Aussie Basketball Travellers Dunk Basketball Uniforms

Advertising spot currently available.
Minimum three month period (1.2+ million page views, 92% Australian).
Email [email protected] for rates and options.

AD: Office space available in Adelaide CBD @ 313 Halifax St;
Suit creatives; freelance desks or space for 2-4 person business. More info

Anonymous
Last year

#40384

Wildcats slump - what about coaching

I think the coaching staff needs to take some responsibility. Yes, a lot of players such as jj, Brandt, Kenny have been disappointing but they've also shown good play at times. The player development aspect of NBL coaching seems to be a lost art since we've been in this era of wholesale roster changes every year and short contracts. Player retention has improved in the last couple of years with league stability but the answer to everything shouldn't have to be to sack/replace players.

These players that are struggling are generally young and talented but lacking confidence, not ability. For me, good coaching helps in this regard.

I look at a team like Illawarra, who was playing poorly at the start with people calling for the likes of Clarke to be sacked (again, the "easy" answer). But bevo is a premier coach in this league and funnily enough coaches his team and players to improvement.

Gleeson looks like a "win now" only coach which is fine when your roster is absolutely stacked but his team development capability is in question for mine for now.

Report this topic


 

Anonymous
Last year
09:16 3 Dec 16

Reply #610980

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

When jj gets the ball, its nearly like he panics and thinks he needs to do something special. He traveled a few times last game and just needs to slow down a bit. Obviously being sacked the first time probably has him feeling under the hot seat again but the coach needs to settle him down and tell him to be aggressive but in control. I've no doubt this kid can play well in this league but he looks very unsure of himself right now.

McKay's activity on the offensive boards last week was fantastic but it didn't translate to points often. Part of it may be a struggle finishing through physicality but part of it also is bringing the ball down before going up instead of keeping it up high. He could also kick the ball outside for good looks when they collapse on him after the offensive board.

Some minor tweaks could yield big results


Report this post



lawsy
Last year
09:40 3 Dec 16

Reply #610981

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

The roster isn't good enough, simple. How many wildcats players, besides Prather would make the kings team? 00


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
09:41 3 Dec 16

Reply #610982

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

It was only a couple of weeks ago the Wildcats spanked the Kings.


Report this post



KET
Last year
09:43 3 Dec 16

Reply #610983

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

How many simultaneous "Perth are struggling" threads do we need?

Yesterday there was 'Perth will miss the playoffs' and 'Wildcats are in trouble', today there's this thread


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
09:51 3 Dec 16

Reply #610984

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

@KET - it's one of the bigger talking points of the league right now. This team hasn't missed the play-offs for thirty years.


Report this post



cats 4 life
Last year
10:01 3 Dec 16

Reply #610986

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

Get over it, if they won Thursday they would have been on top. My only problem is the way they are playing.

Player's get paid to shoot the ball, perth player's look like they don't even want to do that.

Streak has to end sometime, one year closer to that happening.


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
10:14 3 Dec 16

Reply #610988

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

So why wasn't the coaching an issue last season?


Report this post



KET
Last year
10:23 3 Dec 16

Reply #610989

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

I'm not saying Perth fans aren't allowed to over-react.

I'm just saying why can't it be done in the same relevant active thread? 3 active threads on the same topic is excessive.

Just a little bit of common sense should be exercised that's all.


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
10:23 3 Dec 16

Reply #610990

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

They had veterans in positions where they now have inexperienced NBL players.

Jawai/Jervis OUT - McKay, Brandt IN
Beal OUT - Johnson IN

Damian Martin is out as well which has exposed the likes of inexperienced players like Wroe and Bragg to more minutes too. Last year when Martin was out Kenny played his role but Beal was also able to step into the ballhandling breach.

There's definitely less experience in this squad. Less experienced players need more coaching, whereas veterans tend to know what to do.


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
10:25 3 Dec 16

Reply #610991

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

Dexter Kernich-Drew is another rotation player who is in his first year. To be honest, with so many new/inexperienced faces we shouldn't be that surprised that this team has been up and down this year.


Report this post



Luuuc
Last year
11:04 3 Dec 16

Reply #610992

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

"I'm just saying why can't it be done in the same relevant active thread?"

I agree. It's essentially the same discussion happening in multiple places. Which seems to be a regular thing for Wildcats threads lately. Not sure why people think every new thought needs its own thread.

