fastrating
Years ago

NITP - NPP

How is it that an under 16 girls team with 2 NITP and 3 NPP players don't even make VC? They make up half the VIC state team! What is going on? One other team with 5 NITP kids just scraped in. They have all had the extra development for almost a year now yet kids that didn't make the program are clearly better strange. The results are now clear and can't be debated the proof is in the pudding. The system is not working.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

NITP is so overrated!!! there are some average coaches in that program that sees kids wasting time on not developng their game.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Don't be fooled into thinking that just because a team in the VJBL has NITP or NPP players they will automatically be used the same way as they would in a State or National team.

Coaches in the VJBL are not the same and have their own ideas, their own favourites and their own problems in getting their team to play the way they want.

There is no comparison here, you are not making sense because you do not appear to understand how basketball teams work, sorry to deflate your original post @frustrating, but the sad reality is that all you have done here is have a bit of a whinge.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

'The system is not working'

The system for NITP and NPP is not designed to improve VJBL teams, it is designed to identify potential for an elite pathway. Two different things!

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Yes, clueless and unnecessary rant by the OP. Obviously their little darling has missed out on something.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

You could draw that conclusion anon^, based on the second part of the OP's comment in relation to other kids being better. Sadly the OP has mistakenly continued with their post when they should have stopped half way through.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

The numbers in the first half are wrong also.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Must be time for a post about Melbourne u18s not having anyone in teams about now.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Yep just like the boys U18 team with 2 NPP 4 NITP and they ended up in middle of bottom half with just 3 wins after round 9 in VC.

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.  
Years ago

First years?

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Observer  
Years ago

Again dynamics of team and the coach all have a bearing on how they preform on the court. Can be as many NPP and NITP as you like does not mean they gel and with ego's of players and parents thrown in well..

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Not to mention mates of head coaches who have no idea what they are doing being given a team and ruining their year.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Absolutely ture OP. The thing about this post is that if your kids are in the NITP program you say the OP has no idea. My child is in the NITP program. We are greatful for the opportunity. I do see many players that are just as skillfull and competitive that are not NITP. Some of of them took our team apart as they always have in the first half of the season. Why shouldn't the parents and child feel fastratred is that not natural? Do we really feel that BV get it right all the time? Is it a perfect system? Do you not think politics plays a big part? I know it dose! I think some people need some commonsense clearly the results say something about selections.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Again in English?

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Anonymous  
Years ago

^words to big for you^

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john  
Years ago

It's interesting

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Who gives a toss! Bloody Victoria, think your programs are the best. As soon as it's gets real (seniors) you get smashed!

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Anonymous  
Years ago

The words were too small for me, the grammar too bad, and the spelling appalling.

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HO  
Years ago

"as soon as it gets real (seniors) you get smashed!

What does that even mean?

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Sooky parents...

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Anonymous  
Years ago

I love the sooky parent's comment! Small minds simple comments.

"The words were too small for me, the grammar too bad, and the spelling appalling."

Whilst the vernacular may not have been perfect resorting to simplistic responses is hardly a great representation of ones grasp on the Queen’s English Troglodyte.

I didn't find it very difficult to understand the context and agree. Lots of great kids get overlooked. It’s simply not possible to pick them all.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

If players get overlooked can they also be underlooked?

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Not a parent, nor player but a coaches point of view.

Some players overlooked/underlooked by network coaches to push those who are favored, or have a personal relationship with or they have vested time into and will not be proved wrong.
But ain't that just the world we live in.

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Big V  
Years ago

My daughter had been in the program and we were very happy with the results. Its hard to make these programs suit all players. You can't! But it at least ensures that the talls get some ball skills. Some will find it boring but I hope they persist. Everyone can't be in the program.
She has been able to progress. Would she have been able to without the NITP, who knows, but it did help her choose a pathway.

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HO  
Years ago

The NITP-NPP BA pathway debate comes up all the time.

My question is different. How often do they get it wrong?

Its easy to make allegations of favouritism or nepotism but when it really matters, developing young athletes ready to play for Australia at junior and possibly at senior level in the future - how often do they make a major screw up?

If the mistakes are at the margins, so be it, but if they are getting it wrong consistently with identifying and developing the real talent, that is a different issue.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Who's to say that every player that is invited to NITP takes up the offer?

