Didn't someone say Hodges quit basketball?

Never believed that rumour regarding Hodges.

Another rumour circulating though is Somfai is heading to U.S high school next year even though she took up a COE spot?

On another note, intersting to see qld now has scc squads.

Not a rumour leaving the COE. Obviously worked out the COE is going to do nothing for her game.

Better if she does leave.
Like everyone is figuring out...

Not a fan of the Coe Weedy ?

Not the women's program, no. Not comparable with the combined men’s Coe and GA program. Girls better off going elsewhere.

NSW & ViC announce end of November

Blues67 - how do you find out if a player is an NPP/SPPX player? Is there a list?

No official list on the web to my knowledge. I was just provided a list by a connection within the Country set up.
Had about 40 kids on list, boys and girls from Metro and Country. Looked like a few on the list were now U20 / NBL1 and no longer playing juniors. Youngest would be bottom age U16.
It was explained to me that now SA have the new state centre they have more ability to increase training their high end talent. All small group training, 3-4 athletes per time slot with similar skill set.
Athletes in the program had performed at a high level at either AJC or NJC in past 12 months. They need to keep performing as the group is reviewed after each term.

Thanks Blues67.

Good to know. Very interesting to see who is and is not in that group.

From what I've watched at these 2 major tournaments, the only surprise on the girls side is the undersized centre from Forestville. Hasn’t performed at Classic 2023 and wasn’t in the main rotation at AJC. Only 5’10 / 5’11 with the skill set of a traditional big so honestly don’t see the long term upside.
The other SA bigs have gone past her and not athletic enough or perimeter shooting to be developed into a wing.
The other surprise on the boys side is another Forestville big but at least he’s tall and athletic.

@Bballfan.. The list ive seen for the girls SPPX/NPP

Off the top of my head so i may have missed one or two!
Aspen Crase
Keira Gardiner
Coco Hodges
Abbey Jones
Zahlia Niemann
Emma Scott
Olivia Tredrea
Polly Turner
Lucy Wootton
Krystal Thompson
Penzy Hocking
Daisy Hocking
Ruby Stockley
Caitlin Hardin
Annie Elliott

Blues67 are you talking about Scott? Didn't she splash 3 3s in the 4th quarter of state championships?

SixersFan, yes but that would have been an anomaly. Blues take on her is correct

Thanks Frogface19. Some very good players on that list. From the top of my head I can't think of too many who might have missed out. Big tick for BSAHP!

I agree somewhat with the assessments above, but she is/was nonetheless on a National depth chart which explains her inclusion.

Selecting the best players isn't that difficult. Identifying early and developing is the challenge.

Isabelle Daly is another in SPPX, and I have a feeling there's one more that I can't place right now.

No big surprises on the boys side for SA's ECC selections that I can spot.

Alek Deng?

I think Deng and Adams are in SPPX, but not certain now that you mention it.

Apologies Isobelle Daly is certainly on the list, thank you @PlaymakerMo

Chelsea Portus, Alex Deng, Georgie Salandra are also included

Is it confirmed Somfai is leaving the CoE? If yes, any ideas on where is she heading? It's a brave decision. Will this affect her NT chances in the next few years?

@BballFan... well it's all over Facebook via transition sports ! And a she’s leaving the COE in the next week or so!

That's big time.

Wouldn't she be a college start in 2026? Is she heading to High School in the USA or just leaving the CoE before heading to college?

Victoria ECC

https://www.basketballvictoria.com.au/news/2024-u18u16-east-coast-challenge-squads-announced

Lots of good talent in both age groups in vic.

Agreed very strong. Might have pulled one or two based on performances at u16 nationals, but seems they are giving some a second chance which is fair enough.

Footy might deplete vic girls though, especially u16s.

NSW Metro ECC

https://www.bnsw.com.au/players/development-tours/east-coast-challenge/

Looks like no Hall playing in 18 girls, injured?

Talking about footy depleting stocks, was taken aback by the number of super athletic 200+cm kids taken in the afl draft this week.

