"Probably ensures he wont be traded before deadline"

If he is done for the season it may actually do the opposite. He then just becomes an expiring contract and any resistance to trading him from the fanbase may be negated. Now they NEED to trade him to get someone to help them win.

"Probably ensures he'll be in the nbl next year."

If its an ACL he likely wont be anywhere at the start of next season and it's basically assured he'll never get anything other than vet minimum again.

I could see him doing his rehab and then looking to join a contender after next season's trade deadline.

Joe Ingles goes down with a knee injury in Minnesota. pic.twitter.com/AvsIlZQNyh

— David James (@DavidDJJames) January 31, 2022

Tough to watch.

Hmm... an ACL at 34... that's a hard recovery there. Could have significantly shortened his NBA career if that is what it is. Worst case scenario he's out 9 months, finishes up his playing time in the NBA for the rest of the season then ends up in the NBL. And I think that's probably the most likely scenario unless he comes back in great form. Really shit thing to happen.

:(

Terrible ... terrible ... terrible ..speedy recovery.

Looks serious. Fingers crossed he has a speedy recovery!

If theres a silver lining, he was never too explosive before it.

Yeah, I can see him bouncing back with how he plays, but not sure if he'll get another NBA gig. Timing couldn't be worse. Hope we see him in the NBL again at some point, but also hoped it was a few years away yet.

Cooked for the Boomers campaign as well?

"Cooked for the Boomers campaign as well?"

Wouldn't say so. World Cup not until August next year, Olympics the year after. I'd imagine he'd keep playing somewhere with the intent of one more shot at gold.

He is out for 12 months if ACL. He would likely still be good for Worlds and next year given it is only February tomorrow.

Confirmed to be ACL but no other damage to the knee.

The anon suggesting Ingles wouldnt make the Boomers team if healthy. LOL.

So a guy being humble means hes out? Right

Australia does have good depth, but what we still lack is creators. Ingles is still one of our best creators at the moment. If he's healthy he'll be in.

"Would he even make WC squad if healthy, I'm not so sure.
We have enough depth ."

LOL. Joe Ingles walks onto the Boomers team any time between now and the Paris Olympics let's not be silly. His experience, three point shooting, defence and playmaking makes him an absolute no-brainer and one of the first names called.

Also looking at that depth chart, it doesn't look that deep to me to be fair, especially at shooting guard. I could see another small forward steal a spot to make up for that - maybe Josh Green. A line up with Giddey-Exum-Delly-Patty-Ingles-Thybulle-Green wouldn't surprise me. And you might even offload Delly and bring in Daniels.

Joe is a huge loss for the Boomers, but I think the combo of Giddey at PG and Thybulle at SF helps cover it, but we're going to need to see significant growth from some of the other young guys because of our aging core.

Not a bad squad. A lot to happen between now and then. Cotton should be in a 20 man squad too

Still worth having him in the squad. What happens if Matisse becomes unavailable for some reason? Have Cotton in the squad and if everything goes to plan Cotton is one of the final cuts. But if something happens, we have Cotton there ready to go.

We need to make contingency plans so we dont end up with another Barlow situation from 2019.

"Joe is a huge loss for the Boomers, but I think the combo of Giddey at PG and Thybulle at SF helps cover it, but we're going to need to see significant growth from some of the other young guys because of our aging core."

He's not a loss for the Boomers because he will be fit to play by August next year in all likelihood. He's even said himself that his chase for gold isn't over so I am not assuming it is.

"Probably ya 20 player camp list for WC

Simmons-Giddey-Exum-Dellavedova
Mills-Goulding-Daniels-Sobey
Ingles-Green-Thybulle-Creek
Kay-Cooks-White-Motum
Landale-Baynes-Reath-Magnay


Others maybe a while away
Proctor
Armstrong
Froling
Acuil*"


I like the inclusion of Jack White and think he may end up leapfrogging the other names on that list by the time the next world cup rolls around. To me, he is like Nick Kay with athleticism. That basically gives him the potential to be our best power forward option with time.

I'd like to see Cam Bairstow given at least a look if he remains healthy. He's injury prone, yes. But if he can stay stable for long enough he would be in my squad probably ahead of Brock Motum or at least in similar standing to him.

I think Frolling is closer to consideration than others think.

Acuil - no. He can make shots but would be a defensive liability at that level.

Time to shift Sobey out of the Boomers conversation. Has had two major tournaments and has been a non-entity at both. Congratulate him on the bronze medal but move him on. If we're going to have a shooting guard deep on the bench for experience to play spot minutes I'd go with DJ Vaselejivic.