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Anonymous  
Years ago

HO the system is set up to develop only those who are willing to sacrifice everything to play for their country and for that one special individual found every now and then who will be allowed to go through without being at risk of being asked to leave the program.

NPP is in place to weed out those kids who are not seen to be totally dedicated to the system and the KPI's set before them, so they are not going to end up making any screw-ups as you have put it. The system protects itself from this because they can always point a finger at some statistic or some lack of dedication to eleminate a kid and since they have enough of their COE kids anyway, the selectors decisions are always going to be vindicated by the system they have in place.

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Big V  
Years ago

Good point HO.

Many girls, in particular, reach their potential early. They are superstars early but don't develop beyond that. Is NITP looking at rough diamonds? Sometimes looking for a Delly? Where their drive outmatchs their early skills. As long as all the kids get a chance to develop. there will always be fringe players, some will come on! It's really easy to change sports if it gets too hard. But I did notice that some parents expect individual coaching in a group environment.

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HO  
Years ago

#529852

Thats an interesting response. Can I ask the question more specifically?

Who did we lose?

And I don't mean which kid went to football or netball, which kid did not make NITP or NPP that should have (due to nepotism or whatever) and therefore is not wearing green and gold?

I am sure there will be some.

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Bear  
Years ago

@HO, you may be asking something that is probably going to be seen as too subjective to comment on when it comes to naming somone like that brother...

Who wants to name that kid or those potential prospects and what would be the point?

So many have gone through this pathway, which itself has changed many times, that is a hard one to discuss on a forum I would have thought.

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Bear  
Years ago

Then to suggest naming any kid who didn't even make NITP or NPP in the first place but should have, well only a parent or someone very close would probably be able to do this, again very subjective IMHO...

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Anonymous  
Years ago

#529902

(Thats an interesting response. Can I ask the question more specifically?

Who did we lose?)

If the program is any good then kids that miss selection are at a distinct disadvantage. They miss out on years of what should be quality coaching and guidance.

The system is stacked, how could it not be? It's all subjective selection. We have all seen kids at tryouts head directly to a home club coach. When they were not originally selected in that group, accordingly groups are uneven. Why should this happen? Do they think they have an advantage? Last year’s selection is evidence of home club selection issues.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Then the issue is not corruption, it's human nature.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

How many people get invited to NITP try outs?

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HO  
Years ago

Good point Bear.

But of course its subjective. But so is the opinion being thrashed here by some about favouritism or nepotism.

In the AFL we have had the example of Barlow (Freo) and others who have become legitimate stars in the league without being seen as part of the draft/elite pathway necessarily.

Let me ask yet another different question. I think it would be relatively simple for someone here to point out someone currently enjoying a successful (probably a 3-4 year starter) NBL or WNBL career who was not in the pathway.

Then we have something to talk about, instead of people like 529945 talking about the kids who miss out being disadvantaged.

It is my view that the high performance pathway, for all the accusations made about it, has generally got it right over a long period of time.

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Freddy  
Years ago

Ho and Bear, I'll give you one name - Stacey Barr!

Never made NITP or NPP not State team but kills in it Div 1 College.

Killed the Div 1 Women's comp as a 16 year old and still no recognition.

There are heaps on kids who deserved to be selected in 12s & 14s but they should have been dropped when they go to 16s as their skills dropped off or didn't grow like expected.

The core group are right but we are talking about kids who are pushed by someone rather than earning it. HOWEVER this is life.

An true elite system doesn't allow for this or has checks and balances to address it. NITP doesn't have these - which is the issue.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

I agree, there are many girls running around in VIC NITP at the moment that just should not be.

They seem to have been selected years ago and are somehow still in there.

There needs to be a structured way kids are cut from the program if they don't meet standards/requirements.

And new developing talent needs to be added.

It would be a far better program if it was smaller, kids had to earn their place, and places were constantly reviewed.

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Bear  
Years ago

Ok HO, then I will nominate a bloke who killed it in SEABL and is now doing fantastic in SCM, Jason Reardon, believe he didn't go the pathway either, yet has had a great career without getting to the NBL of course. (Probably would have done well there too).

Is this the example you were after mate?