Somfai To IMG academy

WA

https://basketballwa.asn.au/wp-content/uploads/2023/12/SPP-U18-ANNOUCEMENT.pdf

Watched various teams over ECC, from the teams that competed, NSW Metro will be the team to beat and are a clear favourite.

NSW M
* Hall is back from injury, not her usual self from the small sample size I witnessed but plenty of time before it all kicks off.
* Perkins as always, consistently good and still one of the best guards in the country
* NSW look to have the most size of anyone, Jackson in particular.
* Along with VIC M they seem to have good depth at each position.

VIC M
* Nice and even across the board without an out and out star
* They had a squad of 24 across two teams and were swapping teams around so hard to get a handle on how they will perform as a team of 10
* Nousis and Mcmechan showed enough as bottom agers
* Cooper was impressive at PG
* Fagan promises a lot but I always leave wanting more. A real talent with crazy athleticism but fades in and out of games.

SA M
* The least depth of the teams at ECC but their top end looks to be great still.
* Hodges, Gardiner and Wooton were clear stand outs in one of their teams while Jones and Tredrea were carrying the other team. Couple of decent role players but they look thin for a week long tournament.
* Crase was on crutches with what looked like an ankle injury.
* They have a very good coach in McPhail and do usually prepare well so that should count for something.

NSW M, VIC M, SA M and QLD sth will be the top 4, hard to see anyone else to break in.

Appreciate your recap of ECC Blues67

SA M missing its biggest gun at u18G who won't play again for state or country IMO. SA M never really has significant depth but just enough talent to compete with the big states in the girls and occasionally a standout makes the difference. It might be a lean year for SA M across all the 16-20 comps compared to recent times.

I don't think results will stray too far from U16’s, 2 years ago.

2022 - U16

Gold - NSW Metro (head and shoulders above the rest)
Silver - SA Metro (No Somfai as well)
Bronze - VIC Metro (Very disappointing tournament, scraped in over VIC Country in the play off)

Queensland Sth finished 5th

I hope you're right Blues67. SA might not have Turner either, so I don't share your confidence.

From memory, Turner didn't play a huge role as a bottom ager in '22, they leant heavily on Hodges all tournament handling the ball and when she went down in the final with injury, the gold medal game ended up a blowout.
From that team, Jones will come in and she was just selected in the latest Aus Camp. She is very impressive at 6’3-6’4.
Tredrea will come in as well and take some heat off Hodges handling the ball. I like this combo, both long at the guard positions and provide 3 point shooting.
Gardiner didn’t play huge minutes in that 2022 team and she has come on leaps and bounds and another headed for Aus Camp.
I would think Coach McPhail would feel quietly confident in getting something out of the tournament.
I think they’re in the mix but like I said they are light on depth but they are most years and are always there abouts. I didn’t see a lot of players knocking the door down to be selected at ECC.
Looking for someone to at least challenge NSW, don’t think VIc Metro can be that team unfortunately.

It doesn't really matter now with Turner focusing mainly on AFL but I always thought she would have been much more effective as a 3 & D. She would have been a real weapon at both ends of the floor.
He tendency to foul and turn the ball over never really sat well with me playing her as a combo guard.

Why would Somfai not play at the WC?

That 2022 SA Metro team had impressive chemistry and winning silver was realistically the best possible result. In saying that, kids like Jones, Crase and Gardiner have improved tremendously from their time under Hilbig. Tredrea is the X-factor with their depth challenged. Without a outright superstar like Somfai or Borlase this will be the real test for McPhail. I'm predicting:

1 NSW Metro, easily the most talented side with height, shooting and elite guards
2 Vic Metro, super disappointing in 2022
3 Qld South, injury to Notoa in 2022 hurt them
4 SA Metro, now missing Turner but gained Jones
5 SA Country, might improve with Petty long gone
6 Vic Country, I don't rate them so they might finish lower
7 NSW Country, also underperformed in 2022
8 Tas, their great program will carry to the top 8

The boys could be interesting. I thought SA Metro would fall way off, but they held their own at ECC. If anything, their lack of size might be their undoing. Realistically, it shouldn't deviate from a Vic Metro-Qld South grand final. I haven't heard enough about kids from NSW and WA to know how they might be tracking though.