Big question mark on Baynes and his recovery but he would make the team if healthy and actively playing.

No to Magnay. Guy is overhyped and useless.

I certainly hope he's good to go, it's no lock though.

I thought Sobey did well in his spot minutes in Tokyo, much better than I expected, but agree that is probably his last time in green and gold for a major tourney. Jack White is certainly a possibility, I think DJ Vasiljevic is a sneaky chance too depending on his health and development, he's no Patty Mills but he can just flat out score from outside and in, which is the one big thing we have lacked with this era of Boomers outside of Patty. Hasn't gone to the basket as much post-injury, but if he gets that part of his game back I think he'll be an Olympics/World Cup-level scorer.

Also agree on Cam Bairstow - he's done well for us before (his injury in Rio was big), and if he can stay healthy (and he looks in the best shape of his career right now) he's one of the best Aussie bigs for sure and deserves a shot.

As I thought bad luck to Ingles. In basketball ACL's are close to 9 month than 12 month injuries so he might be a chance to be ready by that start of next season but will probably need to start the season a FA and workout for the Jazz or whatever team once he's healthy to get another contract in the NBA.

In terms of Boomers I didn't think he was much chance of making the team in 2024 anyway and this likely hurts his chances further but he never relied on athleticism so age will probably be the biggest hurdle for him.

Sounds like Ingles is almost a certainty to get traded now.

On trade-deadline day (Feb. 10), Ingles will still be due $4,288,401 of his base salary. If the Jazz trade him, their luxury-tax liability would decrease by nearly $26 million. So, Utah could pay a team to cover Ingles' remaining salary, add a sweetener to make it worth that team’s while and come out way ahead financially.

In fact, if unloading Ingles for no return, the Jazz would be just about $1.7 million over the tax line. At that point, they could dump another player or two and escape the tax completely. That’d entitle them to the share of NBA-wide paid luxury tax distributed to non-taxpaying teams - potentially approaching $10 million (depending what tax-avoidance measures other teams take).

If willing to spend, Utah could instead use Ingles’ $13,036,364 expiring contract to facilitate a trade that brings immediate help. The Jazz (30-21) are a good team at a pivotal time in their run as they attempt to prove their playoff bona fides.

Utah would lose Ingles’ Bird Rights if trading him. He’s well-liked in the locker room and knows Jazz coach Quin Snyder’s system well. But even if dealing him, Utah could still use the taxpayer mid-level exception – which projects to be worth more than $6 million – to sign him this summer.

This injury will really dampen the market for Ingles in free agency.

If we all agree that Ingles will continue to play basketball after this, and that seems to be the consensus, I don't understand where the 60/40 and 20/80 split on himn playing for the Boomers is coming from. If he's actively playing his hand will be up. There's a one year gap between cup and the Olympics. I feel like if he's playing one, he'll probably play the other.

My prediction is he retires from international basketball in 2024.

I think the obvious thing with the next boomers WC team is as follows

Take the Olympic bronze team

Giddey and Green move into much bigger roles.

The older guys like delly, ingles and bathes, people writing them off but can't see why they couldn’t contribute off the bench 8-15 minutes. Eg I can definitely see delly backing up giddey for 12 minutes a game and I’d rather see delly than sobery in such a role. Greens been pretty good in Dallas recently, worst case scenario Ingles backs him up 8-15 mpg.

There’s always young guys who pop up from no where, see who’s ready at the time. Daniels etc

Definitely need to add 2 legit bigs who can play 4/5, not a 3/4.

And then obviously the biggest factor is availability.

Ps there’s already a lot of names listed in this thread who are miles away from the boomers A team

For some reason I thought Ingles was 36 years old approaching 37 but I just saw his age and he only turned 34 last October. Disregard everything I said about age plenty of time for him to play in 2024 he wouldn't have even turned 37 by then.

Goulding is only a year younger than Joe and way more limited even at his best.

Creek is as good as he's ever gonna be and still not half the player Ingles will still be, even in 2 years.

Thybulle, Green, Daniels and Giddey are still very young and inexperienced and will all need to improve a lot of areas to be as effective as Joe is at FIBA level.

"So Joe only adds 3 pt shooting which could be covered by playing Goulding more minutes, creek or green increasing 3pt%"

There is no universe where anything Goulding does replaces Joe Ingles. I am a Goulding fan but Ingles is a level or two above. There's a reason why one is an NBA starter and the other isn't.

"Creek is as good as he's ever gonna be and still not half the player Ingles will still be, even in 2 years."