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HO  
Years ago

OK, but Freddy, to some degree, isn't the proof in the pudding? The system has developed many many world class athletes, yet you are saying it is seriously lacking - so is it seriously lacking now or has it always been?

And #529954, I have heard this for years - that they have got it wrong etc etc, which means we will be in a disastrous position in 3-5 years time.

BTW, I have never heard of Stacey Barr - apologies. But the proof will be what she does when she comes back. If she is killing D1 College (and I guess a good school in a good conference) then i assume she will come straight back and play WNBL and do well - that becomes the test.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Just read original comment so am going back to that. Geelong U18 Boys have 3 State players NPP and I believe others in NITP and while they did make VC they are not top 10.

Not sure what this means or if it gives justification to original post.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

How about young Joel Smith playing for the Geelong supercats his a GUN. Didn't make any NITP or Vic state teams. Yet was selected in the Australian side!

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Anonymous  
Years ago

HO, it is just a sub-elite program.

Too many kids in it, standards (expectations) are too low.

Coaching lacks preparation & intensity. It is mediocre.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Clearly the system only works for some. Sure if your over 6 5" then the opportunity is going to present. However as stated above lots of kids get positions not deserved and others miss because they come from the wrong club or the home club has no coaches selecting.

Is program state funded?

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Anonymous  
Years ago

stacy Barr plays for Idaho, or did think this was her last year, in the Western Athletic Conference, not the strongest conference in Div1 and from memory she never played in a very strong team as a junior , so think that kept her from the NITP area,

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HO  
Years ago

Actually Bear, I would think Reardon is an example of NITP working, not failing,

If the guy did not make NITP, and has not made NBL, surely the NITP decision makers got it right?

Again, I am not a judge here, just trying to put some sense into the discussion rather than just people saying the system does not work when the evidence would seem to be the system works very well.

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HO  
Years ago

#529982

I'll defer to you about numbers because I have no idea. But isn't that the reason there is a difference between NITP and NPP?

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Having coached in these programs and their predecessors, I think one of the most difficult things is that kids already in the program have such a huge advantage in the trial process. They're more familiar with standards and expectations and are more prepared to train, play and behave in the ways expected by selectors. It then becomes extremely difficult to say 'sorry, we're not picking you this year because even thought you're better than some kids who are making it, and you've done what we've asked of you, they show more potential.'

However, that's probably what needs to happen. A kid who gets close to the standard of NPP without the advantages of the program probably deserves a chance to enjoy those opportunities. It may accelerate their development, and creates greater competition/incentive for those within the program if they know that to retain their spots, they are expected to be head and shoulders about competitors.

I think the pathways themselves are outstanding, especially given the resource limitations. But there's an argument to be made that better allocation of those resources might produce better results.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Don't NITP OR NPP just train for 2 hours on Sunday. What is the big deal if you are in or out. Work hard that is the answer.

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Bear  
Years ago

Anon^ it is about 9 hours per week, in addition to whatever else the kids do outside of NPP training.

A huge commitment, then there are camps and other trainings every so often as a group or tours and possible COE visits.

A bit more than just a 2 hour session once a week!

Anon #978, the Geelong 18 team had a kid drop out and are down to nine this season, have had another one or two injured almost every week and just have not been consistent, so they didn't make VC. Less to do with the fact they have a couple of NPP players than various other reasons.

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Bear  
Years ago

@HO, fair enough, depends how you look at it I guess...

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Anonymous  
Years ago

#529999

Interesting comment's it's great to get a real feel from someone who understands the inner workings of the program. Clearly some adjustment is needed. A new frame work perhaps.

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?  
Years ago

Sorry I'm missing the point.

Whats not working other than some kids missing out that some think should be in ? Unfortunately there is a subjective decision process here that will always be the case when you have limited space in a programme. Some in, some out.

Are we not recognized as one of the premier junior programmes in the world ? Recent medals at worlds suggest we are doing ok.

The better question is how are we going converting great junior champs performance into senior medals ie after graduation from these programmes. women ok, but men ??

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Anonymous  
Years ago

#530023

My understanding is that we (Victoria) do not go so great in senior national championships I am however a little ignorant on the facts.

