, other times players (not even imports) haven't been able to switch to be a replacement for another player... Also, the fact that Taylor is replacing Moller and yes, I know they TECHNICALLY have an import spot free, it's still pretty poor form, considering how they're testing the boundaries as it is...
I'd rather have promoted a young kid temporarily as Taylor has been useless anyways...
"I think its pretty clear re the Kings and their imports though. Lisch has played for the Boomers and is naturalised, Louzada is through the Next Stars program and doesn't count against the import cap as is the case with Hampton and Ball. Then Taylor, Tate and Ware are the imports. Thus three imports,"
OMG, you can't honestly be that fucking retarded?
You think you're the only one who understands the rules?
When people refer to "4 imports" it's called sarcasm. Look it up you dumb piece of shit.
"Tate had a good year but is also a budget import, Taylor was sacked by Adelaide and is super budget import."
Thanks for officially confirming that Sydney Fans are the most delusional on the planet.
So your logic is that teams can have as many imports as they want, as long as they are crabs? I'll be sure to let Joey know.
I can absolutely, positively, guarantee you, that Sydney hasn't spent the money they have, assembled the team they have, and hired a coach from American, only to skimp out and save a couple of bucks on their starting forward. Tate is no more budget than most of the other imports. Just because he is probably getting less than Cotton & Ware, doesn't make him budget. Especially not when he could be playing in Europe.
Okay, Taylor was the best we could afford at the time, and he is rubbish for an import, but that doesn't necessarily mean he is cheap. Remember that Sydney had to buy out his contract, so he must have been on decent coin and Sydney must have offered him more.
Taylor also highlights the other problem.
Taylor FAILS to get drafted and he's an Import.
Did DOES get drafted and he's not an Import???
yeah, and Adelaide smashed Perth. And Melbourne smashed Adelaide. And Cairns smashed Melbourne. And Illawarra smashed Cairns. And Brisbane smashed Illawarra. And New Zealand were just smashed on their flights. So what is your point? Not a cupcake league? Despite the clear cheating, they are not expected to go flawless? Do you think that Perth could take them in a best of 5? Put down the pipe and stop responding to every friggin thread.
Two years ago
Would really love to take all the "oh em gee, the Kings are spending so much money" trolls on a personal tour of Auburn Basketball Centre and its glorious surrounds so you can see just how "lavish", lavish really is.
For those playing along, Auburn is the ghetto. It's pretty much Beirut circa 1987. The stadium is old as the Earth and is smack bang in the ghetto. It's as working class as you can get.
Bogut was stated as saying the group wanted that as it had character, and so that "the development guys weren't paying $25" to park at Qudos bank arena, etc. If they're going budget with the core things like where they train and spend 85% of their time, what's the likelihood that they're splurging elsewhere? Habits are habits across the board. They do recovery at Bogut's house don't they? LOL.
Trollers gonna troll.
Two years ago
My point is, choosing to base yourself at Auburn speaks volume of the mindset.
Comments like "we don't really want players paying $25-100 each training session to park at Qudos" tells you where their minds are at.
Character doesn't have an off switch etc, if they're frugal/conservative in one aspect, it's not far fetched to think that that's the mentality across the spectrum of the culture.
I know it's easy to hate but dig deep and look at all their little tidbits like emphasising "no phones during team time", stringent group expectations on when you can be expected to miss a team commitment (I think Bogut said something along the lines of "you can for a funeral or a birth, but a wedding, no".
This team seems to adopt that sort of mindset - it's very different to last year.
Bill Beaver you are a mildly entertaining piss take account. Well I hope so for your own sake. Tell us more about Auburn Basketball Centre and its lack of paid parking as it's really gripping stuff which helps us deep dive into the 2019-20 Sydney Kings frugal culture.
The stadium at auburn is old but it's OK, not glamorous so what. It’s actually closer to Lidcombe than Auburn. Like all Sydney you can’t buy a two bedroom unit in the area for under 650g and it’s certainly not the rough and tumble area it was in the past.
It’s the only stadium that doesn’t come under basketball nsw clutches and has the best finances of all nsw clubs.
Kings are run on business lines this season and I’d be surprised if there in the top two spending clubs.