I agree with this. I think Creek could become an option if the team wants a third small forward but looks to me like Ingles/Thybulle have the spot wrapped up. Josh Green probably a SG at this level. Daniels is the other consideration. Gonna be hard to choose at that spot but I'd be shocked if a healthy Ingles missed out.

"Thybulle, Green, Daniels and Giddey are still very young and inexperienced and will all need to improve a lot of areas to be as effective as Joe is at FIBA level."

Thybulle is near enough. I think Ingles, Thybulle and Giddey are locks. Daniels and Green, one of those two will make it but not sure which.

There's a very interesting perimeter mix pending

Some version of....

Giddey/delly
Mills/exum
Green/ingles/thybulle

Lots of versatility, mixing and matching of lineups, minutes and specific roles to be debated/determined.

Thybulle can play some small ball 4, defending the Durant’s of the tournament.

Daniels looks like he’s the real deal, pretty sure he’ll be around the mark

I’d say the next man up is Goulding, followed by Sobey then creek, and then who knows about broekoff , but I can’t see them winning a roster spot over anyone already listed .

Just gotta sort out some big depth and on paper I’d predict in the medal mix

*pending availability obviously

The more I see of McDowell-White, the more I think Delly's days in the Boomers A team may be numbered. The guy is masterful on the pick and roll, has the shooting , the defense, and the size to make a mark internationally. We've traditionally always brought three point guards - Giddey and Exum probably choose themselves, Simmons (if by miracle he showed up) might play point but would probably be taken as a forward spot. You've got a Delly-shaped hole in the third point guard spot, but McDowell-White looks like he's doing Delly things better than Delly currently can.

Also, I think by 2023 Daniels may well be a better player than Green. That SF position has a real log jam there.

Proctor isn't that far off imo, given he's just a yr younger than dyson and will be turning 18 this april, and is already being touted as one of the best guards in the 2023 draft and a 5 star consensus recruit. There is also some talk that he might be reclassifying to the 2022 draft , thereby meaning both he and dyson will be entering the draft at the same time..and from what i've read about him, he could very well blow dyson out of the water..

Plenty of the Spanish national team hovering around 36-40 and that didn't stop them winning the world cup and probably being only a Team USA smackdown away from another medal in 2021. I think 2024 would be his last tournament but I highly doubt he's zero percent likely to make it there. You'd have to be predicting he declines quite rapidly to go from one of the NBA's best shooters and an NBA starter to not on the Boomers in two years, or at least a zero percent shot.

I think Andrew Gaze is a good comparison for Joe in a lot of ways (not saying they're identical).

Drew led the 2000 Olympics in scoring (by a full 5ppg) while leading the Boomers to their equal best ever finish to that point at 35 years of age.

If Joe is healthy, he should be there.

I think first question is what does Joe's career look like in 2023?

He's either nabbed another NBA job, being paid veteran minimum and looking at his last year or two in the NBA; or he's in the NBL, and most likely the best wing player in the league.

I'd say that alone puts him well and truly in the Boomers mix.

Then you look at the assets he brings to the team, and the one thing no other player at his position can provide is experience and playmaking.

We don't have another small forward who can play minutes at point, pass and shoot the way he does. That will be as true in two years as it is now.

That doesn't mean Joe has a blank check to be a Boomer for as long as he wants but until someone else steps into that role, the spot is his to lose just as the same opportunity was afforded to Delly even though he wasn't quite in game shape in Tokyo.

I am not saying that Joe absolutely will not lose his spot, I am just saying it will take some doing and it's not something I foresee next year, or likely even the year after.

If one of Dyson Daniels or Josh Green absolutely blows up then we will have to ask the question again, and possibly with a different answer.

Matisse Thybulle is a lock. I think he can be a Boomer mainstay for the next decade if he chooses to be.

But when it comes to international basketball, an experienced core group matters. Australia will never have the talent of Team USA. The only teams that have truly challenged the Dream Team are the ones who've been around long enough to know how.

So who will we have back in 2023/4?

Patty Mills - absolute lock. Knock on wood and pray that that man stays fit and healthy.

Jock Landale - lock. Doing great things in the NBA

Matisse Thybulle - Lock. As long as he wants to be a Boomer he'll be there.

Nick Kay - close to lock. Dependable player. Has international experience now.

Dante Exum - lock. Is showing what he's got for Barcelona right now. Has a future with the Boomers.

Some of those guys are merely role players and cant be asked to take on big roles, with many of them set to go to Josh Giddey, (maybe) Ben Simmons, and one of Josh Green and Dyson Daniels.

That's where Ingles experience as a steadying hand becomes all the more important, especially with Baynes and Delly questionable to move forward with the team.

