Big Ads
Last month

Bucks boycott game leading to postponement of playoffs

This possibility has been spoken about in the past 24 hours and has now been realised.

https://www.foxsports.com.au/basketball/nba/nba-playoffs-boycotted-milwaukee-bucks-jacob-blake-season-in-jeopardy-orlando-magic-chris-broussard/news-story/b8e8df3057ac6fcdaad932305f261262



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KET  
Last month

American Police need to keep it in their pants or we will never finish the NBA season!

Reply #816202 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

Predicted responses in this thread...

"virtue signalling"
"what about HK/China?"
"the guy had a criminal record"
"why didn't he just comply?"
"BLM is a terrorist organisation"

And that's just what ME will say.

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Anonymous  
Last month

Can we wait for evidence and due process before we get outraged and stop looting and rioting...the only one who benefits is the CCP and the world just laughs!

Any chance they'll boycott until China stop putting people into "Re-education camps"?



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Big Country  
Last month

KET - cause killing people is OK but we better finish a basketball season?!?!

Reply #816205 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

"Any chance they'll boycott until China stop putting people into "Re-education camps"?"

There's one....

Reply #816207 | Report this post


Isaac  
Last month

Big Country, I don't think KET was disagreeing with that.

Reply #816210 | Report this post


Cram  
Last month

After a vigilante killed 2 protestors the police chief responded by saying that if they had have just obeyed the curfew they'd be alive. With comments like this at the highest levels of policing, its easy to see how the whole system is a mess.

As much as I wanna watch basketball, this stuff is bigger.

Reply #816212 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

I'll say it - empty virtue signalling by the NBA players. Yawn.

All they see is the headlines 'aNoThEr BlAcK mAn ShOt' but of course key facts are ignored because they don't suit the narrative.

* Jacob Blake a known criminal who had an active warrant

* resisted Police attempts to have him restrained, wrestled himself away from officers, taser deployed and didn't work

* went to car, reaches for something, gets shot

* it's found he had a knife

This is all being reported freely on US news sites in the last hour, not me making it up.

Police in most developed nations are trained to protect themselves first and foremost when things are turning to shit. I can understand why he got shot and I don't blame Police at all.

All old mate had to do was obey police directions and he would've been sweet. That seems to be lost in the story. Don't do dumb shit, live another day. Easy.

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Zodiac  
Last month

You could make the argument boycotting the playing of an NBA game likely won't do much but something needs to happen over there and withdrawing their labour is about the only thing NBA players can do.

It was an absolute disgrace what happened to that guy cops over there aren't even interested in trying to disable someone or take them down it's shoot first and ask questions later.

The USA is a basketcase. This pro-gun culture permeates the whole society to the point cops with a racist bent are so scared of being shot they would rather be safe than sorry and shoot first. It's black people copping it more because of the systemic racism there they are more likely to be poor and thus more likely to commit a crime putting then in the literal 'firing line'.

Unfortunately nothing will change in the USA until guns are made illegal and crooked and corrupt organisations with too much political influence like the NRA are dissolved.

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Isaac  
Last month

Anon, I don't think their decision is led purely by the one incident. And I definitely think that it's more noble than empty and more considered than "virtue signalling". I often wonder if that term is just a political weapon word or is it actually incomprehensible that someone might want to make a personal sacrifice for the sake of others? That an action could only be showing off?

Maybe this case isn't the clear-cut one that makes their best point, but it shouldn't detract from their point.

I imagine the truth in all of this particular case is somewhere in the middle. Someone panicked worrying about what might happen about the warrant, and someone panicked worrying what might happen if that person reached for a gun. As long as the US has the prevalence of guns that they have, many shootings will be murky clouds like this.

Reply #816222 | Report this post


Isaac  
Last month

Zodiac, I'll play devil's advocate on the shooting itself - let's say they ask for his name as witness or respondent to the unrelated issue they were attending. He doesn't want to provide it because he has an outstanding warrant. One second he's driving with his kids, next second there's a chance he doesn't see them again, so he's conflicted and defaults to the safety of the car and being near his kids. He knows what tends to happen to black dudes around cops. Cops insist and he refuses or tries to walk away to his car hoping it will all go away.

