Tornado
Years ago

Newley a no-go according to Clarke

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/sport/basketball/adelaide-36ers-to-recruit-new-talent-from-europe-and-america/story-e6frect3-1226332047672

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LC  
Years ago

Newley, Simpson, Delly off the radar...

Clarke to chase talented Aussies...

Reply #358951 | Report this post


Wombat  
Years ago

He would never have really been on the radar. Newley recently moved from his Lithuanian club, where he himself said he wasn't getting much playing time, to the Spanish club Valencia Basket.
In the Eurocup semi-final he top scored for his new team against his old team. Even though he only played seven minutes in the grand final, he is on his way up in the new club. And he gets to play in the Spanish league - better than the NBL.
Andrew Ogilvy, also with Valencia, didn't play at all in the Eurocup finlas (injured?) and Matt Nielson, who was on the winning team Khimki, only played 15 minutes in the final. These are two players that aren't being touted to come back to Australia as they are 'established' in Europe.
I don't think the Sixers could afford Newley at the moment any way - or at least afford him and some other decent players.

Reply #358961 | Report this post


Observer  
Years ago

No star players to sixers we will have crappy team again in 2012/13 season,if clarke cant get talent that he wants ,might as well retain majoity of team and get simpson back with a consistent point guard!!!

Reply #358969 | Report this post


LC  
Years ago

Ogilvy has been battling injury...

Reply #358972 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Where did Clarke say Newley is a no-go? He said he expects him to return in the next few years. If a good offer doesnt come next year in Europe, and he is hardly blitzing for an import, he might become a possibility. Who knows.

Reply #358973 | Report this post


Mick  
Years ago

Not a chance. Will not return until he is at least in his early 30s.

Reply #358975 | Report this post


Tornado  
Years ago

Anon 358973, Clarke mentioned that Newley was not on their radar, thus, he is a no go.

I cant think of a top class Aussie that they might seriously attract? I'm usually an optimist but I think all this talk about obtaining an Aussie Marquee talent could all be smoke screens?!

I hope I am wrong though!

Reply #358976 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

So who you gonna get?

South Australians don't want to play for you - more interested in Europe and other NBL clubs.

You have no money, so the best imports look elsewhere.

Seems you're stuck.

What selling points does Adelaide have? The Club? The City? The market? Money?

Cellar dwellers for a while yet.

The talent you have isn't good enough.

Reply #358977 | Report this post


Big Ads  
Years ago

To paraphase the Police Commissioner on Rastamouse

"Tiger Watcher comin, comin, we need your help"

(All those parents with young children who watch ABC 2 in the mornings will appreciate the reference).

What news can you draw from your sources?

Reply #358978 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

wish clarke was a go and not come back

Reply #358980 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Clarke really has been this amazing recruiter people sold him as! Clarke should be the no go!

Reply #358985 | Report this post


Loco  
Years ago

Everytime I see Clarke's name associated with the Sixers, I get a little sadder and someone kills a puppy.

Reply #358988 | Report this post


Tiger Watcher  
Years ago

I've got it from strong sources that they have tabled offers to 2 very solid current Australian NBL players!

Both of these guys you would think are untouchable but things aren't quite so sunny as they appear from the outside. Old Melb & Syd town is having management/player issues due to extra off season work loads (i.e 6-8 hours of clinics a day, no option to play ABA back home etc)

If i was a betting man i'd suggest you'll get at least one of these players pending meeting between us on Monday/Tuesday afternoon.

Just so your aware you probably can't take both as 36er's have offer 2 & 3 year deals with very competitive $$$ attached.

I'll know more by tuesday afternoon!

Reply #358989 | Report this post


orange  
Years ago

Bose and trigger?

Reply #358993 | Report this post


LC  
Years ago

Didn't Clarke bring in Creek and Johnson?

Reply #358994 | Report this post


Observer  
Years ago

Wait and c who clarke gets,would like to get bose he be solid sf,trigger would go to other melb team if that happens.still awhile yet before free agents start another 2.5 weeks to go.We will be in bottom group AGAIN.

