36ers will move back to the Dome once the upgrades are done

AEC was an ego flex move that cost huge amounts of money to the owner for no commercial upside.

Year 1 crowds were up because a large amount of tickets had to be given away.

Now you can buy a family ticket for $50 which was the same price 20 odd years ago. Crowds are at the same level of the Marty Clarke era but the roster is 3 x the cost of then.

This roster and admin have fallen out of favour with the crowd. Multiple management / ownerships miss steps. Creek , Sobey , Joey , McVeigh, 3 years of bad import selections all add up.

This team is simply not fun to watch. Even when a team is losing if you can see the effort and passion is still there then they will be supported. 90% of teh roster are phoning it in.

Humphries will all ways be injured but he soaks up a large salary ( cut him )
DJ's body language is getting worse- he looks great with Bairstow but combined they both struggle on D
McCarron is a great recruit but not the elixir , he will be part of a bigger picture
Hannahs - straight to the airport
Withers is OK in the mould that Ramone Moore was OK in his role off the bench as a 3rd import. As 1/2 imports money is being wasted on him and he needs to be upgraded ASAP
Dech - great
Bairstow - playing healthy and showing us what he could have been from day 1 in the NBL
King - cut , its not going to happen , rip the band aid off
Sotto - makes some sense but are we making money off him ? otherwise cut for a local

above anon

so you are aware the owner of the team is widely known to have had a falling out with the then owners of the Dome

Are you aware that Pelligra has taken sponsorship at the 36ers as part of a larger agreement?

The 36ers had to honour the free tickets that were given to the Dome as part of the exit to AEC

AEC is considerably more expensive to rent than what The Dome was. Fact.

You dont have to look that far to see the number of fans are disconnected from this team starting with the embarrassment that was the Creek exit and the attendance has been on the slide since.

Crowd numbers are now on par or less than the 36ers worst years at The Dome. Fact

You can say that my player assessments are subjective , because they are , apart form that back up your counter position to mine with some facts.

There are a lot of factors that come together to make crowd numbers what they are, least of which is probably the AEC.

Firstly - it's a bad team. It's a flat out bad team. There is no player on this team that is making anyone get out of bed and risk COVID to see them. And the team as a whole is dysfunctional and shit.

Secondly, COVID. Crowds for everything are down. This should be no surprise.

Thirdly, atmosphere. I'd be interested to know how many die hard fans have lost the love in recent years. Adelaide Arena always had a vibe. You could engage with the crowd. You'd look over and see Boti Nagy, local basketball players you knew, there was a sense of engagement and community that no longer exists.

The AEC should have been a good location due to its placing but if I could choose, I'd go back to Adelaide Arena - the country's ONLY purpose built professional basketball stadium. And when they do the upgrades, that is precisely what they should do. If Marshall somehow survives the next election and makes his new stadium we can reassess then but Adelaide Arena remains the home of SA basketball in my eyes.

Agree Me

If the team was worthy of watching the place would be selling out. It would only take some bum on seats imports to turn that around.

Creek and Sobey dragged a lot of people into the stadium and Adelaide fans liked the Wright style of play which was reminiscent of Cole and Smyth styles.

Also concur with your points abut being able to walk around and chat with people. At AEC I cant get to the people I'd like to talk to if I'm not in their section.

For me and people we go with -the atmosphere is severely lacking at AEC so the pull to go to the game isn't strong add the roster which I don’t feel any connection with nor any great excitement watching play confirm the decision.

My how the worm has turned... only seems like yesterday the call to get out of TS was the chant...I always said TS was built for basketball so use it.. not blowing up my wheels but sometimes the fence is not greener on the other side. Retyrn to the home and see the grass roots produce like the days of old gold.. as someone said if you built it people will return.sometimes got to revise discussions and agree moving forward might mean moving back... I know I am right.

Boom for grass roots because it is the rightful home of basketball... An identity for aspiratants to connect with..

I'm a huuuuuuge Creeky fan - club has never been the same since

The AEC, whilst does not have that homely feel, has a lot more potential to bring in revenue for the club.

The crowds were trending the right way before COVID. COVID is the main issue, once we go back to the new normal (and it may take seasons) I would expect the crowds to revert to the upward trend.

Creek is arguably the best Australian in the league and he wanted to be a one club guy, yet 36ers management for some bonehead reason sought to stand between him and his NBA dream. Imagine doing that to the face of your club? Let's be clear, if Creek were still here, DJ wouldn't matter. He could take a walk. Adelaide fans LOVED Mitch Creek and would have only loved him more on current output.

Every step of the way this management team has shit the bed.

Creek is arguably the best Australian in the league and he wanted to be a one club guy, yet 36ers management for some bonehead reason sought to stand between him and his NBA dream. Imagine doing that to the face of your club? Let's be clear, if Creek were still here, DJ wouldn't matter. He could take a walk. Adelaide fans LOVED Mitch Creek and would have only loved him more on current output.