There was a video the other month of a (white) woman stopped for a traffic infringement and abusing the cop who'd stopped her. Her car was unregistered or something. After a while, she'd wound up the window and locked the door, like that would make it all go away. It doesn't all go away... I mention this only as an example of people backing themselves into a corner where their decision tree is seriously pruned. More panicked you are, the harder it is to be in a mental space in real time where you can evaluate the scenario properly.

Anyway, back to the current case - the cops draw the weapon and persist in trying to have him stop. If, as reported, he's revealed to them he has a knife (maybe just FYIed and not as a threat), they don't want to grapple and rather stay behind the gun. By the time he's at the car, the cop can't see what he's reaching for in the car - he could be getting in to be near his kids, he could be planning to drive away and hope they ignore it, he could be putting the knife away, he could be reaching for a gun.

In Australia, they'd almost certainly grapple him. In the US, they should still have grappled him - shooting point blank into someone's back is jaw-dropping. But over there, they assume that there is a gun in every jacket or car and I can't see them working their way out of that mess in a hurry.

This isn't a response to you personally, but what I'd hope to see on Hoops is a discussion where people don't swing immediately to the extremes. Rioters don't discount a social movement. A not-very-clear-cut case doesn't discount the motivation of an NBA strike. A discussion that touches on race shouldn't immediately reference a regular poster yet to post in this thread and reference their employment elsewhere - that's not going to help anything in a hurry. If everyone could be remotely charitable in their interpretation of any posts, that would help.

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Cram  
Last month

Well said Isaac.

The problem with going to the guns straight away means its hard to de escalate the situation. And if he does something they see as resistance, the only option left for the cops is to shoot. If they stay with batons, capsicum spray tasers (and the fact they had him outnumbered) they could have taken him down without shooting before he gets to the car.

Reply #816227 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

Boycotting or cancelling the NBA playoffs is not going to stop police brutality nor will it stop racism. It will shine another spotlight but it won't instigate change. Just like taking a knee during the anthem hasn’t done anything.

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Anonymous  
Last month

The problem with the NBA players stance is that they are making an assumption that the problem is racism, because it was a white cop and black victim. The narrative was the same with George Floyd. It seems pretty clear in both situations that there are issues with how the cops acted, the issue is that this is immediately assumed to be because the individuals are racist, where is the evidence of this?

Maybe its an issue with poorly trained police! Maybe these incidents disproportionately involve the African American community because they are disproportionately involved in committing crimes! Neither of these issues will be addressed if everything is blamed on racism. BLM and the stance of the NBA players is only going to prolong the status quo by preventing the real issues from being tackled, including real incidences of racism which are just going to be drowned out under the current climate.

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Anonymous  
Last month

Bron ain't giving up a chance at a chip before AD jumps @ free agency

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Big Ads  
Last month

Just reported the LA Clippers and LA Lakers players have voted on boycotting the rest of the season. Other teams voted to continue.

Reply #816231 | Report this post


D2.0  
Last month

Firstly, I propose a new "rule": No criticising a profession unless you're willing to do their job!

And yes, I'm sick of the way we only ever hear about black people being shot by police and it is always attributed to "racism"
I looked up the stats (which were a couple of years old) and more white people are shot by police, but we never hear about them.

And no, I can never accept the premise that an acceptable way to "protest" is rioting, looting, and murdering.

I actually have no problem with the Bucks protesting in the way they did. It's their country, their state, so if anybody has a right to "comment" its them. And their method attracts huge attention without harming anybody.

Reply #816233 | Report this post


D2.0  
Last month

There's also one point that needs to be clarified. There's a lot being made of the fact the victim was shot "SEVEN times", as though the number of bullets represents some greater level of atrocity.

We're conditioned by the Hollywood mythology, that a person gets shot once, flies across the room and drops dead.
But look at the armed forces. Soldiers get shot multiple times, even get blown up, and survive. Many report that in the heat of battle, fuelled with adrenalin, they did not even feel a bullet wound.

