Jack Toft
Earlier this year

SF1 Game 2: Melbourne vs (SE) Melbourne

Well it was a one sided affair in game 1. I hope SEM were wined and dined before because they were well and truely done over by United.

Can SEM even up the ledger? Yeah? Nah? United to book a spot in the GF.

Topic #48705 | Report this topic


Another Anon  
Earlier this year

United won't lose again this year. Game over, bring on next season.

Reply #852960 | Report this post


LV  
Earlier this year

SEM will bounce back, but it probably won't be enough unless a couple of them go bananas

United by single digits

Looking through United's season, they've lost 8 games. 4 in a row early on, missing Hopson and White (his first injury) throughout, plus Baba and McDaniel for a game each. 8 pts each to Brisbane and Hawks, in both games United had a lead at some stage in 4Q. By 5 points in OT to SEM. And by 28 in Sydney.

Otherwise 4 losses

- By 4 vs Perth, missing CG and Ili

- By 13 vs Perth, destroyed in 2Q and never looked like winning

- By 11 to SEM, who took over late 3rd and remained in control. Baba out, plus White done for season by this stage.

- In OT in Sydney by 2. Resting Barlow and Baba.

2 of the 8 in OT.

7 of the 8 missing multiple players.

But interestingly SEM was the team United had the most trouble with, when you factor the absences SEM themselves were facing.

After last year's semi, nothing would surprise me. I do think United will win, they seem to be peaking at the right time, but I won't be surprised if SEM really push them. SEM need better interior D- double team Landale, better help D on drives too. Wetzell must step up at both ends. And Broekhoff, Gliddon going off would really help. Just a couple of changes, plus a team locking in on D for 40 minutes and could be totally different game

Reply #852963 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Unless the refs get friendly to SEM, lt will be same as last time, United just so stacked and vickerman has done a much better job with his rotations. United by 12.

Reply #852972 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

You'd think it may be called a bit tighter early after the melee at the end of game 1.

Reply #852973 | Report this post


Perth fan.  
Earlier this year

United are stacked. They should not drop a game in playoffs with such a stacked roster.

Reply #852974 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Melee? Lol

Reply #852978 | Report this post


Perthworld  
Earlier this year

Throwup no. 11.

Reply #852986 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Was that a charge or an unsportsmanlike foul on the defender??

Reply #852989 | Report this post


Bol  
Earlier this year

Good to see SEM putting up a competitive game. But how disappointing has Broekoff been this season!

Reply #852990 | Report this post


Scout  
Earlier this year

flopping seems contagious amongst United players

Reply #852992 | Report this post


TB  
Earlier this year

Over officiated but I guess they are competing for grand final spots as well. Feel that utd are just rolling in second gear.

If broekoffe and Gliddon can't hit a shot they are a major liability.

Reply #852993 | Report this post


Kb_24  
Earlier this year

Free throw contest...annoying to watch

Reply #852994 | Report this post


PlaymakerMo  
Earlier this year

If both teams would stop fouling, then it might be more entertaining.

Reply #852995 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Terrible officiating. Boring to watch. Creek an overrated flopper. Is Mitchell an American or just an Aussie trying to act like one !

Reply #852996 | Report this post


Perthworld  
Earlier this year

SEM take the lead!

Reply #852997 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Does Vickerman ever shut up at least Gleeson sits down occasionally

Reply #852998 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Refs really wanted their screen time. I've never seen a more poorly officiated game.

Reply #852999 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

LV told us United then daylight?

Reply #853000 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

It's game like this where you genuinely question the integrity of the league

Reply #853001 | Report this post


Perthworld  
Earlier this year

SEM lead by double digits, oh my.

For the amount of money United spend they fail amazingly.

Reply #853002 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

This is the worst performance from referees I've ever seen. They clearly had an agenda to send this to 3 games. Dodgy calls to foul out Landale including one where he was in the no charge circle and then wetzel getting away with multiple fouls. I’m done with the NBL.

Reply #853003 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Phoenix have all the momentum for game three. United are notorious chokers

Reply #853004 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Goulding continues to play zero defense.

Reply #853005 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

So much talent on this United team even without Jock. Why they playing this individual garbage instead of as a team?

Reply #853006 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

LV stop complaining as anonymous. We know it's you

Reply #853007 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Refs ruined this one.