And yes, it's pretty obvious that the coaches need to take some responsibility. And they clearly are. Gleeson is currently coaching like a guy desperately looking for answers.


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
11:07 3 Dec 16

Reply #610994

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

Not sure he's going about it the right way to be honest. Benching and dragging guys is the easy way out. He said in the post match press conference he'll go through the process of "weeding guys out" who aren't playing well.

A black and white approach of "he is no good or he is good" as opposed to "he is good, when" or "he could be good/better, if"


Report this post



Bol Bol
Last year
11:26 3 Dec 16

Reply #610996

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

Ive never been a fan of gleesons coaching. Their offense has always looked stagnant and rarely have good enough ball movement to create open looks.

Over the years its been their experienced on court leaders that has been the reason to their success. Usually big defensive plays by martin/knight/wagstaff and co.

This season having inexperienced imports is showing up gleesons poor ability to get the best out of the players. And not having a knock down three point threat is really affecting their scoring options in offense.

I am puzzled as to why they dont just make a change with the import situation now before its too late.


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
11:26 3 Dec 16

Reply #610997

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

I'm not sure if the excessive Cats threads are started by concerned fans, or tall poppied non-Cats fans.


Report this post



Luuuc
Last year
11:38 3 Dec 16

Reply #610998

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

"Ive never been a fan of gleesons coaching. Their offense has always looked stagnant and rarely have good enough ball movement to create open looks."


In defence of Gleeson (something that's rare for me, because I have never rated him either) this issue is not unique to him. It was really no different under Bevo. Redhage & Lisch did great work when we were able to keep the tempo high, but we rightfully copped plenty of flack for struggling in the half court and being painful to watch. Much like we were on Thursday night. For most of the Cats-Breakers dominance era, the Cats' success was built on defence. Without Damo we're starting to struggle in that area too. But it's been a looooong time since we had an above-average system in offence.


Report this post



Bol Bol
Last year
12:04 3 Dec 16

Reply #610999

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

I might be in the minority but i actually really liked bevos system. The ball movement was superior to glessons but the problem was bevo didn't have the cattle besides lisch to knock down the open shots. Bartletts 0-9 was the result of bevos unwavering confidence in his players to shoot the ball. If he had the ennis/beal teams (with more than one scorer) that gleeson had it would have been higher scoring and more attractive to watch than it was.

This season's hawks are a showcase of bevos system. Great ball movement finding the open man, multiple scoring threats and every player having the confidence to shoot the ball. The thing that sets them apart from last season is they have fixed up their rebounding creating extra shots.


Report this post



Luuuc
Last year
12:32 3 Dec 16

Reply #611001

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

I'm definitely not disagreeing with you about Bevo. Bottom line - it won games - and a title. As a fan who appreciates both ends of the floor I thought it was a beautiful thing, but a lot of people were critical of Wildcats basketball during that era. (Mostly people who think good basketball = dunking, I'm guessing)

But let's be fair here too. Any system is going to be tested once it starts to cop personnel issues as well.
I was optimistic before this season that the Cats could find their way into the playoffs yet again, but that was largely based on faith that our new imports would work out. McKay has pretty much been what I expected, but JJ certainly hasn't.
At prediction time here when a lot of people were talking up the Cats I recall having specific concerns about our reliance on Martin & Knight given their injury history.

When you consider how important Martin, Knight & Beal were for us last season, and then consider that two of them have dealt with significant injury setbacks and the other has been replaced by a dud, you have to factor that into the expectations.
Also last season I assume Prather was a bargain considering what he ended up delivering. This season he would be eating up a sizeable chunk of our budget, thus limiting what we can spend elsewhere.
(Having said all that, I'm pretty sure that our coach has significant input over our personnel transactions, so criticism is warranted when those decisions turn out to be poor)


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
12:57 3 Dec 16

Reply #611003

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

Confidence is a key piece on any team. How many good looks did the Cats turn down on Thursday? Shooting less than 40% and moving responsibility to the next guy is not great. Credit to Redhage, he will take a shot even though he must be aware he is not in great shooting form.


Report this post



Luuuc
Last year
13:25 3 Dec 16

Reply #611007

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

Did we turn down that many *good* looks though?
We've got some guys who can hit shots with their feet set (Wagstaff, Prather, JJ, Hire, Kenny, and Redhage in theory but no longer in practise) but Dexter is about the only one I want to see taking perimeter shots in any kind of motion. Maybe JJ in rhythm coming off a screen. But we're a pretty easy team to defend atm. I think there's a good reason we're turning down most of those looks.
JJ's head is all messed up atm. Trev rips him for not being aggressive enough, so next "chance" he gets, he forces up something he really shouldn't.