That's why police are trained to keep firing, until either their target is down, or until their gun is empty.

I'm not saying whether it was justified, just pointing out that firing 7 shots is itself not unusual.

Reply #816235 | Report this post


Isaac  
Last month

Boycotting or cancelling the NBA playoffs is not going to stop police brutality nor will it stop racism.
No, obviously. You can't "stop racism" outright. You can work against normalising it, for one thing and mobilising the vote is one aspect. Or against it being enabled as a publicly accepted thing. You can work to find the common ground in discussing it too, which is what any sane person should strive for.

A strike will maintain pressure/attention and that overall pressure has already allowed for some initial forays into changing the way police are funded or involved in some communities, just from my cursory reading of headlines. Something like that would've been a very steep hill even months before.

It's worth not immediately conflating every police issue with race as part of the broader discussion. Race is what makes it more relevant to a black athlete and the NBA, but there are broader police and gun issues that need to be dealt with in the US. If this angle draws attention to the any part of the picture, that's a positive.

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Anonymous  
Last month

I am all for this. Awesome job by the NBA players.
Basketball is a game, this shit is real life.

History is filled with these types of acts by unified groups highlighting social injustices.

Reply #816238 | Report this post


AngusH  
Last month

"Firstly, I propose a new "rule": No criticising a profession unless you're willing to do their job!"

What absolute bollocks. They aren't press-ganged into that line of work, it was a choice. Everyone should be expected to not only follow the code of ethics of whatever line of work they are in, but also the law itself, and be open for criticism - ESPECIALLY in positions of elevated responsibility or authority. Like the vast majority of jobs out there, there is a % of people filling them that should not be there for whatever reason, and policing more so than most needs systems in place to weed out those "bad apples".

Reply #816239 | Report this post


Isaac  
Last month

Firstly, I propose a new "rule": No criticising a profession unless you're willing to do their job!
Firstly, this is ridiculous, and I'm really not sure how you think that enters a nuanced debate. Do you have to physically do the job or just say you will? When are you suiting for the Wildcats?

Secondly, the sheriff who was working security at the Warriors game and shoved Ujiri was making US$224k+/year plus benefits. He got a US$100k payout for all the stress and damage from, at worst, a mild retaliatory shove. Do I have to wait until I'm making his AU$300k/year before I can comment on that issue?

I think you can look at the Ujiri case and say the cop was out of line without even touching on race. And you can look at this Blake case in the same way.


[Stan Van Gundy] It would be wrong to think that today's NBA, WNBA and MLB boycotts were about one shooting in one city.

Reply #816240 | Report this post


koberulz  
Last month

All old mate had to do was obey police directions and he would've been sweet. That seems to be lost in the story. Don't do dumb shit, live another day. Easy.
Bullshit. Plenty of black people get shot while obeying police directions. Plenty of white people disobey police directions and live to tell about it.

Remember all the white people who stormed the capitol armed with guns to protest lockdowns and mask mandates and were met with shrugs?

White supremacists showed up at BLM protests last night, in violation of curfew. They were armed. The police took a break from tear gassing the peaceful protestors in order to thank the white supremacists for showing up, and pass out water bottles.

In full view of the cops, one of those white supremacists murdered two protestors and wounded a third, before getting back in his car and going home.

Law enforcement in America is a white supremacist organisation. Fuck you.

Reply #816253 | Report this post


Jick  
Last month

What a pathetic contribution by D2. By your own logic, you should be refraining from commenting on the mechanics of a shooting until you have been in a few gunfights yourself.

Reply #816254 | Report this post


Isaac  
Last month

Lakers and Clippers have apparently voted to boycott the playoffs. Other teams supposedly elected to proceed with postponed format. I imagine there could be more discussion to come.

When travel opens up, if you get the chance, I highly recommend a visit to the Civil Rights museum in Tennessee.

Reply #816256 | Report this post


LV  
Last month

Helpful post Isaac

Incidentally last night I was reading The Book of Basketball (great book!) and the story of the 1964 All star game, where the players threatened to boycott the game 2 HOURS before tipoff! Russell, Wilt, Baylor, Oscar, West- the all time greats, before a televised game. They were demanding a pension plan and 15 minutes before tip off, they got it. The game went ahead.