Cats fans up high and mighty like their team isn't bought, and they develop all their own local talent. Let’s have a look. Well straight away Cotton, White, and Hunt are Americans. We all know they poached Kay and Norton from the development club Hawks, and had to outbid MU for Kay. Hmmm, Majook a journeyman, Steindl cut his teeth in FNQ. Even Martin a former Razorback who followed Bevo over to Perth when they went belly up. Who does that leave? Starting centre Vague? Wagstaff? Hardly built. Geez who woulda thought in a professional league, a bunch of mercenaries.
Even Martin a former Razorback who followed Bevo over to Perth when they went belly up.I'm surprised the Wildcats could afford to poach him in 2010 given his stellar NBL resume to that point. How they managed to outbid the NBA and Euro teams who were doubtless chasing his signature is beyond me. He'd played two full seasons at that point, and I think he even started some of those games. It's not often you find a player with that good a resume.
Reasoning with a cats fan is pointless..
Just wait when Cotton is naturalized and they'll be all smug about it. But then another import on another team will do the same and they’ll be cheating too.
Let’s remember 2014/15 season
Drake U’u - USA
Earnest Ross - USA
DeAndre Daniels - USA
Jermaine Beal - USA
Shawn Redhage - USA
And that was back when it was only a ten man squad.
They did it years ago, but now sydney do it an it’s cheats.
Now watch some cats fan break this down to show why it isn’t the same
Who signed first, Wesley or Ross? I can't even remember. I do remember nobody caring about Wesley, and everyone being outraged about Ross, so I'm not sure where the notion comes from that it was perfectly fine back then but suddenly an outrage now.
It's also worth noting that nobody changed the rules specifically so the Wildcats could sign any of those players, and I haven't seen anyone complaining about Kendall Stephens and Terry Armstrong playing (well, being on the roster) for SEM.
Angus, I know your ass is sore after all those years following the Kings, but you need to get over it and stop crying.
Doing something that contravenes the rules, especially when done to gain an unfair advantage, is cheating.
It's not "Only Cheating if you get caught."
If you break the rules (whether or not you are caught or penalised) that is Cheating.
If you break the rules, and for whatever reason the league doesn't penalise you, that is still Cheating.
If you break the rules, and for some bizarre reason the league says "yeah cool, whatever" that is still Cheating against the other teams.
Cheating can also be violating the spirit of the rules.
If a team went out and hired 6 current NBA players offering them $20M each per season, would that be ok?
The combination of the soft cap and marquee rules, was designed to improve the quality of the league as a whole, and bring back Aussie stars that would otherwise be playing in Europe of China. It wasn't meant to only benefit the Kings. I really don't think it's fair that one team gobble up all the expat talent, then sign 3 imports on top, including poaching the best players from elsewhere.
Didi did not qualify as a Next Star. Simple and straightforward. At any other time, and for any other team, he would be an import.
Its cheating, pure and simple.
Having the league come out, after he was signed, and say "oh yeah, we changed the rules and just forgot to tell anyone but Sydney" does not make it any less cheating.
Whichever way you want to cut and slice it, Sydney have cheated on the 5-man cap. And please spare me your bullshit theories about how everyone at Sydney is playing for minimum wage. Just look at the benches around the league and in fact look at Sydneys own bench.
You dont sign guys like Walker, Hunter, and Kuany, unless you are hard up against the cap.
Using an import to replace Lisch was fine. Using an import to replace one of your capped bench players is cheating.
Signing Cooks is just taking the piss.
As somebody said, whats next?
Typical Cats fans, spouting rubbish as if fact!
The League knows where Didi is from and his credentials. The League allowed it, so anyone with a brain would take that opportunity. The League okayed it - no rules broken - no cheating. How dense are you Cats fans?
Lisch is naturalised. Just like Grace, Crawford, Fisher, Redhege... Was that cheating? What if Cotton naturalises? Is that cheating? How dense are you Cats fans?
Throw around numbers that you have no proof of. Show me one bit of evidence that goes beyond you simply theorising. Just one bit? You can't. Pure speculation. Just choosing want you want to believe with leaps of logic. How about Nick 800 Kay? See anyone can play this stupid game. How dense are you Cats fans?
Taylor being an injury replacement? The League okayed it. Not like Sydney is trying to pass him off as Deshon’s twin brother. Plus he’s rubbish! How dense are you Cats fans?
And to top it all off, Sydney get smashed both games over the weekend - I thought there was no parity. But when Perth had the advantage of bull "loyalty" points and turned the league into a two team league with NZ national team you never complained about parity. The other teams were just there to lay out a red carpet for Perth and NZ for the least competitive era of the NBL. Seriously, how dense are you Cats fans?