The references above indicate that the system is full of prejudices. I'm referencing the apparent testimony of the above coaches and other coaches with whom I have personally conversed with over time.

The better question is! Can we improve?

No system is beyond scrutiny; in fact best practice commercially is one of continuous improvement.

The question of funding is interesting, is the program tax payer funded? If so then favoritism is totally unacceptable.

It seems that invested individuals are continuously defending the program without question. Motivations are interesting.

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HO  
Years ago

#530049

That is the second time in this thread someone has referred to a "senior" national championship.

What exactly is that? Is there a competition going on none of us know about?

As for people defending the system, I have done that, but i am defending it based on outcomes. The outcomes seem very good to date and as 0023 has pointed out, we continue to develop world class athletes.

I am sure the system has problems, just not sure they are as deep seated and prejudicial as people are suggesting here.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

If a kid is good enough and wants it bad enough, they'll make it, end of story, it might take them a little longer that's all.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

^ Yes, thanks for that fantastic insight.

The question isn't whether Bogut and Mills are going to get there if they're not identified early enough. The question is whether we could get more kids there if our identification mechanisms were better.

If you're an elite basketballer, there's a good chance you could also be an elite netballer or footy player. If you receive more support and encouragement in those sports than you do on the basketball court, isn't there a good chance that you focus on those instead? Would our senior teams be stronger if we didn't rely exclusively on kids being good enough and wanting it bad enough?

This isn't about individuals, or it shouldn't be. It should be about whether the resources we have are invested to provide the greatest increase in the chances of developing elite talent.

Carrying through kids that have been in the program since the age of 14 is often a mistake. A kid who is 6'5" at 14 and 6'7" at 17 might deserve to be there, because he may have transitioned from the post to the perimeter. But he may not have. He may be slower than perimeter guys, or lack shooting range or ball-handling skills. Should we continue to invest resources in kids who haven't grown and developed rather than providing opportunities to different kids whose physical and mental abilities at an older age are better suited to elite basketball?

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Bear  
Years ago

One problem with that idea anon^ and it lies with funding IMO. We can't identify more elite kids than there is funding to do it with.

Also, the purpose for elite identification has been clearly displayed, it is to play for your country, so the compounding fact in front of these kids is that there is only a few spots regardless.

More needs to be done to support grass roots and the mid range elite or those with a potentially elite future, but can't be funneled into a narrow and low funded program.

Developing coaches, supporting Associations and State programs while working out how to best provide for kids who are miles from anywhere, these are all problematic to your solution IMHO...

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Anonymous  
Years ago

#530075 you obviously didn't like my very simple response, because it didn't support your over analysis of the situation. You're making out as though there's a plethora of amazingly talented basketballers being lost to the sport because of the powers that be, my contention is that there isn't. There may be a bunch of talented kids that didn't have the heart or the intelligence or the resilience/perseverance to become elite. You can change the system as much as you like, that part won't change.

We are ranked 4th in the world in basketball, surely that indicates that our systems aren't too bad? Am not suggesting they're withou their flaws, but predicting which kids are going to kick on and which aren't is hardly an exact science.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

We are ranked 4th because of opals not because of the general ability of australian basketballers in junior ranks

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jontron  
Years ago

4th in the world in basketball i think that ranking is a bit tampered with

FIBA has Australia ranked 11th in mens and 2nd in women

meanwhile russia 6th (5 better) in mens 5th (3 worse) in women is ranked lower than Australia in combined

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Anonymous  
Years ago

#530092

What are you on man!

It seems the very coaches who run the programs are advising that deserving kids miss out due to preconceived ideas.

If that only happens to one kid, that's one kid to many. Making statements to the effect of

"You're making out as though there's a there's a plethora of amazingly talented basketballers being lost to the sport because of the powers that be" is ridiculous.

Everyone single kid at tryouts should be treated equally it's as simple as that.

If the current system cannot provide an environment where each and every kid is treated equally then it is dysfunctional.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Yea nah. Delly, Bogut, Baynes, Bairstow, Ingles, Exum, Mills, am I forgetting anyone? I don't think you guys understand how hard it is to get guys to the NBA, let alone all the guys playing D1 college ball especially with the unathletic, small population in this country.