My question for the Bucks is- what exactly are you asking for? They need a specific goal like players had in 1964. What's the closest USA equivalent of a Royal Commission? A full scale federal investigation? How does that interact with each US state?

I do find it all a little vague. You have one isolated incident - out of millions of daily interactions between individuals and police - and we have a boycott. What's the end game? Will you boycott next month when a new shooting goes viral? OK, if we need to make changes in society, good! Let's have a discussion based on quality research and reliable info, and then make those changes! But if you're just "not happy" with this event or you're just "raising awareness"- is that it? What's your action point? What's the specific outcome you're after?



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Anonymous  
Last month

D2.0, the shit you type on here is mostly ignorant and disgusting.
Use your voice for good. They stopped playing? Get over yourself. We all deal with it together.

Next time you're thinking about making a comment on this issue, think for at least 10 seconds before typing your response and then delete that response because I guarantee it is riddled with racial undertones.

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Anonymous  
Last month

I hope all the black policemen and women know this Kobe! SMH

Reply #816259 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

Main stream media smut peddling again.

463 people were killed by cops in America for the month of May 2020.

But, as soon as a black man is murdered, the media wants justice.

All lives matter, yet this does not fit the narrative of main stream media and the fear they want us all to feel.

Main stream media want a race war

Reply #816260 | Report this post


LV  
Last month

Quotes from the Bucks statement:

"Calling for justice for Jacob Blake" and

“the officers to be held accountable” a

"Wisconsin state legislators to reconvene and address....police brutality, accountability, Criminal justice reform”.

“Vote on November 3rd”

They are asking for something somewhat specific- but it's not something that can be done today or tomorrow- criminal justice reform is a long process.

If the whole season is called off, the media will raise the issue into a higher profile for two or three days, maybe even ahead of COVID, the election...but then after 2 or 3 days it'll just revert to a 2nd tier media issue - an ongoing discussion but below those other issues I just mentioned- and then those players will have damaged their own brands, their sport and have to wait months before getting a regular spot in the public spotlight when they return to the court. Not a wise move IMO- for them or for BLM.

Reply #816261 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

'463 people were killed by cops in America for the month of May 2020.'

What type of bullshit obscure stat is that?

Reply #816262 | Report this post


Cram  
Last month

"You have one isolated incident "

Except it isn't isolated. It is a common occurrence.

Reply #816264 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

Disproportionate occurrence as well.

'White people, who account for 60 percent of the American population, made up 45 percent of those shot and killed by police. Black people make up 13 percent of the population but account for 23 percent of those shot and killed by police. Hispanic people, who account for about 18 percent of the population, make up 16 percent of the people killed. For 9 percent of people, The Post was unable to determine their race.'

Source: https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/protests-spread-over-police-shootings-police-promised-reforms-every-year-they-still-shoot-nearly-1000-people/2020/06/08/5c204f0c-a67c-11ea-b473-04905b1af82b_story.html

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rjd  
Last month

Marcus Smart: ""We tried the peaceful way, kneeling, we tried to protest, we tried to come out here and get together and play this game and tried to get our voice across, but it's not working. So, obviously, something has to be done"

FFS, please don't anyone use the phrase "we tried the peaceful way".

Reply #816267 | Report this post


AngusH  
Last month

Kneeling wasn't the peaceful way?

Reply #816269 | Report this post


Isaac  
Last month

My question for the Bucks is- what exactly are you asking for?
The very first thing I saw about the Bucks discussing a boycott mentioned the players in a room arranging a call with the attorney general of Wisconsin.

Here it is. Tweet from Shams:
Bucks players are in locker room attempting to reach the attorney general of Wisconsin, Josh Kaul, sources tell @TheAthleticNBA @Stadium. Magic players are leaving the arena soon -- not accepting the Bucks' forfeit.

Why this incident in particular? I guess it's the latest straw on the camel's back, and in the Bucks' state.

Reply #816270 | Report this post


Cram  
Last month

"Why this incident in particular? I guess it's the latest straw on the camel's back, and in the Bucks' state."