The irony of telling me to stop crying, while spewing utter bullshit through your cries of unfairness... Hunter, Bruce, Moller, Waxy, and Kickert likely all reasonably within the limit, considering two of those guys were almost out of the league, one is an unheralded rookie, Kickert would hardly have been in demand after last season, and Moller would not be on a significant amount either, being lured back home to Sydney for more mins after being glued to United's bench. You have zero knowledge that proves otherwise, just assumptions based on the kings position on the ladder and how unfair it seems to you.
And I love to hear a (presumably) Wildcats fan talk about violating the spirit of the rules. Jeezus. Redhage made Goulding look like Tim Duncan in comparison to how he carried on on the court.
so many posters working in nbl team accounting departments. they know all the figures and have all the proof beyond hearsay and whatever they want to believe to fuel their conspiracy. cook will probably come in and be horrible anyway like taylor, the kings will kangz, perth will win again and their fans will carry on like spaz and they wont care about parity and the little man then just convince themselves of their moral superiority because their players play for nothing and kings will sign 6 imports next year and still kangz. the world will keep turning.
[Kickert would hardly have been in demand after last season,]
Except Kickert signed a 2 year deal in April 2018, off the back of a 2017-18 season where he averaged 14ppg at 52% from the field, the 13th highest scorer in the entire NBL that season higher than the likes of Newbill, Kay, Newley, Sobey, Wesley....
"Red (army) tinted glasses show no problems here.
They all played for free to and for the love of the game no championships bought here derp"
The sad thing is that you probably dont even realise how big a moron you are..
For all the period you're referring too, Perth complied with a fixed salary cap, and with a completely transparent points cap.
U'u and Ross were scrubs, barely decent SBL-level players.
But don't logic get in the way of a good Perf Rant hey?
You think that despite a fixed salary, and a points system that allowed everyone to see how each player was rated, that Perf somehow cheated.
But with no control, and no transparency, you would have us believe that Sydney are hardly over the cap at all.
All the hype over Didi hasn't matched performance, one great preseason game and one against Perth are the really only above ordinary displays. He probably doesn’t deserve a starting spot. Don’t get me started on Taylor, while he has busted his nut he just not very good. Tate Moller and Bruce have been the surprise packets, budget import, player looking for more time and an uncontracted player no one wanted. None of them would be on big money. Kickett contract was a kings option which they probably negotiated down if they wanted to as no one else would have taken him. Hardly star studded roster there.
LV you might want to look at your own roster before y start throwing stone.
I stand corrected on Kickert
Kings bottom 5 could be under the $514,800
Still, the Kings have a massive free kick with an NBA draftee giving them a 4th import, ie: a 20 year old who's already played 2 professional seasons in Brazil, a FIBA World Cup and the NBA Summer League. Not an 18 year kid like Lamelo or RJ Hampton.
So their bottom 5 are effectively 8 to 12, instead of 7 to 11. 4 imports instead of 3 (not technically an import, but if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, etc....) All of this makes a massive difference.
None of us really know, but they look like the most expensive roster in history to me, with a nice freeby helping them along, 4th import in a 3 import league.
Again, we all know Didi's history, the League knows, they approved it, they make the rules. Where’s the cheating? Kings just taking advantage of the rules in place. Nothing stopping Perth or any other team doing the same. Though I agree it would be better if the bottom 4/5 teams had first dibs on Next Stars.
Kings aren't cheating, just taking advantage of dubious rules
The soft cap has a purpose, the Next Stars program has a purpose, but I draw the line at having an NBA player with pre existing professional, national team and summer league experience, essentially a player on loan from his NBA club, but being exempt from being called an import.
[The soft cap has a purpose, the Next Stars program has a purpose, but I draw the line at having an NBA player with pre existing professional, national team and summer league experience, essentially a player on loan from his NBA club, but being exempt from being called an import.]
And, the NBL pays some of the players salary, and said player is essentially a 12th player who is totally excluded from the usual salary rules eg bottom 5.