If you're bagging your development have you actually travelled the world? Spoken to programs overseas? Maybe you should to get an idea how much this country's development is respected.

Will it continue? Probably not. Australia is a speck of dust in the world, producing diamonds at the moment. Get a clue!

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Big Macca  
Years ago

#530126

I don't know who you think needs a clue. However after reading your comment it’s clear that you live in a house of glass. Everything can be improved and should be. It’s in everybody’s best interest. Why are people defending a system that might miss out on a future star due to prejudices?

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Anonymous  
Years ago

#530131
Self-interest is surly the answer to that.

Reply #530132 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

World perspective.....

China population 1.3 Billion
Australia about 18 million

Do you genuinely think that this speck of dust with 7 players in the NBA and some 20-30 playing D1 College Hoops is genuinely letting talent sneak under the radar?

And that's just the men.

Where is this talent hiding because I'm sure those that run it in this country and overseas would love to know??




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Anonymous  
Years ago

#530120, where is it that you think the opals come from, if not from Australia's pool of junior talent?

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Anonymous  
Years ago

the grading is not a reflection of the current junior talent,

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Anonymous  
Years ago

At the risk of pointing out the obvious, the ranking is a reflection of Australia's development pathway. NITP has been around in various forms for the past 25 years. The current Opals and Boomers are products of it in one way or another.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Any Opals or Boomers that weren't in the program?

Self interest from parents whinging their child didn't make the program is what I see.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

We have the best system in the world. It can not get better! We are awesome! and surely are above any sort of prejudice. I love us!

If a couple of kids miss it's just collateral damage. Who cares because were awesome! Oh did I mention that we are awesomely awesome. No need to fix anything!

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HO  
Years ago

#530201

Facetiousness aside (and no one is saying the system cannot be improved and on one is saying there is no prejudice) - no one other than Bear or #529981, no one has yet named a major f*#k up. And respectfully to Bear, his example probably proves NITP/ITC got it right.

Again, someone needs to list the volumes of players who have made it that the system has missed. No on seems to be able to do that.

Our best kids, those most likely to make the grade, appear to be in the system, and given the chance to make that grade.

At the margins there will always be errors, because there are standouts, who self select, and then there are a bunch of others who it is harder to judge.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

HO, respectfully no one has determined what 'Making It' in basketball is, so to come up with names according to your request is always going to be subjected to prejudice views and bias opinions. Let's be more clear about what we are asking. If we are talking Football we can clearly state 'Making It' is AFL League Level and nothing below it like VFL or other State leagues, so are we just talking NBL here or playing for Australia or something more? It would help your arguement to have a clear agenda.

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HO  
Years ago

Actually I specified that above.

I asked about players who have made the NBL/WNBL with solid careers (suggested 3-4 years as starters) who were not part of the system. That is, who the system missed.

I am sure there will be some.

As someone said ITC/NITP has been around in some form for a couple of decades so you would expect we can judge all current Australian content in the leagues by this measure.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Prejudice its clear and it presents every year and in every trail. Some players are cut from the beginning because their parents are disliked.

Senior member of BV "I don't care how good their kid is, they’re not making it" that's a fact.

The “sooky” parent comment is ill-conceived and a cop out.

The system should be setup to eliminate prejudice full stop. It’s so easy to blame parents and children.

Do we really have to keep justifying the system at the expense of children who maybe fantastic future basketballs.

Within this forum we are discussing basketball but it happens in all sports and in fact in every aspect of society.

In the arts they even coined a term for it. Stage mum:

” A stage mom or stage dad is a parent or guardian of a child actor/performer who aggressively manages their career, often in what is considered a detrimental and over-bearing manner. The phrase has expanded to almost any performance related endeavor but is mostly linked to those doing traditional theater stage performances in front of an audience”

Whilst the simplistic will use the above to justify the (sooky) parents jibe. The more learned realise that the political conduct of some parents improves a child’s chances. Whilst for others it maybe sponsorship or other contribution’s that assist them.

The argument put forth regarding “how many have we missed” is exasperatingly ingenuous. A child who is never given a chance and deserved one may walk away feeling that they are not good enough! Never realising their potential, spare me the ridiculously inane comments about resilience and hard work.