Also that one of their own players was involved in an incident that could easily have gone the same way.

https://www.theplayerstribune.com/en-us/articles/sterling-brown-milwaukee-police-racial-injustice

Reply #816271 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

What does the messiah Liz have to say about all of this?

Reply #816273 | Report this post


rjd  
Last month

"Kneeling wasn't the peaceful way?"
Sorry, I should've highlighted the crucial part: "we tried the peaceful way... but it's not working."

Sends an ominous message in an issue that has already sparked a lot of violence and rioting.

Reply #816274 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

"Disproportionate occurrence as well.

'White people, who account for 60 percent of the American population, made up 45 percent of those shot and killed by police. Black people make up 13 percent of the population but account for 23 percent of those shot and killed by police. Hispanic people, who account for about 18 percent of the population, make up 16 percent of the people killed. For 9 percent of people, The Post was unable to determine their race.'"

African Americans also disproportionately commit crimes and particularly violent crimes, possibly a linkage?

Reply #816275 | Report this post


Cram  
Last month

"Sends an ominous message in an issue that has already sparked a lot of violence and rioting."

Yeah I think it was clumsy rather than a call to violence. As in, we tried these other things, now maybe shutting down the NBA..

I think they need to be very careful about what they say.

Reply #816276 | Report this post


Cram  
Last month

"African Americans also disproportionately commit crimes and particularly violent crimes"

source or just a feeling?

Reply #816277 | Report this post


rjd  
Last month

"was clumsy rather than a call to violence"

Agreed, but it's these kinds of clumsy statements that those with riotous proclivities will interpet as calls to action.

Reply #816278 | Report this post


rjd  
Last month

"Law enforcement in America is a white supremacist organisation. Fuck you."

Is this a serious statement? Or you are saying there are extreme elements within police departments?

When even sensible people like you engage in hyperbolic tribalism, it's a worry.

Reply #816279 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

Wait till Trump pokes his nose in.

Reply #816280 | Report this post


Rasheed30  
Last month

Wonder how many posters on here have an Australian flag, V8 Car or a Southern Cross tattoo as their Facebook/Instagram/Twitter Photo!

Reply #816284 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

And Black gangs don't murder Black folks daily in the US.....
Do something about that, oh no that’s not sensational enough is it?
Get a grip ALL lives matter.

Reply #816287 | Report this post


koberulz  
Last month

Is this a serious statement? Or you are saying there are extreme elements within police departments?
American law enforcement pretty much runs on white supremacy.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com.au/entry/alex-s-vitale-american-policing-has-always-been-about-enforcing-white-supremacy_n_5ed934c2c5b69dee016ed79e?ri18n=true
I would argue the very first police force that meets the definition of a modern, 24-hour, uniformed, law-enforcement-oriented force is actually the Charleston City Watch and Guard, which is formed in the 1790s to manage a mobile slave population that works outside the home of their owners. And the minority white population at that time was terrified about the possibility of slave uprisings, revolts, etc.

So then there's just one other factor for the origins of U.S. policing, which is colonialism. The U.S. had police forces like the Texas Rangers, whose primary objective was to drive out Native American and Spanish and Mexican landowners to make way for white settlement in the South and Southwest.


https://www.justsecurity.org/70507/white-supremacist-infiltration-of-us-police-forces-fact-checking-national-security-advisor-obrien/
An investigation published in 2019 by the Center for Investigative Reporting found that hundreds of active-duty and retired law enforcement officers are members of Confederate-sympathizing, anti-Islam, or anti-government militia groups on Facebook. Within these private groups, members often are openly racist. Police officers have also been linked to groups like the Oath Keepers and Three Percenters, who believe in defending white Americans from "enslavement" and are actively hostile to immigrants.
The Plain View Project, a database of public Facebook comments made by nearly 2,900 current and former police officers in eight cities, suggested that nearly 1 in 5 of the current officers identified in the study made public posts or comments that appear “to endorse violence, racism and bigotry,”
In the 1990s, a federal judge found that there was a “neo-Nazi, white supremacist gang” of Los Angeles police deputies - self-styled “the Vikings” – that existed with the knowledge of police department officials. In 2015 and 2016, the San Francisco police department attempted to fire at least 17 officers after investigations revealed they were sending racist text messages.
The officer charged with George Floyd’s murder, Derek Chauvin, was the subject of at least 17 misconduct complaints prior to Floyd’s death, almost all of which resulted in no discipline and the rest of which concluded with only a letter placed in his file.
Minneapolis Lieutenant Bob Kroll, president of the Police Officers Federation of Minneapolis, was previously a named defendant in a discrimination lawsuit brought by four black Minneapolis police officers against the Minneapolis Police Department for discrimination. In their complaint, the plaintiffs allege that the Lieutenant openly wore a “White Power badge” on his a motorcycle jacket.