Reply #358999 | Report this post


Tornado  
Years ago

Bose would be a good pick up!

Reply #359005 | Report this post


Tornado  
Years ago

Perhaps Madgen, Dillon?

Reply #359006 | Report this post


Tornado  
Years ago

Tiger Watcher, so those players they were looking at O/S are no longer on the radar?

This is Plan B?

Is there a Plan C?

Reply #359007 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Bose would be awesome as our starting SG, and would improve our outside scoring,

I personally wouldnt be chasing Trigger too hard if I was the 36ers he is too similar to Johnson and Ballinger, the main bigs in the NBL i'd be making offers to are Khazzouh, Neville, Schenscher, Worthington, not all of them are the perfect compliment to Johnson but would all be good pickups and Johnson could play PF alongside Neville/Schenscher IMO, maybe not ideal for NBL style but if used properly could be the NBL's twin towers and do very well especially offensively

probably not marquee players but wouldnt mind seeing Davidson or Crosswhite either as they could work well with Johnson and Ballinger, with Johnson playing some PF.

If its Melbourne and Sydney player I hope its either Bose,Khazzouh from the Kings (Bruce or Madgen would also be good pickups but wouldnt pay big bucks), from the Tigers I wouldnt really pay huge bucks for any of their players but wouldnt mind giving Dillon, Rush or Burston a spot off the bench.

One thought, if moneys an issue and we want to sign 2 imports plus atleast 1 (try for 2) marquee Aussies, why dont we grab Ubaka and Dorsey as our imports, with the Tigers paying the bulk of their salary, we could just pay them NBL minimum, and then spend the rest chasing hard for say Kahzzouh (and Bose if we have enough $$).

I reckon a line up of this would be pretty good

C Khazzouh/?? Vanderjagt

PF Johnson/Dorsey (not really a PF but him and Weigh could play 5-10 mins a game in PF, KB was a similar mould of player and played PF with Cat)

SF Creek/Weigh

SG Bose/Bartlett

PG Ubaka/Crosswell

Not sure if Dorsey will be keen for a bench role but if its the difference between being in the NBL or not he may take it and would be handy backing up SG,SF,PF, as he is long, athletic, plays defense, and can shoot/score when he gets going.

Reply #359008 | Report this post


Tiger Watcher  
Years ago

Message i got from the 6er's is they sort out Aussies first then imports.

FYI - Ballinger is a last resort @ PF due to fitness issues and they'll hold on resigning him until they get yes/no from a couple of targets.
(No such thing as loyalty anymore)

Still looking OS but got litttle to none positive feedback doesn't mean they won't pull it off, but niether Euro returnee wants to play for a cellar dweller! (Hint: sign better NBL players first, then i'll be back)






Reply #359011 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Just like that the big story of luring back a couple of big name Aussies playing overseas is looking like pie in the sky BS yet again.

Promise the world and will deliver another rubbish team next season looks more likely.

Reply #359017 | Report this post


Dazzman  
Years ago

I'd go with Julian Khazzouh and Lucas Walker or Liam Rush

Reply #359019 | Report this post


Aussiebballer  
Years ago

What happened to Liam Rush this season??

He was playing well in Europe and then had a very crap season in the NBL

Reply #359020 | Report this post


paul  
Years ago

It's a fair step up in quality from the comp he was playing in to the NBL, it just took him a while to re-adjust. His form in the second half of the year was defintiely better than early in the season.

Reply #359024 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Come on. Don't be so harsh. We got croswell and weigh last year because of Clarke.

Year before we got Daniel Johnson and Creek.

Based on Clarke apologists that means we have a starting 5 next year of Weigh who is the next Cattalini, Creek who is the next Mackinnon and DJ who has the potential to be the Nowitzki of the NBL.

Factor in that after Daly has been developed by Clarke for two years he is ready to step up and fulfill his next Brett Maher potential.

So in summary, entering into the third year of the third year plan we can look forward to a team of the next Maher, Cattalini, Mackinnon and nowitzki.

That is as good of a nucleus as you will find.