I agree that we're in a bad space mentally. It's almost palpable in the stadium.


Report this post



Bill on the ball
Last year
13:58 3 Dec 16

Reply #611013

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching


Defence has been poor. Poor screening.....how many times did I witness the opposition scoring back immediately after a Wildcats' score.

We need a Martin defence, can't deny that is what is required.


Report this post



Johnson
Last year
14:03 3 Dec 16

Reply #611015

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

Gleeson is a very average coach.i'l be given more game time to that young guy Bragg.Sure he mite make the odd mistake but he has a red hot go when he comes on.Bragg is much better than Wroe but then again Gleeson has no idea.Prather is the only guy having an impact every game as for the others like JJ,Brandt,Redhage there simply not up to the standard to play in the nbl.If i remember rightly last time Adelaide played Perth a couple of weeks ago Daniel Johnson was out injured and Adelaide only lost by about four points,so all teams have injuries but it's how you adjust and have players stepping up which i don't see Perth doing.At the moment there freefalling at high speed.How is faker Knight i expect him to jump of that stretcher and be right to play Adelaide.


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
14:30 3 Dec 16

Reply #611017

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

Now you've got it luuuc. This is what I'm getting at. Everyone suggests just deactivating/sacking players. But these are players with ability server seen it just not often enough. It is a coaching staffs job to teach and bring out the best in their players


Report this post



cats 4 life
Last year
15:05 3 Dec 16

Reply #611019

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

End of the day, it comes down to the player's to put there shit together. Every coach looks good when they win or team, Wagstaff was a key coming off the bench, this season hasn't done shit.

Get over Martin, he ain't there, what happens if he retires? we need a new generation, should've gone after Norton and a few player's from the crocs.

Marvin needs to do something or perth arena will have curtains on the upper level. Perth. members pay a lot of money, that's why expect them to do well. Don't charge a fortune and expect just to get by.

Player's player's half as good as they can them we surely can pay half to watch them player's.


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
16:27 3 Dec 16

Reply #611025

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

Please over react. It's fantastic.


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
16:44 3 Dec 16

Reply #611029

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

Luuuc you're kidding yourself if you think bevo isn't a good offensive coach. Have you watched any of Illawarra the past two years? Absolutely dynamite


Report this post



Luuuc
Last year
17:24 3 Dec 16

Reply #611039

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

^ That's not what I was trying to say at all though. I agree that he is, and the last couple of seasons have proven it.
My point was that in Perth he couldn't do the same thing (produce an efficient, attractive offence), due to the personnel at his disposal rather than due to any shortcomings of himself as a coach. He had to tailor a system to the players on his roster - and he did an effective job of that.

That's the challenge that Gleeson faces now. Trying to maximise the strengths of the players he has. He doesn't have a team that can get by purely on its own talent.
When you look at what Shawn Dennis did, for example, he pretty much was able to polish a turd. That's the challenge that Trev currently faces.


Report this post



Dazz
Last year
19:08 3 Dec 16

Reply #611078

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

Not sure we need another thread, as the others are sufficiently broad in scope.

But anyway, if you want to talk specifically about coaching, I mostly disagree.

Its difficult to judge how well NBL teams go about development, because mostly its not a development league, and what does go on (in their development and training programs) is largely not seen by the public. You would need to closely follow the progress of the young guys in those programs, to judge how effective they were.

The fault that lies with Wildcats Coaching & Management, is that for whatever reason, they have recruited poorly for this season.
Sacking Beal for JJ now looks gobsmackingly stupid, and replacing Jawai with McKay looks questionable.
In Hindsight, given the ageing roster and propensity for injury, they probably should have aimed to sign a Marquee Aussie starter, and kept an import slot up their sleeves.

Even as it stands, get Damo back into the rotation and we will be competitive again. Replace JJ with a combo guard who can score, and we could be back on top. Problem is the league is very competitive, and we only need to be a bit off the pace to keep losing.


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
19:10 3 Dec 16

Reply #611079

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

back on top LOL!


Report this post



Dazz
Last year
19:17 3 Dec 16

Reply #611085

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

I said could. I'm not boasting, just making the point that the league is very competitive. One really good player could make the difference between finishing 1st or 6th.