Weedy - I don't think she’ll be selected for the WC. Rightly or wrongly, the disdain shown will have put some noses out of joint in a big way. Big personalities in Aus teams cause a stir if their commitment to the program waivers (Simmons, Cambage) so I can’t see the selectors entertaining it TBH.

I'm pretty sure she’ll be there.
What team would u pick for the WC?

Bballfan she went to COE and left for a better opportunity. I don't think they will be hold that against her. Going with your theory would mean they won't select Hall since she didn't go to COE

Agree with Weedy, they'll still pick her and so they should.
This is where BA need to be the mature adults, put their egos aside and continue to develop her.
She has options internationally as she owns a joint Aussie / Hungarian passport so I’m sure Hungary will gladly take her if we drop the ball.
Somfai and Hall are 100% locks for WC

At this early stage, I'm assuming this would be the team

Perkins
Hall
Lehmann - Coe
Seumanutafa
Hodges
Dakic
Taylor - Coe
Russell - Coe
Somfai
Fagan
Crook - Coe
Jackson

A couple of other players may get a look in.

Only change Weedy would be Gardiner for Fagan.
Fagan needs to show more consistency and flashes of brilliance in order to be selected for a WC.
Will know more in 3 months time, post Nationals.
I'm sure there will be a bolter or two.

Fagan is going to the COE apparently, so she's a lock. From Vic, if Whiteman and Agnew play to their ability at AJC's they will both be in the picture, both are very talented.

Queensland South and Queensland North have dropped their team lists on socials, expect other states to follow suit in the next 1-2 weeks.

Was anyone else at the country cup in Albury for u18 girls? Some promising talent coming out of Tasmania. I would expect them to be quiet competitive.
NSW country girls also showed some depth. SA didn't have Sienna Lehmann who I believe may have been rested, nor did Victoria have Sophie Taylor through Injury.

VIC TEAMS

https://www.basketballvictoria.com.au/news/2024-victorian-under-18-state-teams-announcement

NSW TEAMS

https://www.bnsw.com.au/news/2024-u18-state-team-announcement/

Vic teams of 12. isn't it max 10 players?

Used to be 10. It's 12 from this year onwards to match FIBA

Aha! kudos to Vic for taking advantage of that change and keeping 1 step ahead in terms of developing for the future and exposing more kids to high level competition.

Good choices by both states, don't often say the best has been chosen.

TAS

G
https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=916010083857838&set=a.651928040266045

B
https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=916700540455459&set=a.651928040266045

So that leaves both SA, WA teams and NT still to be announced?

Yep, lots of strong teams this year.

Vic M men and NSW M women look strong favourites. On paper at least.

Not sure why all states don't take advantage of having 12.. Depth at a tournament like that would be an advantage.

You do wonder why Juice, especially as the players pay their way anyway!

Well done to the Vics for doing it though. As we have seen in the U20's when a injury happens, be nice to have those 2 extra players!

@Blues76 I know SAM and SAC players were told over 2 weeks ago and why it hasn't been announced through its social media outlets is beyond everyone

Taking 12 is hard when three of those kids might barely play. One thing if you're a dominant Vic Metro side with plenty of blowouts to give the end of the bench a run. What if you're a mid-tier team scrapping for almost every win, or a lower-tier side that can barely field five kids who are competitive at Nationals level? For those teams, you then have to split the limited minutes you could afford your 9th and 10th players across twice as many kids, or you have two kids who never play. What do you think parents will say when they've spent thousands of dollars for their kids to travel to an event like that and average <5 minutes/game?

Cake, every HP athlete and parent should be smart enough to realise AJCs are a win first priority and an athlete is not guaranteed minutes. I am sure coaches / HP Manager would pass on this information prior to the tournament as well.
It's simple, don’t take up your spot if you’re unwilling to sit at the end of the bench and pay the $$$.