Factor in Clarkes' expansive import connections and you add the next Robert Rose and the next Leroy Loggins to that Australian core group and you would be crazy not to purchase your season tickets immediately.

Reply #359038 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

lmao gold, although it was paul trying on the "Creek might be the next Sammy Mac" guff not 36ers fans.

Reply #359040 | Report this post


EC  
Years ago

Who you get is not as important as what Clarke will do with them. A bit like a state of the art piece of equipment and not knowing how to operate it.

Reply #359052 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

Excellent point EC. Agree completely.

The disappointing part is I am sure SOS appreciated that Clarke was unproven as a NBL coach.

I assume that what got him the job was his representations as to recruiting and connections with the best young NBL talent.

Yet so far he has not delivered in the area of recruiting in years one or two. Can't help but think more of the same this off season.

Take Daly as a case study.

Actually impressed me in year 1 which was a nice surprise albeit in a losing team. Then they recruit a past it old NBL point guard in Crosswell. He turned out to better than I thought but still didnt change the fact that Daly's development was curtailed. Daly went backward due to lack of opportunity.

If we were contending for a championship then fair enough but not seeing just how good Daly or Creek could be with say 20 mins per game was disappointing given we won the wooden spoon anyway. It was Clarke who angered the fans with his "it's not about wins and losses" speech but his actions in signing Croswell in the first place smacked of desperation after his attempts to sign Martin and Gibson fell flat.

Now if Clarke was of the opinion that first Croswell and then Bartlett were better options than Daly then why put multiple years into Daly for no reason. Both are fringe NBL players at best.

Use your AIS connections and sign some other 18 year old PG who you think actually does have what it takes if you don't think that person is Daly.

Now if we were winning then I would cut him some slack but when the season was completely gone and you still dont give minutes to Daly then what is achieved.

Same with Creek but even more frustrating given how poorly Weigh was playing.

Reply #359058 | Report this post


phil  
Years ago

no he did increase creeks minutes and responsibility this year especially as the season went on. i do agree re daly though. thats a general fault of the nbl though, we wait far to long to develop players and in dalys case when do we find out if he can be a quality long term player or not??? when he is in his late 20's????

Reply #359081 | Report this post


Tornado  
Years ago

its easy to be in a position to recruit but not that easy to pull it off.....especially when you're talking about players in Europe and College. If they werent successfull over there then we probably wouldnt want them right? If they are successfull we want them but they have bigger and better things they want to accomplish.

It's easire said than done!

Reply #359084 | Report this post


Tornado  
Years ago

In terms of Daly, if he were that good to warrant developing then he would likely have been at the AIS. I'm not too fussed about his development. How many other teams of late have development players that end up being solid NBL players?

Reply #359085 | Report this post


phil  
Years ago

was interesting that they did say they expect newls will look at coming home in the next couple of years..

who would we be talking to from sydney and melb??

ild think rush could be one who may want elsewhere after his year but what does he add to our side..dont we have the sf position sewn up with weigh/ creek??

if we add rush do we end up running with a side like

johnson
weigh
rush
sg
pg

and going small again and no-one that can guard as well!!!!!!!!!! same problems.

and ild be surprised if we could get bose, kid will be very sought after but again we would be stuck with a very small and weak defensive side.

??

we could use madgen in the sg position i think and it may be possible but its not going to turn us into a contender. maybe we are targeting matt bursten to come back to be a back-up centre. would be better than helliwell.

yeah thats where ill place my bets we are going for madgen and bursten to be our back-up centre. not any stars or big leaps forward but an improvement to our current side if we did get those 2 ( and matt stays half-fit) and we get a good pg import.

Reply #359086 | Report this post


phil  
Years ago

tornado what does that say about our ability to develop basketballers??

dont we have professional systems in the nbl???

cant anyone who wasnt a prodigy at 15 or in the top 5% of basketballers in the country rise up to become a great player? why not???

Reply #359088 | Report this post


paul  
Years ago

I think the problem is that the depth in the league due to the reduction in teams, and the physicality allowed by the refs, means only the real stand out young players can make an impact before at least 23, and often players find their feet at 25-26.