Reply #853008 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Phoenix will win game 3. They have all the momentum

Reply #853009 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Lucky for Melb that Phx were cold from outside the arc or it would really have blown out

Reply #853010 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

United are chokers

Reply #853011 | Report this post


Perthworld  
Earlier this year

"See Incredible" claim the NBL.

We just witnessed some incredible choking if that's what they mean.

Reply #853012 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

LV complaining about the refs as anonymous lol

Reply #853013 | Report this post


koberulz  
Earlier this year

People who don't understand how the no charge arc rule works need to stop complaining about it being officiated correctly.

Reply #853014 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Melbourne fell apart in the fourth quarter. Frustrations with the calls and mouthy wankers like Creek probably got to them.
I'm excited for another game, but not if it's called like that.

Reply #853015 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

If United don't win game 3 this is going to be one of the biggest sporting chokes ever.

The trophy should have been engraved with their name 2 weeks.

Reply #853016 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

2 weeks ago*

Reply #853017 | Report this post


LV  
Earlier this year

Gosh that was a hard game to watch. So many fouls.

Unsurprising result though. I've been saying on here regularly that a SF series vs SEM was always going to be the biggest threat to United winning the title, given SEM's talent and depth, and how they troubled United during the season. Best of 3 leaves little margin for error, and here we are.

The champion will come from this series for sure.

Reply #853018 | Report this post


LV  
Earlier this year

[If United don't win game 3 this is going to be one of the biggest sporting chokes ever.]

Disagree

SEM are a very talented, deep group. I've been saying that for months on here

They are the classic dark horse- talented, but faced injuries during the year. Now have their team on the floor, and an opportunity to peak at precisely the right time

They were the smart money smoky, which is why I put a couple of dollars on them

People on here wrote SEM off, I have no idea why, maybe cos this is such a WA/SA centric forum perhaps

Reply #853019 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

"United won't lose again this year. Game over, bring on next season."
OOPs. Imagine in SEM made most of their free throws and perhaps a few extra 3's. Game Over.

Reply #853022 | Report this post


LV  
Earlier this year

[LV told us United then daylight?]

Haha, it feels like I've been the only poster on this forum lately saying its NOT United then daylight! SEM are legit

Reply #853023 | Report this post


Bol  
Earlier this year

Great effort from SEM this game. If they can get their 3 point shooting going they'll be even more dangerous. United and hopson especially too much iso ball in the last quarter.

Reply #853024 | Report this post


Zodiac  
Earlier this year

As enjoyable as that game was to watch and good to see SEM win I agreed with LV that SEM was likely the only team in the finals that had the potential to threaten United, they went 2-3 against them during the season.

However SEM were playing to keep their season alive today and United knew they could afford to drop this game so Game 3 should provide more clarity on the legitimacy of SEM or not.

Reply #853027 | Report this post


Senator11  
Earlier this year

Didn't get to watch this one, just checked the box scores...what happened to the self proclaimed MVP?

Reply #853028 | Report this post


Zodiac  
Earlier this year

Landale got into early foul trouble, Wetzell was doing well going hard at him down low. Landale pretty much remained in foul trouble all game until he fouled out 4-5 mins into the final quarter, which is when SEM started to blow the game open.

Reply #853029 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

MU supporter here: well done to Phoenix and looking forward to next game. Can I ask the neutral supporters. Was the game over officiated? Not suggesting it favoured one or the other just reckon for a finals game do you have to blow the whistle so often? The NBL needs to be good to watch for those that want to see a good hard game.

Reply #853030 | Report this post


LV  
Earlier this year

It wasn't enjoyable to watch at all

And no, I didn't start saying that in the last 5 minutes when SEM got in front

Last night's game in Wollongong was wrestling, and this was women's touch football.

56 fouls in 40 minutes. Sheesh. So many stoppages.

United can't complain as both teams copped it (unlike last year's Game 3 of the semi final at the same venue) but it is frustrating as a fan, and must be difficult for the players having no idea what type of reffing you'll get from game to game

Reply #853031 | Report this post


Luuuc  
Earlier this year

Didn't get to watch this one, just checked the box scores...what happened to the self proclaimed MVP?

