Last year

Should Wellington Saints be team 11?

So many kiwis about these days...
Should team 11 be Wellington?



S.E Melbourne




Te Rangi



Overseas pro

Overseas college potential nbl

Well over 30 guys there and I'm sure I’ve missed a few...

Topic #47276 | Report this topic

Last year

I believe so generally. Really capture that NZ bball market with a good rivalry

Reply #807472 | Report this post

Last year

Been discussed at length before, and yes IMHO 2nd NZ would be great.
The (previous??) owner of the Saints tried a couple of times to get this up, but couldn't get NBL agreement.
Originally, Sengstock rejected the bid as it didn't fit his BS "Community" model. Then I think in later years, the ownership didn't have the wealth to sustain an LK model.

It would be great to:
Create some rivalry WITHIN NZ,
create competition for, and split, the "Tall Blacks" talent pool,
create a new doomsday double, with teams travelling to NZ playing two games.

But the issues remain the same.
You need the government to stump up for a decent venue, and
Owners with the wealth to support an NBL franchise.

Reply #807475 | Report this post

Last year

TSB arena?

Reply #807476 | Report this post

Last year

Nick Mills has stated on the record he won't pay for a licence fee, and that was when they were cheap pre-LK.

Would be good to have a second NZ team but it won't have anything to do with the Saints.

Reply #807483 | Report this post

Last year

No. Nobody wants a breakers vs saints grand final

Reply #807500 | Report this post

Last year

Wellington is an easy call for team 11 if the nz breakers allow it and change there name to Auckland.

Team 12 is the tough one...
Could be Canberra, Newcastle, Geelong, Townsville, Gold Coast or western Sydney.

Reply #807501 | Report this post

Jack Toft  
Last year

Bring it. I don't care if my team wins or loses, just so long as we beat New Zealand

Reply #807511 | Report this post

Last year

The rise of kiwi players is a good thing - perfect for a second team. More $$$ to bring those marquee NZers back home.

Those options for a 12 team are all pretty average. Newcastle would they be appropriately supported? Canberra?

GC, Townsville would be no.

Geelong not sure about.

My mind would be a third Melbourne team focussing North or West.

Reply #807512 | Report this post

Last year

"Originally, Sengstock rejected the bid as it didn't fit his BS "Community" model."

AFAIK there has never been a bid from Wellington, and definitely not during the Sengstock era.

Reply #807526 | Report this post

Last year

AFAIK Wellington have not been approached for a new NBL bid either.

As much as I would love to see a new team, we don't have an indoor arena that would do the NBL justice. But combine it with the NZBA and it'd definitely alter the NZ basketball landscape (especially at high school level, where the North Shore high schools own the national comps).

Reply #807658 | Report this post

Last year

Oops! I may have my CEO's mixed up.
Who was it pushing the "Community Model"??

NB: I am using the term "bid" in its most general meaning, not as a formal process.

The Saints owner (Mills??) was keen for a long time, but got no love from the NBL.
A while back, there was talk around a "community model". It's what the NBL wanted at the time, but Mills was not interested. Some either people were trying to get a "community model" up, but it didn't amount to anything, then things changed at the NBL. We had the Marvin interim period, then LK took over.

In the LK era, any wouldbe owner needs to stump up a lot more cash than previously.

Reply #807662 | Report this post

Last year

It was the guy who came in after the demerger. Fraser something, I think?

Reply #807678 | Report this post

Last year

"The Saints owner (Mills??) was keen for a long time, but got no love from the NBL."

Mills talked the talk publicly to get some time in the press, but made no effort to actually put a bid together and lobby the NBL.

Reply #807682 | Report this post

Last year

Fraser Neill? Graeme Wade?

Reply #807692 | Report this post

Last year

Possibly P world.

Reply #807695 | Report this post

Last year

The NBL might be making the call as head office is being asked to stretch significantly across a number of teams now and many of the other clubs are asking serious questions about conflict of interest.

NBL League - Owned By...
Hawks - Owned By...
MU - Owned By...
Tassie - Owned By...
Brisbane - Owned By.... (Yank never made his payment so head office in charge)

Its basically a private league of 1 which for obvious reasons is make a couple of other owners a touch nervous and hence the recent call out/set up of league media (league owner friend) was a warning shot.

Perhaps another independent team will be on the cards to help settle the others.

Reply #807870 | Report this post

Last year

What idiot will pay $10mill. for one of LK's licences. They used to be worth about $1mill under BA

Reply #807872 | Report this post

Last year

Any proof of all this or you just making shit up.

Reply #807873 | Report this post

Last year

What part would you like me to produce proof for?

League/Team/License ownership (Public Knowledge)

Brisbane ownership......make some calls and ask yourself why haven't the league done the usual big press release re NBA stars investing in the NBL as the date for final payment/conversation to full ownership past back in March and not a whisper from NBL media...join the dots!

You think Private owners are happy that half the league and the league itself is owned by the same entity...if it was your cash/investment would you be happy with that arrangement?