I remember the Bill Jones and Apollo era. Went to many games at the Powerhouse. I followed the league very closely for many years up until last year. I have virtually zero interest in the 36ers now. I've got something in common with Boti to explain waning enthusiasm, and it's not just a matter of getting old! If it came to it, I'd probably support every other NBL team before the current 36ers.

Creek blunder has changed club negatively forever. monumental, irreversible damage

Yep lovebroker, Mitch as a stand-alone product is one that people should not be endorsing, but people will always hold onto him. I think people are forgetting that all crowds are being lowered cos of covid, it also doesn't help that the stadium is also apparently at a 75% capacity.

Burning bridges is never a good idea. Any other player with NBA aspirations would factor in the treatment of Mitch when deciding which NBL club to sign with. The NBL is a small world and NBL player managers is an even smaller world.

mitchrulz that is why Josh Giddey never came to Adelaide.... oh that is right he did. Also Mojave King and Kai Sotto. Bad luck on being completely wrong.

Only a minority of fans still care about the Creek thing. It has had little impact regarding crowd

I don't think the 3 players you mentioned were really in comparable situations to Mitch. Nevertheless the fact that they played for Adelaide doesn't prove that they didn't consider what happened with Mitch before signing.
Re crowds I'm not claiming it is as simple as Mitch is worth 500 bums on seats but there is no question that he is an elite quality local and crowds prefer winning to losing.
I think covid is a much bigger factor anyway and makes it impossible to compare AEC to TSA.

Same boat as Isaac. Have loved the club since I caught a late night replay of a game in 85, but I can't give a crap now. It’s not one thing, it’s a combination and I know I’m just one fan who doesn’t matter, but I’m sure many old times fans feel the same disconnect.

Need to promo the high noon shoot out aspects and use poetic license to create characters to build the excitement. Sunday noon game also max daylight saving so really great bonus for families to have day out. Less traffic congestion. Be pistive not negative..think outside the keyway

I have watched ADL games since the Al Green, Mark Davis, Orlando Phillips year. 89?

Along the way the club has done many things right and many things wrong.

That can be said of any club.

The Breakers were wildly successful at one time now pure trash.

The Hawks were pure trash, now winning more games with the same low attendance.

The Taipans are the only ones consistently trash bar a couple of blips.

Again the Creek situation was lamentable, but we've moved on, I would invite others to follow suit.

After 30 years of support for the club my interest waned enough this year to not renew my season passes. For us the move to the AEC we lost connection to the club it became a business and less of a club it moved from being about basketball to being entertainment for the crowd. Our gold seats our children couldn't see as the tiers were too shallow an issue we raised early to the CEO who basically shrugged and moved on to someone else. At the arena the players would mingle with the supporting post game then that all stopped at the AEC this was only for the corporates. Here’s my take on location

AEC central location, decent ac and comfortable seat but if the person next to wants to send their kids for food be prepared to get up to let them out every five minutes, sound proofing reduces atmosphere and seating distance reduces connection with the game.

Arena parking was a pain to get out, poorly maintained facility (thanks past bsa, government of the time and other owners who just held the stadium in the 90’s) great viewing and atmosphere if your a basketball fan you felt connected to the game.

I have sat through all the good and the bad like afl it’s no longer about sport but more now about entertainment losing its grassroots community connection along the way.

For us the move to the AEC we lost connection to the club it became a business and less of a club it moved from being about basketball to being entertainment for the crowd.

Interesting that so many people are not liking the AEC.

For thirty years or so our family has made every effort to attend all games. So pleased when the move was made to Findon and the Powerhouse/Dome/Titanium etc, because at last we could buy memberships. We had great seats, (row M south) great view, knew those around us, could drive and park nearby. While refreshment options were limited they were much better than the current offerings..

We could easily meet up with friends; supported the team through success and failures, good coaches and not so good, great, and not so great imports. While not always in total agreement with management decisions we went along with it.

With the move to the AEC, our 'equivalent' seats are much further away from the court, and considerably higher, and we feel totally disconnected from the game. Parts of the court are obstructed from view. Wile the seats are softer, they are much closer together, so we knock knees with our neighbours. We also have to stand up to let people in and out.

We have renewed each year and attended all the games.

This year we have gone to TWO games and will probably not go to any more. I don’t think it is the team that is the disincentive- the team has been awful for a few years, and we still went along. It’s the thought of filing into AEC, sitting in seats with a poor view, sitting next to people who aren’t really fans, and most having very little engagement with game, or what passes as sponsor activations.

I’d support in a flash a move back to Findon, which is the spiritual home of the 36ers.

Okay, so never watched basketball in SA but everything Bravepunk described above is why my family and I keep coming back to watch the Taipans (and their incessant mediocrity) year in year out. Everyone knows each other, it's easy to park, meet up with friends and (depending on whether the kids are with us) can be the start or end of a great evening or afternoon out. It's why the Taipans get 4k to every game. It's just an obvious, easy, fun night out for kids and families, teens, groups of mates, anyone. I look at somewhere like the AEC or the Kingdome and wonder why anyone would bother. It's like the difference between going to a friendly local bar and drinking in an airport lounge.