The best way to really demonstrate your MVP credentials is to not only play very well, but to also give the people a taste of what the team is like when you're not around - just to drive home your value.
So Jock took himself out of the game, and the rest of his team decided to fall apart in his absence.
Point made, Jock.

Reply #853032 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Garbage league is still garbage

Reply #853033 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

If Perth had cotton and a healthy overall squad they would trounce these soft teams.

Reply #853034 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

#033 and a troll is still a troll

Reply #853035 | Report this post


LV  
Earlier this year

[SEM will bounce back, but it probably won't be enough unless a couple of them go bananas]

This was my comment and actually, Creek and Sykes did go bananas, while Wetzell was a completely different player to game 1

Reply #853036 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

#030 i think if both teams stopped holding and pushing etc they wouldn't have had to blow their whistle as much as they did. The players have to take some blame as they didn't adjust at all.

Reply #853037 | Report this post


Zodiac  
Earlier this year

I expect United will probably make an example of SEM next game like they did in Game 1. I hope I'm wrong I would love to see David beat Goliath but United including Landale did not look switched on and focused today because they knew they didn't need to be.

Reply #853038 | Report this post


Woody  
Earlier this year

Hawks SEM finals calling it now

Reply #853039 | Report this post


Lovebroker  
Earlier this year

God I hope United crash and burn.

Reply #853040 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

"Last night's game in Wollongong was wrestling, and this was women's touch football."

Completely unnecessary to add the word 'women's’ in here LV. Unlike many on here, I usually agree with your comments. I feel like this slight against half the population is beneath you.

Reply #853041 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

As a neutral
Refs blew lots of soft fouls early and then continued
If anything I thought refs slightly favoured United
SEM were the better team overall
Landale can play but comes across as a private school tosser, I'm always right attitude when he obviously fouls
Le afa, Wetzell, Creek were excellent
United got out of their team first attitude, really didn’t have a stand out, Goulding is still excellent and does play good D.

Reply #853042 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Quick, we have found what the country should be offended by today! Phew, I thought we might get through a whole day without someone being offended about nothing.

Reply #853043 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

#042 your comment regarding private schools is beneath you and a slight on all private school children across the country. Please refrain from using such language as it's offensive to me

Reply #853045 | Report this post


LV  
Earlier this year

I didn't think it was a slight on women's sports to imply they're less physical than the male equivalent

Although they probably aren't actually much less physical, mostly just less athletic.

Reply #853046 | Report this post


Musk  
Earlier this year

Not an nbl fan but saw it was on telly and this is what the nbl with santamaria and williams try to push as the 2nd best league in the world, complete joke of a league.

Not to mention when people say they don't like basketball because it’s too start and stop, then don’t let those people ever see this game

Reply #853047 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Well done LV. Make an ignorant comment and then double down on it.

Reply #853051 | Report this post


Zodiac  
Earlier this year

Not an nbl fan but saw it was on telly and this is what the nbl with santamaria and williams try to push as the 2nd best league in the world, complete joke of a league.


Anyone that follows basketball knows the NBL is far from the second best league in the world it's Top 10-12 area.

Yes, it's purely spin by the commentators who surprise are employees of the NBL but it's not aimed at people like us who know better it's aimed at casual viewers and channel surfers where if the NBL is to become bigger that is where the growth will come from.

Reply #853054 | Report this post


rjd  
Earlier this year

Game 1 may have been one-sided, but it was enjoyable to watch because there was some beautiful basketball. Game 2 was just ugly. Not ugly because it was an intense, defensive battle, but ugly because the refs interrupted the flow of the game with so many whistles.

Reply #853056 | Report this post


Hopscotch 55  
Earlier this year

Is there anything more boring than wokeism?
I mean who would like to sit next to that guy at a party - anybody?

56 foul calls in a game is too much.
It has been a very over officiated season.

Reply #853062 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

If your not an NBL fan, why are you sitting here on this thread ? Go away and follow your NBA.

For the NBA these days are a bunch of highly paid atheletes who dont play any defence in most of the games, almost like a pickup match. When you see scores like 140=129 you know its becoming like Harlem Globetrotters.

Theres a reason they didnt win the last championships. So yes Australia is a small league but the best league in the world has the best players but often very lifeless games.

Compared to the 90s when they played tough defence todays NBA is a joke.