The issue of player court time exists whether it's 10 or 12 players. In crunch games, player rotations usually limited to top 7 or 8 players, with the rest getting little or no game time.
Injury cover and squad depth aside, for some states it will be about experience and building for the future - taking bottom agers and players with high potential. And coaches get experience managing larger teams, which isn't easy, but will become an important skill.
Getting the win at this level is important, and doing it with development in mind sets them up for future success.
I guess the reason some states haven't done it is more to do with how quickly they adapt to change, and maybe worried they might break their 20 year old spreadsheet templates by adding a couple of rows.

Clear communication regarding team role and court time expectations is essential for a player and family to make informed decision on whether cost - dollars, time and player psychology is worth it.
I think confidence of coaches in programs are a long way from that where clear communication is provided in this context.
Also the best coaches IMO are the ones whose role players are clear on what their role is and KNOW they are appreciated in fulfilling that role buy the coach and rest of the team.

@Steed

"I guess the reason some states haven't done it is more to do with how quickly they adapt to change, and maybe worried they might break their 20 year old spreadsheet templates by adding a couple of rows."

Whilst this is the one of the funniest things I've seen today, it is scary how close to the truth it may be!

@benchballer and @steed , I agree this is likely scarily true.
As someone who has been involved with HP programs in the recent past, I can tell you that costs expand exponentially when you take 12 athletes compared to 10.
3 athlete rooms instead of 2, heightened level of physio/medical connection, increased food & recovery costs, transportation....all becomes different (more problematic??). This is not to say it shouldn't be introduced, but unfortunately, some families will need to understand (or their athletes will....) that cost increases will be inevitable for someone who might warm the bench for 5 games out of 7.

@BigJ Aren't the costs spread evenly across all players nationally, so no matter which state they all pay the same amount? Might be wrong but have heard that is how they are paid for?

100% Correct benchballer

So other states for whatever reason they choose are helping the VIC teams fund the extra players! Change is hard for some

*Airfares* are equalised, and they would be equalised on a per person basis. Players across different states can pay vastly different costs depending on food, accommodation, ground transport arrangements, and staffing.

Steed, the issue of court time exists whether you take 10 or 12, but that's not the point. It typically affects 2 players if you take 10, and 4 players if you take 12. In addition, the impact on affected players is greater, because the minutes are split across more of them. There is a fair argument to be made that the development of the 9th and 10th athletes will be impeded by the presence of the 11th and 12th, as 9/10 end up with fewer playing opportunities. Whether that is a worthwhile trade-off will be a case-by-case decision based on the ability and potential gap between the players competing for those 9/10/11/12 spots.

Yes, this should all be communicated. Yes, parents and athletes should make an informed decision about cost, psychological impact, etc. But all of that supports the idea that taking 12 is not inherently the right thing to do. If your 11th says "no thanks, this isn't the right option for me," how far down the list of emergencies do you go before there is no real benefit to the player and team in having them there? *If* the depth exists, by all means keep going until you have 12 who want to attend. But that won't be the case for every team, every year. Acting like any program that rocks up with 10 athletes has an inferior approach just shows a lack of understanding.

All that said, yeah, I do believe that a lot of the decision-making won't be informed by what's best for the team or athletes, but as Steed says, by what's been done in the past or is easiest for the administrators to get their heads around.

There was some controversial non inclusions in the Qld South Boys team.

@cake pretty sure it is the whole package that is equalised, or someone the teams are flying first class!! Maybe states, can if they choose, to provide different accommodation or food etc

I think Cake is right, it's just the airfares that are equalised (or as they call it harmonised).

Costs for accommodation, food, physios, treatments, entertainment, etc. is up to each state.

SA have gone with 11 and 10.

G
https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=754403140120893&set=pcb.754403190120888

B
https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=754395920121615&set=pcb.754395963454944

SA Country, 10 n 10.

G
https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=852229973483214&set=pcb.852230003483211

B
https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=852229970149881&set=pcb.852230003483211

ACT 12 each

https://www.basketballact.com.au/u18-territory-teams-announced/?fbclid=IwAR0l4ADzIVLEkkro5eUmF9Re1imcbJDGnRyiRT_bXFYOd-zCPdlDq0We_F8

QLD list from a a couple of weeks ago.

https://www.queensland.basketball/high-performance/state-teams#U18


They are taking 11 in each team which is probably the sweet spot.