Few changes required for next season, this is a bit of a joke
Two years ago
Apart from the Didi signing, I don't see a problem (and I'm a Cats fan), everyone's trying to win the chip, Kings are just working harder and doing a better job at it. That still doesn't mean they win the chip and this weekend we saw that they aren't invincible. Cairns have done some damage against the top teams, but lack of experience will stop them from being contenders in the finals if they take that 4th spot, it would however give a little scare to whoever finishes on top if they continue this form. would love to see how Wani is going to fit into the Cats rotation.
Title takes a team hitting perfect form at finals and a lot of luck.
What is it with people, still carrying on about Perf? If this weekend just past proves anything its that they are the one team you don't have to worry about
I am an Adelaide fan, and the weekend before will probably be the highlight of the season. But I think I have cause to be worried.
I have always respected the Wildcats, we have had a great rivalry over the years, and I think in recent years Joey has done a bang up job. Took us to the GF in 2014, made us the dominant team in 2017, and deserved to win in 2018.
Joey pioneered the Next Stars concept, except that ours was classified as an import. He has better US contacts than any other NBL coach, but we can't afford to spend so much money.
Teams like ours now face an uphill battle.
I know that that have always tended to be dominant teams in the NBL, but they come and go, wax and wain. Go back to 2017, before the rot really set in. The top 4 was Adelaide, Perth, Illawarra, and Cairns. Thats the NBL that were never going to see again.
Sydney are just going nuts. Melbourne arent far behind, and if this season doesnt work out they will up their game again. Perth are already outspending the rest of us, so what happens when they decide to kick it up a notch????
SEM will get Wesley naturalised, axe Benson, and hire a couple of guns. Thats your top right there. If were lucky we can nip at their heals and try to make the playoffs once in a blue moon.
Plus how long do you think guys like Joey will put up with this nonsense? Soon only those big 4 will be able to attract a decent coach.
So much for their frugality playing at Auburn:
Smoke forces Kings to find back-up home
Source: AAP News (by Matt Encarnacion) - Tuesday, 10 December, 2019
Sydney Kings coach Will Weaver has revealed how the thick smoke blanketing the city has forced the NBL club to consider alternative training bases.
The league leaders proceeded with their two-hour run at Auburn Basketball Centre on Tuesday despite the dilapidated venue being filled with smoke.
But more forecasts for poor air quality has prompted the franchise to look at holding temporary sessions at Qudos Bank Arena.
"The thing that's most salient to me is how lucky we are to be considering it as an inconvenience for our training," Weaver told AAP on Tuesday.
"As opposed to all the people who are actually dealing with it in a real way."
However the former NBA assistant did admit the Kings staff were surprised at how the smoke had seeped into the indoor venue in Sydney's west.
Three giant fans were used in attempt to air out the stadium.
The club's sports science team will now decide whether to continue preparations for Saturday's match against Melbourne United at Qudos Bank Arena.
"If it continues like this, and we have the expectation it might be this bad again, we're going to train at Qudos rather than train here," Weaver said.
"Only because it's inside and there's not as much as exposure to it."
The Kings had previously based themselves at the Sydney Olympic Park venue but shifted to Auburn this year due to accessibility issues.
Franchise owners spent some money to recently refurbish a team kitchen, locker room and players' lounge, while a paint job is also on the horizon.
Weaver, who came from arguably the NBA's best facilities in Brooklyn, admitted being surprised by the lack of basketball-centric venues in Sydney.
A number of locals were waiting for Andrew Bogut and Casper Ware wrap up their extras before using the court on Tuesday afternoon.
The Kings have been largely considered the league's glamour club, but Weaver has learnt to embrace building a home in the city's blue-collar region.
"The outside of the building, the inside, it's nothing beautiful to look at. But it's representative of the hard work we're trying to do," he said.
"We're not trying to be some glamour program. It's a nice place where a lot of the kids and teams are playing before and after we get on and off.
"There's a lot of opportunities for us to remain centred and not lose track of ourselves and think that we're some kind of jet-setters."
LOL. Making it seem like they are spending millions on Auburn. Err, no. The place is a dump. Spending a few bucks on trying to make it semi-habitable is all they are doing.
Again, rich coming from fans of an organisation that has its own great facility with courts and team offices and an awesome gym next door.
The smoke in Sydney is on Beijing levels, you can't even open your house windows. People are wearing masks in the street. It’s f..king hazardous, I don’t see a problem here.
Some people have to get a life, f..k me there nearly turning me into a kings supporter.
"Again, rich coming from fans of an organisation that has its own great facility with courts and team offices and an awesome gym next door."