Reply #853065 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

"Is there anything more boring than wokeism?
I mean who would like to sit next to that guy at a party - anybody?"

Yes chronic whiners are very tiresome


"56 foul calls in a game is too much.
It has been a very over officiated season"

Yawn
Suddenly feeling tired

Reply #853067 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

If you think the nbl better then the Spanish league then god bless you lol

Reply #853070 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

The nbl is better than 10-12. Most sources have it sitting at 7 atm.

Reply #853072 | Report this post


Hopscotch 55  
Earlier this year

067 the kind of guy that would just sit there while another man hit on his girlfriend, cough, I mean boyfriend...

Reply #853073 | Report this post


koberulz  
Earlier this year

Game 2 was just ugly. Not ugly because it was an intense, defensive battle, but ugly because the refs interrupted the flow of the game with so many whistles players kept committing fouls.
Fixed that for you.

Reply #853074 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Exactly Kobe. Players also must take responsibility for that shit show

Reply #853075 | Report this post


TB  
Earlier this year

It was over officiated but very consistent, the same fouls were called on both ends. I only remember 2 bad ones and they were both called on SEM, first was the Moore screen in the first quarter and the second was Sykes' charge. The rest I thought were there.

I would like some clarity on who can call for a review. In yesterday's game Perth were denied a review but it seems any player today could ask and be granted one.

Reply #853080 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Reviews are at the referees discretion. Period

Reply #853082 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

"I didn't think it was a slight on women's sports to imply they're less physical than the male equivalent"

That's not what you implied though. You implied that women’s touch football is a non contact sport and by adding the word 'women’s’, you also implied that men’s touch football has contact, which obviously it isn’t. Should’ve just said ‘touch football’, no need to assign a gender, It’s a non contact sport full stop.

Reply #853091 | Report this post


Hopscotch 55  
Earlier this year

"by adding the word 'women's’, you also implied that men’s touch football has contact, which obviously it isn’t. Should’ve just said 'touch football’, no need to assign a gender, It’s a non contact sport full stop."

Get off the soy.

Reply #853093 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

I prefer lactose free thanks Hopscotch

Reply #853094 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

#091 tear up for no reason

Reply #853095 | Report this post


LV  
Earlier this year

Here's some timestamps

649 1st
447 1st
559 2nd

Now I've had a chance to re watch some of this, wow, yes this was much worse than I first realised. (Today I watched much of the game on delay and 1.5x, now I've watched the replays at normal speed)

Reply #853096 | Report this post


Perthworld  
Earlier this year

I have a timestamp as well:

Q4 00:00

Reply #853097 | Report this post


Musk  
Earlier this year

#065, to answer your question because I get a good good kick out of all the people on here one even following the nbl, which something via my one walk of life being one of the younger folks on here, I can confirm I have not met someone under the age of 25, hell even 30 who actually follows it and supports a team and as someone who's been involved in basketball for 15 years in both regional and metropolitan Victoria, I find it funny tbh that there are even diehards of a league that according that Fran bloke from espn (this is to your point #072) was ranked 12th in the whole world but yet crickets or sad attempts of criticism emerge when the actual best one is mentioned on here.

To the rest of your sad attempt of a point, if you can’t understand that due to analytics and shot making being at an all time high, and the influence of European basketball, offence in the nba is at an all time (not to mention the rule changes also), but considering very few people actually follow the nba in depth it doesn’t surprise me to hear such idiotic comments of "derrr nba too high scoring, therefore bad"

You mention the world championships and yeah no shit it was a shocking performance by the US, anyone with half a brain can figure that out, but if you think games being too high scoring are the reason why they lost so early on then your kidding yourself again. As much as a like pop that team for a US one was shithouse compared to what they’ve brought previously and yes they should win with no a players but they didn’t, but at the same time don’t act as if they did had all their best guys everyone would’ve gotten smoked. I also noticed how you made no mention of when we bet them, because even you have to admit that other than bogut and Goulding and the occasional moment by Kay or creek, that the nbl guys and their contribution in comparison to that of the nba guys was pathetic.

Lifeless? I’m going to assume that you like many on here don’t actually watch consistently. Yes there are shit teams (one in which delly plays for and pre injuries struggled to get minutes for but no one here wants to have that discussion because that would go against their narratives of at least the good boomers can get minutes which time and time again is brought up to discredit the younger Aussie’s in the league besides Simmons just to squeeze extra nbl players into a boomers team).