It's been Delly-Patty-Ingles-Baynes and Bogut for so long. Then it was Delly-Patty-Ingles, Baynes. Then Delly-Patty-Ingles. It would be a shame to see that core group whittled down to just Patty by 2024, as a fan who has been there every step of the way.

To me Ingles if healthy is a lock for 23 and 24, if anything you reduce his role and bring him off the bench

To me you basically take the Bronze team

Replace Goulding and Sobey with Giddey and Daniels
Replace Baynes with the best big we can find such as Maker, Humphries, Acuil, Bairsotw

Gives you say

Landale/Reath
Kay/Maker
Ingles/Thybulle
Mills/Green/Daniels
Giddey/Exum/Delly

I wouldnt be leaving out any of Giddey, Green, Daniels if healthy and available, if you want an extra big its probably Delly who misses out.

Except that landale absolutely hasn't geen doing "great things" in the nba at all. If anything, he's been a hot pile of garbage against any and all half decent teams thus far, not sure if you've actually watched any of his games..

Does everyone here actually watch basketball?

Does everyone here actually watch basketball?

Definitely question marks around the big man situation. Thon and Reath are just the best of a bad situation.

Seems that we have some doubts regarding Our bigs.

Well, we won Bronze with Baynes and Reath as 5's and Landale and Kay as 4,s. Baynes is tried-and-true and the others all will be better than their last campaign.

Add, into the mix and competition for spots, Humphries, JLA, Bairstow, Harry Froling, Magnay, Brandt and Simmons and in another 2 years even Perry and Hayes-Brown may throw their hats in.

The only down side I see for the next version of the Boomers is that Baynes may not be avail(health) and Joe may now be in real doubt. Ingles' skill-set can be replaced but not Joe himself (seen several comparisons for Joe's impact on the Boomers - I think of what Teys brought to Adel and the NBL in his tenure. Think also of Greg Hire and Wagstaff).

And with all due respects to Sobey, Goulding and Delly, look at their (likely) replacements, Giddey, Green, Daniels, Proctor(?) and with either White or Cooks for Joe, if required and several other risers, too.

I forgot to include Thon.

It's slim pickings inside and I feel like Baynes chooses himself IF he is playing professional basketball in 2023 and IF he still wants to take the risk

Dyson daniels is supposed to be a guard, people, stop slotting him at sf. He ran the point in the u19 world cup and is currently running point at ignite..ofc he might be willing to play small forward if need be i guess? , but pg/sg is his natural position..but the big problem here is that both him and giddey are equally bad at scoring, esp from the 3 pt line ( at the moment) and have loose ball handling, although daniels is a great defender and a far better athlete ( albeit not as good as green) and boasts a high pretty iq himself...on the other hand giddey is a rebounding machine in addition to his already elite iq and playmaking ability and is very crafty and has more exp.

Thybulle is a blackhole on offense i'm afraid, he can neither create for others nor for himself and has poor offensive iq , whereas dysons only real area of concern is his scoring. So it's really unfair on dyson to put him in the same bracket as thybulle. I'm not entirely sold on armstrong either tbh, he's playing in an extremely weak conference against a bunch of scrubs, and is a horrible scorer in his own right. I'm actually reakly concerned about giddey's scoring potential too, he's doesn't really seem to have improved much from his nbl stint.

Not to mention thybulle is 24 and dyson is 18. So Dyson has a far higher overall ceiling due to his age factor alone.

Thybulle wasn't that bad offensively during the Olympics, he was pretty helpful on that front actually.

No doubt scoring is going to be a big issue as Mills retires and even as Ingles retired. Obvious statement of the year there. Limited options, but we may have to hang our hat on Giddey making others better - wings that can take advantage of a good passer and the space that comes with it.

Draft positions keep constantly changing all the damn time. Dyson, for instance , entered the draft at 14 and is now hovering around the late first rd/ borderline 2nd round mark, so draft positions mean absolutely fuck all at the end of the day. Teams look a lot of other factors incl , the kind of competition you're up against. Giddey was picked at 6 because he was an 18 yr old playing against grown ups in the nbl , not some no name scrubs in a shit college.

@KET I guess it helps that fiba basketball is a rung below the nba, which helps hide some of thybulle's glaring issues on the offense, but he gets completely exposed in the nba day in and day out.

Thybulle was adequate offensively at the Olympics. He hit open threes and his defense created offense.

As for scorers, guy doesnt have to be a noted NBA scorer to score internationally. Josh Green would have the tools and I dont see why GIddey couldnt average 12-15.

But if we want scoring-minded players, we have to look at DJ Vaselijic. He probably is the best up and coming scorer and you' have to consider giving him a spot on that alone.