No one was going to mention Auburn until some other twat brought it into the discussion as if it was evidence that the Kings aren't spending big on their playing roster.
If Cats are not in front, than its a conspiracy against the Cats evidently. A team uses all the resources it has available and apparently that's cheating. They would rather dominate the broke ass league of the early-2010s than a league that is exciting and competitive.
No one was going to mention Auburn until some other twat brought it into the discussion as if it was evidence that the Kings aren't spending big on their playing roster.
Exactly. I found it funny coming across the article about them bailing on Auburn (after retro fitting it) to Qudos which was the exact premise the twat had for arguing the Kings were being frugal. Hilarious timing.
Two years ago
Typical Perth fans, literally fire surrounding Sydney and all they want to do is put the boot in because a team dare challenge them.
This is a very interesting POV.
If there is a fire in Sydney, then we can never make a negative comment about anything with the word Sydney in it.
Scratch that, it's not interesting at all, it's asinine.
Advertise on Hoops to a very focused, local and sports-keen audience. Email for rates and options.
- Updated every 15 minutes
Wed 8:34- re: Brisbane v Sydney Jan26
Wed 8:24- re: Adelaide v NZ Jan27
Wed 7:59- Recommended for You only
Wed 7:57- re: NH: Australia Day, or In...
Wed 7:38- re: Adelaide v NZ Jan27
Wed 7:22- re: High school players in t...
Wed 0:13- re: Brisbane v Sydney Jan26
Wed 0:07- re: Cairns v Melbourne Jan 2...
Tue 23:23- re: Iconic Bryant Workout, A...
Tue 23:12- re: Brisbane v Sydney Jan26
Tue 23:02- re: Cairns v Melbourne Jan 2...
Tue 22:43- re: Brisbane v Sydney Jan26
Tue 22:21- re: Cairns v Melbourne Jan 2...
Tue 22:17- re: Ben Simmons 'doubtful' t...
Tue 21:52- re: Brisbane v Sydney Jan26
Tue 21:29- re: NH: Australia Day, or In...
Tue 21:28- re: NH: Australia Day, or In...
Tue 21:24- re: Is Today THE Day for Bry...
Tue 20:58- re: Brisbane v Sydney Jan26
Tue 20:57- re: Is Today THE Day for Bry...
Tue 20:29- re: Is Today THE Day for Bry...
Tue 20:01- re: NH: Australia Day, or In...
Tue 19:52- re: Is Today THE Day for Bry...
Tue 19:49- re: NH: Australia Day, or In...
Tue 19:44- re: Brisbane v Sydney Jan26
Tue 19:31- re: NH: Australia Day, or In...
Tue 19:28- re: Does any Import get cut ...
Tue 19:27- re: Brisbane v Sydney Jan26
Tue 19:26- re: Ben Simmons 'doubtful' t...
Tue 19:25- re: Ben Simmons 'doubtful' t...
Tue 19:03- re: NH: Australia Day, or In...
Tue 19:02- re: Ben Simmons 'doubtful' t...
Tue 18:53- re: Jonah Bolden to Sydney K...
Tue 18:50- re: Is Today THE Day for Bry...
Tue 18:47- re: Is Today THE Day for Bry...
Tue 18:45- re: Is Today THE Day for Bry...
Tue 18:42- re: Brisbane v Sydney Jan26
Tue 18:40- re: Is Today THE Day for Bry...
Tue 18:28- re: Brisbane v Sydney Jan26
Tue 18:25- re: Brisbane v Sydney Jan26
Tue 18:19- re: Is Today THE Day for Bry...
Tue 18:19- re: Brisbane v Sydney Jan26
Tue 18:12- re: Is Today THE Day for Bry...
Tue 18:10- re: Iconic Bryant Workout, A...
Tue 18:08- re: Cairns v Melbourne Jan 2...
Tue 18:04- re: Iconic Bryant Workout, A...
Tue 17:48- re: Is Today THE Day for Bry...
Tue 17:46- re: Is Today THE Day for Bry...
Tue 17:12- re: R2: Sixers v New Zealand...
Tue 17:11- re: Brisbane v Sydney Jan26
An Australian basketball forum covering NBL, WNBL, ABL, Juniors plus NBA, WNBA, NZ, Europe, etc | Forum time is: 9:07 am, Wed 27 Jan 2021 | Posts: 856,867 | Last 7 days: 1,235