https://theappeal.org/the-epidemic-of-white-supremacist-police-4992cb7ad97a/
The Washington Post, the Root, and others have recently written about a District of Columbia police officer who was seen in D.C. Superior Court wearing a t-shirt with a white supremacist symbol and the grim reaper holding a rifle and police badge.
In 2014, three police officers of a 13-member all-white police department were discovered to be members of a local chapter of the Ku Klux Klan in Fruitland Park, Florida. These men were discovered because they were trying to recruit other officers to join them. In 2015, a lieutenant in the Anniston County Police Department in Alabama was fired for being a member of the League of the South, a southern hate group. (Another lieutenant was also a member but retired once his affiliation became publicized.) The membership was no secret to the department when the fired lieutenant was first hired, and in fact was “the subject of friendly jokes.” It was only once a story about his membership was highlighted by the Southern Poverty Law Center’s Hatewatch that he was eventually fired.
In 2015, the Clatskanie Chief of Police in Oregon resigned after being accused of calling black people “monkeys” in response to a lawsuit alleging racial discrimination. A Pennsylvania police chief used the “n” word in an email that suggested blacks in a particular neighborhood were illiterate. A police chief in New Jersey sent an email calling for racial profiling of blacks in white neighborhood. The Howard County Sheriff in Maryland often referred to black people as “n — — -rs” and called a Jewish county executive a “Jew-boy.” A 2017 report about the Chicago Police Department by the U.S. Department of Justice found that dozens of officers, including supervisors, made racist remarks and disparaging comments about African Americans, Muslims, and other minority groups.


https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/aug/21/police-white-nationalists-racist-violence
White nationalists pervade law enforcement. There is a long history of the military, police and other authorities supporting, protecting or even being members of white supremacy groups. But it’s not just history. It was revealed last week that a black man in Michigan came upon KKK materials and Confederate flags in plain view while being shown a home for sale – the home of a police officer on the force for more than 20 years who shot and killed a black man in 2009 without consequence.
a Virginia police officer – assigned to a high school – who was revealed to be a longtime white nationalist and served as a recruiter for Identity Evropa, one of the groups behind the Charlottesville hate rallies and violence. He was not shy about his cover. In chat messages, he “discussed ways to downplay appearances of racism, while still promoting white nationalism”.


And so on.

Reply #816291 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

#275 - 'African Americans also disproportionately commit crimes and particularly violent crimes, possibly a linkage?'

Ever heard about systemic problems? The system is failing. Recognise and understand that.

Reply #816292 | Report this post


PyroCross  
Last month

I imagine there will be many players in the bubble that are following the masses. But there will be many who know a sibling, a relative, a friend, a family friend, be unjustly assaulted by police. Its one thing to attack a systemic issue indirectly, its another when you're protesting something you know.

And for the Bucks to lead this - both given it is their community in the centre of this, and given Sterling Brown's own saga with Milwaukee police (https://www.si.com/nba/2019/12/04/sterling-brown-bucks-police-brutality-case), I admire the decision they've made here.

I hope the NBA does let the Bucks forfeit the game, rather than just postpone all the Game 5s - to show this meant something. That the Bucks' players knew the risks and decided to go with it, because that is what they stood for. I've seen plenty of Tommie Smith and John Carlos photos around as a comparative, I don't think you can compare these. Yet, it does resonate.