Imagine Perth fans complaining about their stadium being too big!!!

Obviously there's a lot to this Adelaide Arena/Entertainment move and possibly move back.

To get it out of the way quick and dirty - Riverbank Arena may have been part of the grand plan, which may be on life support now. Even if Libs scraped through in March, the budget and works for 2022-2026 Arena is just the tunnel/bridge I think? It’d actually require Libs to win in 2026 in addition to this year for the arena to go ahead.

Chances of that are slim to none. So fair play on a plan B.
——

In respect of much of the discussion taking place:

Adelaideans are a notoriously nostalgic bunch that don’t particularly like change. The ones on here are even more likely to be so as many may have followed the 36ers since just about day dot.

For myself, those memories of Maher and Farley/Mee/KB etc at the Powerhouse to raucous crowds that honed and targeted opposition and swayed refs was amazing entertainment.

With that said...

Crowds now need to be considered in the light of:
- Covid, this has affected every sport, it’s clearly a giant spanner in the works. Whether it be Gov imposed limits or just people not wanting to risk it, covid is an impact regardless of arena.

- Team success, always plays a part in fluctuating crowds regardless of arena. Adelaide aren’t playing well.

- Connection and engagement, Adelaide haven’t had particularly iconic players besides Giddey to be draw cards in a long time. If anything the draw cards have been opposition players (Bogut, La Melo).

- Fixture timing, plenty of criticism about the timings and impact on those that may be more certain attendees (clash with basketball trainings).

Let’s be clear, the crowd numbers were just as bad and worse at Adelaide Arena a few years before the move. Games went from being 5-6k to ~4K if they’re lucky. The place was half empty, looked it and sounded like it.

GK takes over - crowds increase to that 5-7k band just before moving to Ent Centre. Those crowds then continue at Ent Centre until covid seriously hits Adelaide. Before anyone says it - if that was achieved via free tix then so be it, but it can’t be said that the move to Ent Centre pushed crowds down. It didn’t.

Atmosphere - whilst I agree that Adelaide Arena naturally had better atmosphere, we need to be honest that the atmosphere at Adelaide Arena was shot by the time they moved to the Ent Centre. It was shot before GK even arrived on the scene. The small group that made up the more regular, hardcore 36ers crowd - the ones that made the atmosphere, targeted players and umpires with hostility, had dwindled and probably are close to non-existent. I don’t think that behaviour even passes as PC anymore - we probably won’t see that ever again. Now it’s an inoffensive family atmosphere.

Add in more club music that’s less momentum-based and has more of a crowd driven atmosphere killing effect, and you start to see why the Ent Centre won’t have the same atmosphere as the Clipsal powerhouse days and returning to Adelaide Arena won’t magically fix it.

Plus, the team needs to play well enough to create the atmosphere in the first place. Frustrated silence doesn’t do much.

In terms of sight lines - I can’t speak for members, but I found Adelaide Arena sight lines to be awful at $45 or whatever I had to pay per ticket. AEC view for general admin is significantly better. Significant is probably an understatement.

Location, seat comfort, air conditioning wise, the AEC is clearly better and Adelaide Arena will never be comparable even with renos.

Capacity wise, well Adelaide need to work their asses off to get higher crowd numbers in future years. I don’t think 4,5,6k are financially viable crowd numbers. They need to be looking to 7-10k crowds, which is a capacity the AEC can handle, and why a 12-14k Riverbank Arena would have been a perfect one to transition to in 8 years time or whatever.

With that said - the costs of playing out of AEC vs Adelaide Arena would factor in. AEC may be a sweet deal now but perhaps not soon? If it’s prohibitive then it’s prohibitive, so be it, Adelaide Arena it must be.

By the by, the criticism about trying to run 36ers like a business is a bit bizarre. We want them to be as financially viable and sustainable as possible, we can’t assume there’s a line of people happy to lose money to own Adelaide. If you don’t like the management for whatever other reasons then that’s your prerogative, but criticising a business trying to be a business is straight up odd!

All fair points from KET. I mean when we first made the AEC transition I was all for it and thought people holding onto Adelaide Arena were a bit stuck in the past. But now I can see a fair debate for both sides.

My personal experience at AEC wasn't that great. I agree on sightlines. The atmosphere was nereon non existent. But I was willing to sacrifice on those things if it meant bigger crowds and a bigger reach for the team.

COVID obviously is the elephant in the room. But I think COVID or not this team would struggle to pull a crowd. They're just not any good and there is no star player that anyone would have any interest in.

I think a potential pivot back to Adelaide Arena could make sense. It used to get packed and it very well could again. An upgrade and increased seating could make it viable. However that doesn't deal with the main problem - the team sucks and has since 2017.

Happy to got to which ever stadium agrees to stop blasting inane music non stop with no feel for what's going on on the court.