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Bear  
Years ago

@HO, my understanding is that NITP/NPP is about Australian pathways into junior International teams and eventually the Boomers or Opals, not so much the NBL/WNBL, however I stand corrected if this is not the case...

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Anonymous  
Years ago

We have a better term for it.....ADHD (absolute dickhead dad)
Has been known to hurt kid's selection chances

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Actually Basketball is soft on who your families are etc, AFL selectors will try to interview in the home with the full family involved. They use the Term "Good Citizen" and all have a no dickhead policy, this includes Mum, Dad and Siblings.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

"no dickhead policy"

Should be applied to this forum.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Just read through this! Amused is all i can add.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Just as I thought - absolutely no one can name someone who the program missed.
The ADHD at work.

Reply #530424 | Report this post


HO  
Years ago

Bear, agree. NITP/NPP is about Australian athletes, but a reasonable by-product of all that training and development is that some of those kids forge a career in the professional game because their talent was identified and they received specialized tuition/training.

In AFL the Barlow experience, or even Blicavs, or Pyke, maybe the werribee kid is an indication that the you can make the grade without being "in the system".

Surely the same applies to basketball. If NITP etc is that bad, that prejudiced and selections consistently that poor there will be quite a few examples of players who have made the grade (NBL/WNBL) without the NITP background. Perhaps Bogut is one, while I realise he went to AIS, he was certainly not identified early and much of his personal development was done outside the system - private coach etc.

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Freddy  
Years ago

What about Tegan Cunningham and Gabe Richards? I heard they didn't do it either?

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Anonymous  
Years ago

HO I am not sure people as saying NITP/NPP is that bad what I read is people are asking where the system can be improved. Your question could be better served listing those who were identified but never made it. Could be an easier way to look at things.

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Anonymous  
Years ago

446#

Spot on! The constant defensive nature from some on this forum is odd. clearly their they feel the need to protect what they have. Remember the prejudice is fruitfull for someone.

Reply #530491 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Years ago

"Your question could be better served listing those who were identified but never made it."

That could be a lifetime study. Plenty of kids have made ITC-NITP over the years solely on the basis of their height. Didn't matter if they din't have the mental capability to breathe and run at the same time. "We can teach them that"
It's the nature of the beast unfortunately. Many couldn't be taught

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Anon#459 appears again, slapping everyone who is taller than him, hey imbicile go back to that small rock you call home and crawl under it, then stay there. No one cares that you are too short to play basketball!

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Anonymous  
Years ago

A comparison of the success rate of NITP/NPP players versus those who were never in the system (or identified extremely late) would probably be a better measure of how good the system is.

Also, NITP/NPP is an extremely broadly based program, and you would hope it could identify the overwhelming majority of kids who ultimately do make it to the NBL/WNBL level. But there are a good number of solid players at or above that level who were identified at the next level (junior camps, junior national teams etc.) embarrassingly late. Mills' AIS scholarship almost never happened, everyone knows the Bogut story, and there are enough examples on the women's side of players who've been identified at NITP level but produced careers that outshine players who received AIS scholarships or junior camp invites ahead of them.

The system is very good, but why you wouldn't look to improve it, I don't know.

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Bear  
Years ago

Anon^ I agree with you and having kids in the programs over a number of years there is also the issue of how the NITP/NPP programs end. The timing is such that kids may have been exposed to massive amounts of extra raining and sacrifice over a number of years.

Then they are asked to do even more at the expense of year 11-12 studies which is always the toughest years for our teenage kids heading into something like under 17 or under 19 worlds.

Sometimes a kid just needs a break to recover from years of additional elite training and be able to take a break to gather himself/herself before taking on the massive undertaking of VCE...

NITP/NPP is a selection process, it has to be, but I very much agree it should and probably is reviewed for improvement every year.

I would encourage those who direct and coordinate our elite programs to have open honest and positive consultation with parents and kids who have been there to explore how it actually affects families and in the end how things could be improved for the benefit of future elite athletes and those running the programs.

Just my opinion, not a criticism of the programs as my boys have certainly benefited from elite training for quite a while, but there have been ups and downs along the way...

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HO  
Years ago

#530551

Has anyone said it shouldn't be improved?

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Anonymous  
Years ago

Adelaide??

Reply #530918 | Report this post




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