By tough defence in regards to both the 90s nba and today’s nbl, do you just mean a bunch of not really good offensive players and the occasional good (typically import, sometimes Aussie) who can actually score decently whilst everyone else hopes they play for Gleeson who’s created a decent system, or crash the O boards because most shots don’t go in because the talent level is that low outside of the top group of 15ish guys.

With reference to defence also, like I said rule changes have made it harder to defend but you won’t mention that, case in point in the 90s nba you could only either hard double the post or go single coverage, nothing else in between like a zone, swiping at the ball and recovering etc (granted this doesn’t mean the rules were also applied by the officials however). But also just because you can’t clobber people now when they go up for a layup doesn’t meant a league or defence is now soft. Also you damn well know for sure know that if any of the nba’s best defenders were too guard cotton then he wouldn’t stand a chance, simply put Thybulle, holiday or Simmons on him and he wouldn’t stand a chance. It is unbelievably frustrating that it took goorj to think 'why don’t I put a bigger wing on him’ rather than just throw another guard on him.

But circling back to the original point, firstly to have a laugh at everyone here and secondly because everyone here is so wrapped up in their little bubble of thinking the nbl is better than what it really is, I thought I’d provide not only some asshole type wake the fuck up comments, but also some more polite ways of insight but it seems both have failed for you and several people here.

Nonetheless, likely because you like most people in the internet refuse to read won’t read this or will see a couple of typos and then jump to ‘argument wrong’, good day sir.


Reply #853098 | Report this post


LV  
Earlier this year

Check the other thread "Dean blames refs" for commentary on Landale's first 3 fouls

Spoiler- 2 of them should've been offensive fouls on Wetzell. The other should've been play on.

Reply #853100 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

I guess you could say the same about Norton's 1st two in game one when Harvey clearly raised his arm and pushed off.

Reply #853103 | Report this post


LV  
Earlier this year

Here's the thing about the NBL though.

They'll over adjust. They won't call many soft fouls on Tuesday night.

Given United's D is slightly more physical (especially the backcourt) than SEM and better overall, that works in United's favour.

Reply #853104 | Report this post


Giacontigers  
Earlier this year

100% will happen.

It's the NBL?

Reply #853109 | Report this post


Anon  
Earlier this year


LV
Yesterday

I didn't think it was a slight on women's sports to imply they're less physical than the male equivalent

Although they probably aren't actually much less physical, mostly just less athletic.


Wow mate just dig that hole deeper , do we then say that the men's version has more brawn than brain ?

Enough with putting women in sport down, GTFU, plenty of other ways to get a point across without demeaning women..... unless of course you don’t have the brain capacity ?!

Back to the game, way too many fouls it interrupted the flow, but probably played to SEM advantage
Credit where it’s due though, they played like crap last game, this time they did what Creek said they needed to do, they shut down Landale , if United are so reliant on just one player, then this is going to be the outcome.
United need to shift their dependence on Landale, SEM need to play with more purpose
FYI neither are my team so don’t really care who wins,

Reply #853113 | Report this post


LV  
Earlier this year

If you're seriously claiming women's sports are as athletic as men's then all I can say is, open your eyes and take off your ideological glasses.

That's like arguing 1 + 1 equals something other than 2

Reply #853118 | Report this post


Kb_24  
Earlier this year

No fans and they give the worst nbl officiating..56 fouls made, means in every 50secs there is a foul committed..

Reply #853119 | Report this post


LV  
Earlier this year

Every 43 seconds to be precise

That's not even 2 full shot clocks.

Reply #853126 | Report this post


Anon  
Earlier this year

LV
Today

If you're seriously claiming women's sports are as athletic as men's then all I can say is, open your eyes and take off your ideological glasses.

That's like arguing 1 + 1 equals something other than 2


And there you go again, did you get a deal on shovels LV
....
Ever watched netball, how about swimming and running , high jump , bike riding surfing skiing , so your saying women in all those sports are not as athletic as men, how about dancing gymnastics frankly every sport on the planet, just because women are built differently certainly doesn't mean they are not athletic… you need an education, but it’s probably too late your mind is impossible to expand ( probably lacks the athletic ability )lol hence why you have to devalue women , bit of a sad sack really !