If you look back at the years when there were 90-110 Aussies in the league, instead of 70 now, players got a chance to play sooner and improve quicker (or at least find out they werent good enough rather than just becoming dispirited training fodder).

Reply #359089 | Report this post


Tornado  
Years ago

Phil, I am saying anyone who is half decent is either at the AIS or they head over to the US and try their hand at college. There are players that head to college who havent been at the AIS too. So when you factor all of that in we are basically left with the best of the worst as harsh as that may sound. As a result, we unfortunately dont get the opportunity to really develop talent like we once did due to those reasons.

Take Madgen for example, was on the 6ers roster as a development player and then went to college, came back as a decent player at NBL level.

American colleges are the best way to develop, majority of the best coaches and you get to play against the best talent for your age. Its a no brainer really!

Having said that, there may be one that sneaks through every now and then but I dont think Daly is one of those?

Reply #359115 | Report this post


phil  
Years ago

im only having a go at our system and its ability to develop players. which on evidence is massively poor.

a good example although a little out of place is to look at the afl...

so about 50-80 players will be put onto rosters through the drafts each year. you can consider the first 20 kids to be whatever top %. say top 20% of your talent. 5 years on if you identify the top 20% talents to come from that year maybe less than half would have come from that original top 20 % and the rest from outside that margin.

in the nbl equivilent those top 20% will be the ones to go on to ais/ college or whatever good opportunities while the others rot away because we cant get them into good programs to identify and build talent. inevitably a great number of those 20% fail or dont quite become as good as was hoped and, the other % of players rarely get a chance to get identified and developed.

again to go back to footy nathan fyfe, a ridiculous talent and one of afls best at what 22ish? was pick number 20 in his afl draft. if, like the nbl there was only much smaller fixed number of opportunities ( say 19 spots available ) and not a very good secondary competition with plenty of gametime against seasoned players and other guys on afl lists such as sanfl/ wafl/ vfl than what would have happened to nathan fyfe?? he would have had to get a job/ tertiary study and play his sport around that. would we have the nathan fyfe we have now??? almost certainly not.

appreciated we cant put 60 guys a year on lists with team lists half the size of football and half as many teams.

still, even as a percentage, how many new players brought in would be far lower than the afl. as a percentage, and again as a percentage the amount of new players that even get gametime lets say as a measure how many new players would get say 1/4 of total gametime per a match per 1/4 of the season?

for the afl that statistic would be in the 15-40 guys and a single figure as a percentage. in the nbl, we wouldnt add more than one locally developed new player per a season that plays that much gametime. its percentage would be 0.03 percent.

how the frak our we ever gonna develop better players except for the handful that are good at 15 and go to the ais or get into a college???

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Anonymous  
Years ago

A group of young kids (18-24) don't win in the NBL. Veteran teams usually win.

The youngest team to have won a title in the last 15 years would be the Magic in 96. They did it with Anstey, McKinnon, Drmic, Tony Ronaldson and Jason Smith having decent roles.

You have to admire what Clarke is doing, but he's butting his head up against a brick wall.

It's also true that if you could get ALL the Australian College kids, and ALL the Australians in Europe to come and play back here, you would have maybe an extra 4 teams worth of deep talent.

The NBL is what the old NSL is...best players are elsewhere.



Reply #359137 | Report this post


phil  
Years ago

im talking about coachs etc stop looking elsewhere for players or whinging how we cant get any good players to come home and actually start trying to develop players.

no-one is expecting someone to field only a team of kids.

you know how afl players become good afl players?? by playing in the afl. you dont become a good afl player by playing state league. and no way can you become a good nbl player by playing abl etc.

Reply #359144 | Report this post


paul  
Years ago

A lot of players get a good start in state league footy. The issue is basketball doesnt have an equivalent to state league. The difference between the NBL and second tier is too great and too many players who would help make the second tier strong are at college.

Reply #359150 | Report this post


Big Ads  
Years ago

It's a real pity that the old SEABL comp from the late 80's/early 90's dropped away. Some great young talent was nurtured in that comp.

Reply #359184 | Report this post




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