Reply #807880 | Report this post

Last year

None of that is proof, I have not seen anything you say confirmed, it's hear say, I’m looking for actual proof. I’m also not saying you are right or wrong just like some hard evidence other than rumours.

Reply #807890 | Report this post

Last year

You could do a bunch of paid company searches and find out who the directors are if you were really serious.

Reply #807893 | Report this post

Last year

and shareholders.

Reply #807895 | Report this post

Last year

@Anon you think by putting "proof" up online that might compromise the persons position

You can say its speculation or you can ring the NBL and ask them about Brisbane or dot he search as mentioned'll get all the "proof" you require

Reply #807896 | Report this post

Last year

We all know who setup Phoenix, United and the Bullets. It's public knowledge that the NBL owns the Hawks licence and may allow Tassie in. No need for proof what so ever. It's all in the public forum.

Reply #807899 | Report this post

Last year

Does it matter who owns what?

You really like basketball, right?

Get behind your team, somehow.

You're right about it being whackie that one bloke owns most of the teams. If he didn't, we'd have a 4 or 5 team comp. Well, we actually wouldn't cos those owners would more than likely pull the plug on such a league.

So, if he ends up owning all the NBL clubs, and the NBL 1 clubs too, so-be-it.

As close as you are to the truth, who cares. Look at this forum and the passion most of us display. For all intents and purposes, these teams/clubs are as independant as they need-to-be/have-to-be-to-survive to deliver what we have.

I hope that this all changes soon and I'm sure that it will.

I just can't see LK being a hoarder of non-profitable basketball teams and that he will have sold his "other" licenses..and I'm sure that he will.

Reply #807901 | Report this post

Last year

Illawarra won't be owned by the nbl if the deal of Ball and Lavalle goes through.

Reply #807904 | Report this post

Last year

ha a deal with Ball and dreaming if you think thats real! its simply hot air!

It matters who owns it if we want the comp to exist as you think the non league owned half of the teams want such clear conflicts of interest.

Jungle drums are beating on this as the first shots have been aired with a not so subtle stitch up and social media smashing of a certain NBL media employee that other non owed teams feel continually oversteps and crosses the line.

It was an owner who fixed him up and then arguably the highest profile player in the league also had a was really about the independent clubs clearly sending a message publicly via the most high profile player int he league.

Reply #807907 | Report this post

Last year

No idea what or who you are talking about but it's time for Kestleman to get this ship back on course it will be on the rocks very shortly.

Reply #807921 | Report this post

Last year

Pretty clear who the owner/player clipped up on Twitter

Leaky ship at HQ

Reply #807949 | Report this post

Last year


Reply #807950 | Report this post

Last year

I assume they're talking about the Bogut/Homicide thing.

Reply #807952 | Report this post

Last year

Ah yeah, Fraser Neil, that sounds better.
Yeah, he had the idea for lots of "community based" teams, playing in smaller regional venues...
To be fair, After the fiascos with Dragons, Kings, and Bullets, (and a few smaller ones) I can understand why he would have liked to move away from the private ownership model. Problem is that nobody will put that kind of cash into a Community model. Its one thing to piss your own money away on, quite another to watch some boob do it for you.

As for LK onselling teams. The issue is not that one has to pay $xM for the franchise. It's that if you don't have those millions to play with, then owning an NBL team is probably not for you.

Yes LK took over Melbourne, but my understanding is that he has subsequently brought others in.
Similarly with Brisbane, at least a third is now owned by somebody else with plans (pre covid) for that to move up, eventually to 100%.
He obviously pushed for the Phoenix, but got another billionaire to invest, and if he can't get somebody upfront for Tasmania, I imagine that once it is operationally independent of his property deal, he'll follow similar steps there.
The only reason they are holding the Hawks license is to try and keep the "team" alive.

Whilst I have not agreed with some (or perhaps many) decisions, and feel that some of his actions have been "unfair" its clear he's acting to promote the league and what he sees as being in the league's best interests.

Clearly MU is well funded, but Perth and Sydney are equal to the challenge and there has been great competition these past seasons.

Reply #807954 | Report this post

Last year

Who cares if there are part owners now. Those stupid part owners have paid way over the odds and at the end of the day LK is still a part owner of all these teams AND runs the league. Get it? Of course there is no Board he needs to be accountable to.

Reply #807963 | Report this post

Last year

As above its hard to own the league and then own half the teams.

Its a clear conflict and can create issues of transparency and lets all be frank if you'd invested in the other teams and have an issue with head office or another league owed team how do you think the issue will be handled?

Also the Bogut/Homicide thing included the email set up from Owner of SEM so pretty clear there is the independent vs league owned issue bubbling along under the surface thats being made public by the frustrations from the independents with certain elements/issues within the league office that aren't being addressed with the biggest gripe being the media dept

Reply #807990 | Report this post

Last year

Has anyone seen that nznbl had a draft and now there doing trade, would it work here, Jordan nagati was trade 1st

Reply #808062 | Report this post


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