Reply #816293 | Report this post


D2.0  
Last month

Firstly, I propose a new "rule": No criticising a profession unless you're willing to do their job!


Firstly, this is ridiculous, and I'm really not sure how you think that enters a nuanced debate.

You only say its ridiculous because it doesn't match your preconceived socio-political agenda. Normally I would tell people they should keep their personal agendas out of such debates, but it's your website so you can write whatever you want.

Do you have to physically do the job or just say you will? When are you suiting for the Wildcats?
Maybe I'm giving you too much credit, but you surely couldn't be that ignorant. Perhaps you're just too accustomed to the standard lefty tactic of ridiculing those who disagree instead of debating the actual issue.

Whether you agree with it or not, (which is your choice) the point I made is clear.
As they old saying goes, don't criticise people until you've "walked a mile in their shoes". (Or words to that effect.)
And as I clearly said, the key word is "willing."

I'd be WILLING to play professional BBall, I'd be WILLING to be PM, and (constitutional impediments not withstanding) I'd be WILLING to be President of the USA.
Would YOU be willing to be a cop in an impoverished US city? Cos I sure as hell wouldn't.

One of the biggest problems in America, is that so many functions, including Hospitals, Schools, Police and Emergency Services, are the responsibility of the municipality.
So the overcrowded impoverished cities of the Rust-Belt, where you have rampant unemployment, poverty, drugs, and crime. Where obviously you need a large well-trained police force, are unfortunately the very same cities that can't afford it.
Its even worse because in many cases the poorer municipalities were the "working class" dormitories, and they have been even harder hit by decades of economic decline.

I' sure that even those cities have a lot of good police officers, good people motivated to help their communities. But those police forces also attract people who "get off" on the power of carrying a badge and gun, and there's also just a lot of people who could not get a semi-reasonable paying job anywhere else.

And then you have the guns. The firearms industry in the USA is worth billions, and every year they churn out millions (That's right MILLIONS) of new guns. The ultimate result is that the country is awash in guns, and even if you can't simply buy or steal one, the grey and black markets are also awash.
Every day in the USA on average 150+ officers are assaulted, and one is killed every 2 days.

I'm not condoning the actions of bad cops, anymore that I condone the actions of any other criminal.
But nor am I going to sit back here, in my safe, affluent, privileged Australian existence and pronounce judgement on people living in a completely different world.

Reply #816294 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

'I imagine there will be many players in the bubble that are following the masses.'

The majority of the players are African American. They are fighting for the lives of future generations. You don't know their perspective. Listen to the masses. A whole lot of people are living in fear because of the way they look.

If they decide this is the best course of action, who are you to say people are just 'following the masses'. White people have followed the masses their entire life. Thats why these problems exist. Challenge your fragile little world.

Reply #816295 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

Thank you RLK^

Reply #816296 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

Kobe and Dazz, go home you have both had too much coolaide

Reply #816297 | Report this post


D2.0  
Last month

Next time you're thinking about making a comment on this issue, think for at least 10 seconds before typing your response and then delete that response because I guarantee it is riddled with racial undertones.

Oh right, because anyone who doesn't agree with your dribble must be a wacist?
Do you even know what racism is?

Technically, according to my mtDNA, I am Indigenous, although Nanna was probably the last generation that really looked it. She certainly endured more than her share of racism. Mum was probably fortunate that for her generation her "healthy tan" was fashionable.

My first wife's family came from India, so my kids are all mixed race.
I have a lot of friends and family in the Vietnamese Community, including my current wife. She was born and raised in Australia, but gets called a "mail-order bride".
But sure, I must be racist if I don't agree with you.

Reply #816298 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

I guess your current wife will be wishing she is your ex shortly

Reply #816299 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

D2.0 and yet you have no perspective. Astonishing.

Reply #816301 | Report this post


rjd  
Last month

Kobe, labelling all US law enforcement as a white supremacist organisation based on some cases is like arguing that the US fire department is a terrorist organisation because some arsonists are attracted to the profession. This tribal narrative doesn't help. It only creates a reason for police to identify even more with these extreme elements. And it encourages good cops to quit instead of enacting change within their departments. This narrative of police generally being an identifiable enemy isn't going to end well.