Reply #853140 | Report this post


LV  
Earlier this year

Pointing out that playing Soccer involves kicking a ball and incredible foot skills, while is more reliant on hand skills does not devalue either sport.

Reply #853143 | Report this post


LV  
Earlier this year

Basketball* more reliant on hand skills

Reply #853144 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

When did soccer get brought into it?

Reply #853151 | Report this post


LV  
Earlier this year

Observing that AFL footy is more physically taxing than bball, and requires more strength and endurance to compete, does not devalue bball

Similarly noting bball players are taller does not devalue footy

The value comes from your own interpretation. If you value athleticism, you'll probably enjoy men's sports over women's.

I haven't commented on that, I've simply made an observation about difference.

Now that you mention it though, I do like watching athleticism on display which is one reason I much prefer watching men's sports. In fact I find women's generally boring.

Shoot me with your woke bullets, asap!!

Reply #853153 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

If it's 'woke’ to suggest that you adding the word ‘women’s’ to your touch football comment (implying the refereeing was soft) was unnecessary, go ahead & shoot me with your misogynist bullets.

Reply #853155 | Report this post


KET  
Earlier this year

" Anyone that follows basketball knows the NBL is far from the second best league in the world it's Top 10-12 area."

That's rough!

I would struggle to find 8 leagues better even including amalgamations like Euro League...


NBA, Euro League, Spain, Euro Cup, Italy, Lithuania?, Greece? I’ve run out…. France? Turkey?

I honestly think NBL is better overall than Lithuania, Greece, France, Turkey.

Also, The other two are amalgamations of leagues, you don’t even join the “Euro League” you join a top euro club in another league to play Euro League.

Kind of like calling Champions League the best “league” isn’t it? But nobody says that.

If you’re a player wanting a top quality league I’d have NBL top 4-5 tbh.

Reply #853158 | Report this post


LV  
Earlier this year

I always assumed France and Turkey top divisions were better than NBL.

Some leagues have little depth in Europe eg Lithuania where the best couple of teams (Zalgiris) dominates everybody else.

I'm sure Zalgiris would win the NBL but the bottom Lithuanian teams would probably struggle

Reply #853160 | Report this post


Zodiac  
Earlier this year

That's rough!


No it's about right.

https://www.espn.com.au/nba/story/_/id/21691644/fran-fraschilla-ranks-world-top-basketball-leagues-nba

https://www.espn.com.au/nba/story/_/id/18470135/fran-fraschilla-rankings-world-top-12-basketball-leagues-nba

Reply #853161 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

German, Russia, VTB, Israel league is also up there with France and Italy, there top teams are quality. The nbl is a very good league but has half the teams as most leagues. These things can differ from year to year, nbl is certainly in the top ten though.

Reply #853171 | Report this post


KET  
Earlier this year

Is Fran the law on basketball league rankings or something?

The problem I have with his rankings is they are biased towards leagues with a few good teams and a lot of weaker teams.

NBL is incredibly strong throughout the league. If you're a player wanting stiffer competition, unless you’re in a euro league or euro cup team, you’d want to be in the NBL above some of those leagues.

I get Spain are definitely stronger overall, but some of those listed higher I just think is more based on a few good sides with big budgets but not reflective overall.

Reply #853173 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Most euro leagues also play more games, mid range teams play minimum 34 plus cup games of minimum 3, teams in euro competitions can play up to 70 plus so there squad is stronger overall, most allow six imports as well.

Reply #853174 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

The NBL of the past two seasons was clearly a top 5 league. Only the NBA and Euroleague was clearly better, while the ACB's top group of teams probably put it ahead of the NBL.

The top European teams take so much of the talent that it leaves many of those comps lacking depth from top to bottom, something that has long been the strength of the NBL.

This season, with one less import and so many good players missing a lot of the season through injury, the standard hasn't been as high, but I'd expect that to change once we get back to normal next year.

Reply #853181 | Report this post


KET  
Earlier this year

I felt like the standard of NBL is higher this year, guys like Jock Landale, Broekhoff etc are really good gets tbh and not just there to provide good depth.