Even assuming giddey averaged 12-15, that's still nowhere near enough, especially considering mills isn't gonna be around for much longer..you can't depend on giddey to hit a contested 3 pt in the clutch to tie /win a game when he can't even make wide open 3's most of the time...so lets hope dj is that person...

We've probably got Patty through to 2024. After that... then yes we really do need a go-to guy. But right now, Patty is as good a go-to as exists in FIBA basketball. We're lucky to have him.

Yeah forgot about Mathiang but he definitely should be considered.

Okay....what if mills suffers a serious injury which rules him out of both the 23' world cup and the oly? Granted he's pretty fit but injuries can happen to anyone at anytime, or what if his form severely regresses and he becomes unplayable? Gotta have contingency plans in place..

Patty goes down, he goes down! Nothing we can do about it.

You're right though. There is no Patty replacement.

2 choices:
1. Combine the best that DJ, CG43, Sobes and Creeky have to offer into one cyborg replacement.
2. Cheat and play Cotton (somehow!?). If he grew his hair, had it braided, and we get a bunch of brand new officials at WCs and Os (who don't know Patty), we should get away with a simple identity change for Bryce. Apparently very easy to do nowadays! They are about the same size too so might just work!

whatever will be will be I guess. I think the Boomers are in a great position moving forward but there are definitely some areas that need to be shored up

I'd like to add turkey in that list too....

I'd like to add turkey in that list too....

Are you ordering from a menu or talking about the country Turkey? Either would be good, actually, yum, yum!

Career timetable confirmed, straight from the horse's mouth:

Then it will be all the more remarkable when he kills it at the Olympics to help us win gold :)

Anything after 2024 is jumping too far ahead to see. People keep talking about Canada but they put together a team that, on paper, could have medalled and they didn't even make it out of qualifications. We don't know who will emerge and who wont between then and now. There would have been a time when we called Jonah Bolden one of our brightest prospects, he took a shit on his country and then went into cryptocurrency. Then someone like Josh Giddey comes along and is much better than we would have projected 2 years ago. I mean, who was seriously talking about Josh Giddey as a possible Boomers mainstay in 2019? The same factors face other national teams.

As for Joe Ingles, I knew that would be his stance. The reason why the Ryan Broekhoff analogy is never going to be apt is because Broekhoff was always a one-trick pony. He looked very good at it at one point but clearly he's too well scouted down here and he's lost his shot. Joe Ingles can do a bit of everything and he has runs on the board in Europe and the NBL leading into this. If Joe came to the NBL I guarantee you he wouldn't be stinking it up like Broekhoff. They're not made the same.

The way I see it, we have Goulding and Jingles with the shooter's mentality but also the swagger, and Broekhoff and Vasiljevic who haven’t got the swagger and are trying to find their shots again.

Each can be lethal once they get going, but I’d have more confidence in Goulding and Jingles getting their shot back in a hurry. Broekhoff seems too much of a player who needs confidence to be lethal. Vasiljevic seems a James Harden type of player - has heaps of confidence, will put up a lot of shots and often score heaps, but will struggle on defence.

Looks like Gouldings found his stroke again, which was always going to happen

I think we're all forgetting one very imp thing : our medal prospects will as always boil down to when we play the usa, if we meet them anytime b4 the semis, we might as well forget about it or hope either one of spain/france pull the carpet from under their rug in the knockouts..

Pull the rug from under their feet*

Depends on what team USA brings. And sometimes that doesn't even matter. I mean the USA team of 2004 wasnt even bad on paper, but we almost beat them with NBL scrubs and they ended up leaving with bronze. USA beating everyone is no longer a fate accompli.

I am not saying Boomers will win gold, or they're favourites, or anything like that, but should Joe believe he can do it? Yes.

Ya That's right too anon, but moving foward i fully expect them to send out atleast semi competent teams capable of medalling both in the world cups and the oly, ja morant will prolly also be a part of their contingent for a long time to come ( atleast for the oly )..and that guy is as unguardable as they come...

@ME well look i respect and love jingles as much as the next person, but i think his belief is a wee bit misplaced here, but having said that, if simmons decides to show up then our chances of getting that elusive gold goes up exponentially...so that remains to be seen...

Ingles
Giddey
Mills
Green
Thybulle
Simmons
Landale

All walk into the Boomers squad before the ACL injury. (If they want to)

Baynes would've too a year ago.

Now Ingles & Baynes will need to rehab & hope they can come back as they were fighting injuries & father time.

Ingles could've probably got in as one of the best 2 PGs SFs or PFs. His versatility is remarkable.

Now with the injury. Who knows.