Surely this is a police vetting and training issue. Other factors, such as a US gun culture and gang culture, that primes police to be more likely to react with excessive force, looks far more difficult to change.

Reply #816302 | Report this post


Isaac  
Last month

If you're not willing to be D2.0, are you unable to criticise them?

I'd be a cop before I was the US president - I think that'd be a miserable job. And statistically more dangerous? Four presidents of the 44 have been assassinated. Two others have been injured in assassination attempts. Supposedly 30ish attempts have been made collectively.

I see no issue in offering criticism of anyone. The reader may discount criticism if they feel it doesn't understand the challenges, though I'd like to think I avoid any particular extremes of a debate like this.

Reply #816303 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

And just like that the playoffs are back on!

Reply #816307 | Report this post


Trev  
Last month

Deeply sad events.

There will always be bad cops everywhere.

The question you want to ask is, how many black cops shoot blacks/whites when the alleged is unarmed?

Another statement that needs to be investigated in all incidents is was a crime committed in the first place? If you commit no crime you should not have to interact with the police.

Reply #816308 | Report this post


Duke Fan  
Last month

"If you commit no crime you should not have to interact with the police."

Not according to plenty of videos floating around the internet of black people in the USA coming into close contact with the police merely because someone calls to complain they're "suspicious". Frequently they're given no choice but to "interact" and if they should happen to take the smallest umbrage at being forced into the interaction it ends up with an arrest being made



Reply #816310 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last month

"African Americans also disproportionately commit crimes and particularly violent crimes"

source or just a feeling?

Some Stats for you Cram, from the US Department of Justice for 2018:

Offenses All races White Black American Indian Asian
All offenses 10,310,960 7,115,940 2,826,460 219,410 149,150
Murder and
nonnegligent
manslaughter 11,970 5,280 6,380 140 160
Rape NA NA NA NA NA
Robbery 88,130 38,300 47,750 890 1,190
Aggravated
assault 395,800 245,050 133,330 8,940 8,480

There are obviously complex reasons for this, but they are not relevant in the context of police shootings by race. Claiming racism is the reason for the higher proportion of African Americans being shot by police is going to prevent the real problems in US society from being solved. There is a clear issue with police violence, but equally there is an issue with this community, racism is only scratching the surface.

Reply #816311 | Report this post


Isaac  
Last month

[Stan Van Gundy] NBA players protesting racial injustice seems to have motivated many Twitter followers to take an interest in human rights in China. I am sure those who use China to criticize NBA players are working tirelessly and giving generously to further the cause of human rights in China.
It's remotely like a modern Godwin's Law.

Reply #816314 | Report this post


Andrew  
Last month

I agree with D2.0's comments

Reply #816358 | Report this post


Wilbur  
Last month

Hopefully something can be done about police brutalitino.

More blacks kill blacks than anything else in the world, police included, but when police gets highly strung up based on colour then it's a problem that needs to be eradicated quickly.

Having said that not all police in America are racists thugs.

Reply #816362 | Report this post


Wilbur  
Last month

NBA should protest about the racism that blacks get in China. McDonald's in China refuses to serve blacks.

Reply #816365 | Report this post


LV  
Last month

I think we need to have a reasonable separation of the NBA and the players her.

The players are mostly blacks, many of whom grew up experiencing the kind of racism that they still perceive exists happens in society and at the hands of the police. I respect their right to speak up however they see fit, and bring attention to a justice issue on their minds.

The NBA, on the other hand, is not unlike most other major corporations these days. Do they care about human rights, social justice and the like? Not at all.

Well, it's more correct to say they care, to the extent they think it helps their brand and won't interfere with their bottom line. And not a fraction more than that.

Reply #816414 | Report this post




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An Australian basketball forum covering NBL, WNBL, ABL, Juniors plus NBA, WNBA, NZ, Europe, etc | Forum time is: 12:22 pm, Fri 25 Sep 2020 | Posts: 845,281 | Last 7 days: 370