Some teams like Cairns lost out in the scenario though. So I do get that - if they can bring in the third import to counter the Tassie side coming in and try to keep those Aussie stars whilst bringing back into the NBL told someone like Kay, that would be a brilliant result for the league. Ofcourse I don't have a clue what the Kay contract situation is - the bloke may not even be considering an Aussie return.

I do find it bizarre that we include euro league and euro cup in the list, because it is like saying champions league is the best league. For soccer we would say EPL or La Liga or Serie A or Bundesliga we wouldn’t say champions league. Even though technically it would be the best because it’s inherently the best of the best.

Someone will say "well it is called euro league".

I think if we talk about overall league strength where a player signs to take on good competition regularly, not a few good teams and many bad teams, we would talk NBA, then a big dip, Spain, then a dip, then about 6-8 very similar level leagues clustered, where NBL could arguably be right up there. Can’t say I know as much about Russia as the other euro leagues, I’m of the impression CSKA is very much the monopoly on winning it with their $16mil or whatever salary side.

Reply #853186 | Report this post


Senator11  
Earlier this year

I feel the top tier of NBL stars are world quality, but when you get down to the bottom half of the rosters, the majority probably wouldn't make a league outside of the NBL unless they were young and had that raw potential. Big drop from the best in the NBL to the worst.

Reply #853189 | Report this post


KET  
Earlier this year

Reckon Teysy wouldn't get a look in from the euro giants?

Jokes aside, I do I think the NBL is showing a bias towards getting as much talent in as possible through marquee and NS mechanisms.

NBL is getting to the point where either you’re fostering good young talent like Vasiljevic or you have very good Aussie or import talent.

Average/mediocre Australians will largely be pushed out even in favour of shorter rotation numbers if necessary. The NBL shouldn’t feel obliged to be funding average Aussie basketball basketballers for the sake of being Australian.

Like AOC swimming - they push Olympic qualifying times that are within medal reach not the Olympic minimum qualifying time. There is no longer the need to waste money doing that. Similar to NBL, don’t carry people for the sake of it.

Reply #853191 | Report this post


Zodiac  
Earlier this year

That's right Senator11 when you really drill down especially at some of the benches in the NBL a good chunk of those guys are really semi-pro standard i.e. SEABL guys. The depth just isn't there in the NBL to be seriously spoken of in the same area as leagues like ACB or BBL let alone EuroLeague or Euro Cup.

What a lot of people commenting don't realise too is that best and biggest clubs in these leagues are on budgets 10 times any NBL team and unlike the NBL where the majority of the rosters are made up of Aussies the big even mid-range clubs in Europe are able to buy the best players from all over Europe. Take Barcelona for example half their team is made up of guys who aren't from Spain because they can afford to buy the best players from this, that country etc, NBL teams can't do that.

Not that it's a direct argument for league depth but if you watched the recent EuroLeague Final Four on SBS you only had to watch five minutes of one of those games to see how no NBL team would stand a chance against teams like those.



Reply #853193 | Report this post


KET  
Earlier this year

" What a lot of people commenting don't realise too is that best and biggest clubs in these leagues are on budgets 10 times any NBL team"

Fully aware FYI, but that doesn't discount the fact that many of those leagues 4-12 have broadly inconsistent levels of talent.

I’ve probably paid more attention than you have of euro teams budgets, only because I find it interesting enough to spreadsheet and I’m aware most people wouldn’t find that an interesting thing to do - for those who do, kudos.

I don’t think you can accuse people of ignorance so off the cuff like that.

Reply #853194 | Report this post


Zodiac  
Earlier this year

I don't think you can accuse people of ignorance so off the cuff like that.


Well you displayed quite a high level of ignorance by immediately knocking Fran Fraschilla and his credentials. He's seen more European basketball than either of us combined, he's ESPN international draft expert. If you watch the NBA Draft he's the guy they throw to for knowledge on all the Euro based players.

You suggested Fran was biased towards the top end of Euro teams, I would suggest he knows far more about the depth of those leagues than you or I. NBL benches are where NBL teams fall away badly in that argument.

Reply #853195 | Report this post


KET  
Earlier this year

I said he's not the word of the law and he places a bias on the top end of town teams which isn’t reflective of the depth of the leagues as a whole.

There is nothing ridiculous in either argument, and Fran himself has openly said there is a lack of understanding of the NBL more broadly including by himself.