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
19:55 3 Dec 16

Reply #611100

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

LOL dream on buddy. One change isn't going to take that dumpster fire of a roster to the top of anything!


Report this post



Very Old
Last year
22:34 3 Dec 16

Reply #611236

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

"That's the challenge that Gleeson faces now. Trying to maximise the strengths of the players he has. He doesn't have a team that can get by purely on its own talent.
When you look at what Shawn Dennis did, for example, he pretty much was able to polish a turd. That's the challenge that Trev currently faces."


totally agree, although many parts of this particular turd has sparkled in the past.


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
22:35 3 Dec 16

Reply #611238

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

I thought Gleeson did well tonight. Gave Johnson a lot of confidence and stayed calm even when down double digits in the first half. We're back on track, I think.


Report this post



Moose
Last year
08:11 4 Dec 16

Reply #611281

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

Seven out of their next ten games on the road - current form suggests they win three of those if they are lucky, putting them at 9-14 heading into February. Gleeson will be unemployable if the streak is broken under his watch, not to mention probably banished from Perth for life


Report this post



ChairmanOfTheBored
Last year
12:19 4 Dec 16

Reply #611296

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

I don't know about Gleeson as a coach, but my goodness does he like a whinge. I swear last night I saw him begging in front of a Referee. Either that or he'd expelled so much air from whining about the last call that he'd actually started deflating.
Every coach will take issue with the Referees, but most will just aggressively argue the point. What really gets me is Gleeson whiiiiines about it instead, like he's got the tears in his eyes and the bottom lip starts going. It's really annoying and embarrassing to watch.


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
15:27 4 Dec 16

Reply #611309

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

Gleeson called out his players citing Bragg as an example of someone who deserves minutes. Then played him 39 seconds. Hmmmmmmm


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
19:25 4 Dec 16

Reply #611355

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

Gleeson is a whinging, whining flog who would instill confidence in nobody.


Report this post



Dazz
Last year
19:34 4 Dec 16

Reply #611357

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

I don't know about Gleeson as a coach, but my goodness does he like a whinge.
Wow. So in other words, you're feeling lonely, you want to jump on the Perth-bashing bandwagon, and figure this is safe bet? Just go along with the "Gleeson is a whinger" line. Problem when you don't think for yourself, is that you get caught out, because some of us actually watch NBL.
The great irony is that you tried this approach immediately after we just played Adelaide. ROFL.
Tell ya what, when Gleeson even starts to approach the level of whinging and theatrics shown by Joey Wright, I'll let you know.


Report this post



Dazz
Last year
00:02 6 Dec 16

Reply #611591

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

Anyone heard any rumours from the Cats???
(Got a mate who reckons someone told him a "big announcement" is coming. And as they say, even a broken clock is correct twice a day.)


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
01:41 6 Dec 16

Reply #611595

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

Season ending injury to Brandt?
Season ending injury to Hire?
Season ending injury to Wagstaff?
Knight announces his immediate retirement?
I can't decide which one I think your hoping for the most.


Report this post



Dazz
Last year
01:48 6 Dec 16

Reply #611597

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

I'm just literally wondering if anyone has heard anything?
Even if correct, "big announcement" could mean anything from a half-price sale on Championship Memorabilia, A new sponsorship deal with Donut-King, or they have signed Joe Puddly from Rockingham as an injury replacement.

As for what I might hope? Hmm...
I guess a surprising injury replacement would be nice.
What do ya reckon my chances are? :-(


Report this post



Anonymous
Last year
07:05 6 Dec 16

Reply #611603

re: Wildcats slump - what about coaching

Every chance you will be wrong again.


Report this post





 

Reply to this topic

Name Email

Random name suggestion for anonymous posters: Callisto 53

Title
Rules: You must read the Terms of Use. No spam, no offensive material, no sniping at other clubs, no 'who cares?'-type comments, no naming or bashing under 18 players. Learn how to embed YouTube videos or tweets
Message

Please proof-read your post before submitting as you will not be able to edit it afterwards.
 


Liam Flynn - basketball coaching and consulting

Recent Posts

.

.


An Australian basketball forum covering NBL, WNBL, ABL, Juniors plus NBA, WNBA, NZ, Europe, etc | Forum time is: 5:19 am, Mon 24 Apr 2017 | Posts: 655,271 | Last 7 days: 693