He isn’t a self confessed knower of all, so why would you put him as a word of law? By doing that you’re actively going against what Fran himself says.

It’s very reasonable to take it with a grain of salt.

You’re not at a level of knowledge to be calling anyone ignorant in any event Zodiac - we don’t need to be doctors in the arbitrary world of league ranking to be able to put an opinion forward without getting "you’re ignorant". Just such a stupid comment for you to make. You definitely know better!

Reply #853202 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

"I felt like the standard of NBL is higher this year, guys like Jock Landale, Broekhoff etc are really good gets tbh and not just there to provide good depth."

Broekhoff has barely made a strong contribution. He is a good pickup on paper, but not so much on the hardwood (yet, at least!).

It's a same across the league, line-ups look good on paper this year, but the amount of injury has meant the teams actually playing have been down on standard, not just because of talent, but also lack of continuity week to week, which is what helps teams execute at a high level.

I expect that will be back next season. Fingers crossed.

Reply #853207 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Dejan made a smart decision to go to kings, Weaver was coach and his knowledge of nba help these talented guys, there was massive covid throughout the world. What transpired was Weaver left and he got injured, his talent will not keep him in nbl, if nba does not eventuate he be in Europe on three times the money. Nbl can't compete with these clubs, Kay went to a bottom three team in Spain and earned more than any nbl club could pay, he was very solid over there but not the star he is in Australia.

Reply #853208 | Report this post


Zodiac  
Earlier this year

KET I know better than to further engage you in your sophistic word games that's for sure.

Reply #853209 | Report this post


KET  
Earlier this year

I heard Perth offered Kay the same amount - he left because he wanted to experience playing bball in Europe. I don't think money was a factor for Kay’s particular situation

Reply #853211 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Kay would've earned minimum of 300k in his hand plus accomodation and car, meals on the road and training. To earn that total package in Australia for nine moths work would be massive. You add tax, accommodation, transport etc would probably be close to Cotton money, then on top last season 50% reduction. Yes he might have watt play in Europe, that’s a great excuse to leave.

Reply #853219 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

He had a Euro out clause at the end of his second year of his contract. I think with salary reductions across the board in the NBL, the stars just aligned for him to try his hand in Europe which as mentioned above was always part of his plan.

I would expect to see him back in Perth in a year or so

Reply #853229 | Report this post


Perthworld  
Earlier this year

Some flexing going on in here about strength of European leagues yet at the same time not much insight. Referencing Fran Fraschilla is particularly awful.

We know NBA is the pinnacle.

Without going into a precise exact ranking of European leagues and by using performance of a league's clubs in European competition, outside of Spain's ACB which is the consensus leader, you have:

Top line: Liga ACB (Spain)
Second line: HEBA (Greece)/BSL (Turkey)/LBA (Italy)/LNB Pro A (France)/United League (Russia)/Liga ABA (Balkans)

So that's seven leagues other than the NBA. United & ABA are more regional than national but not continental enough to be excluded.

Of course you don't include pan-European leagues (i.e. EuroLeague) as obviously they consist of the best clubs from the national leagues themselves

NBA+Big7 of Europe=8. So NBL is at least is #9? Give or take a spot #10.

No other continent houses a quality basketball club competition to be even considered.

"I'm in the Top 10, Roger."

Reply #853265 | Report this post


Perthworld  
Earlier this year

Second line should also include BBL of Germany.

Reply #853272 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Earlier this year

Definitely top 10, but closer to top five I think. Back in the days of Rick Rickert, Eddie Gill and Jamar Wilson, when the league wasn't as strong as it was the past couple of years - probably closer to this year's standard - they thought the NBL stacked up with most European competitions.

Reply #853273 | Report this post




You need to be a registered user to post from this location. Register here.



Close ads
Punch - insightful time tracking
Dunk.com.au - Custom basketball uniforms
Beam Orders - a quick, simple order and payments site for your business.

Advertise on Hoops to a very focused, local and sports-keen audience. Email for rates and options.

Recent Posts



.


An Australian basketball forum covering NBL, WNBL, ABL, Juniors plus NBA, WNBA, NZ, Europe, etc | Forum time is: 11:38 pm, Sat 4 Dec 2021 | Posts: 905,801 | Last 7 days: 554