Going to be a ripper tournament...

anyone know the big secret of where the 2024 u16 AJC will be?

NSW or NT

Bendigo

@Hopping... start booking at Bendigo !

Sorry Hooping!

After looking over the girls teams, pretty clear their are tiers

Gold
NSW Metro - clear favourite. All top age I think?

Silver / Bronze
VIC Metro - squad looks strong, will they under perform again?
Queensland Sth - full strength this year
SA Metro - young. Nothing would surprise me. 2 remain from gold medal 2023 team.

The Rest
VIC Country - not enough talent to break into top 4
SA Country - too small
Queensland Nth - lack of depth

Even some of the bottom teams have improved depth but you are right, those above are the favourites.
Just waiting on WA.

Unlikely to contend for a medal, but ACT women will be more competitive than they have been for a while. Should give some teams a good test in the group stage.
Interesting they are taking 12 players - I like that focus on development for them.

Blues67.. fair assessment IMO.

WA = Wait Awhile

Vic metro actually had a strong team in 2022 and could of easily got the gold , the coaching was definitely the problem

No doubt WA basketball looked at this thread...
Teams in, taking 12 each

https://basketballwa.asn.au/2024-u18-state-teams-announcement/

Wow SA women is almost entirely one district team - fully stacked - 7 out 11 from one club. Speaks volumes about copy and paste mentality when there's a few questionable appointments in there....

Interestingly, the development list is quite short and clearly favouring a particular district club. Maybe some clubs not happy with associating directly with a highly biased and influenced selection process. A great achievement nonetheless for the girls. Another questionable decision by BSA and high performance team, highlighting again the stifled and small pool of overrepresented coaches available in SA.

That makes way more sense than your kid not being good enough.

Imo, SA Metro got their selections right, just look at the DP list.
McPhail is a national level coach and is associated with Sturt, from my knowledge a sworn enemy of Forestville.
She wants to win and good to see club colours don't factor into her decision making.

Wa metro women looks a bit off.
Lots of improvement with nsw c, act, qld n, wa c.
Nsw m, vic m, qld s, sa m(even without somfai) all very strong.

I'm pretty disappointed in the Vic Country girls squad. They can't really afford to not have their best players in the team. It may well be that players like DeDios and Jessic Smith from Bendigo have chosen not to participate, but I would have both as starters based on past performances. On the positive side Anarson has improved a lot and will provide a good defensive anchor and Dimarco is at the top end of on ball defenders. Offensively they will rely a lot on Taylor so her fitness and form will be a big factor, as will improvements in Schwarz's movement post ACL surgery, at the very least she will provide them a big body who can shoot, something they didn't have last time around.

The top 6 in the Vic Metro squad is very talented, but they lack shooting. Agnew is a very good 3 level scorer, something they didn't have in 2022. Whiteman was coming off an injury in 2022 and I expect she will have a much greater impact this time around. They fall away pretty quickly at the back end of the roster. This squad could have been a lot better. The real x factor will be Kennedy, who has been injured since bottom age u14's but has always shown a lot of ability and is really tall. it will be interesting to see if she has kept her skills up and whether her body holds up in a tournament setting

SAM definitely stacked with Forestville girls but you'd be hard pressed to say it's not the best team picked, especially with some girls not trialing or withdrawing eg Turner. Also at least 4 of those Forestville girls started at other clubs, Forestville just very good at "recruiting"

What is a little concerning is the reserves or development players or whatever the hell BSAHP call them now. They'll be keeping their fingers and toes crossed for a healthy squad but given Gardiner hasn't played a district game yet, Crase has a long term injury and Taylor is often injured it would be of some concern. Wootton, Hodges, Crase and Gardiner all standouts and will all need to be fit and in form for SA to medal

With u17 WC spots up for grabs, you would think players will be up for it.
One of the deepest age groups in sometime.

True. I don't think the in-form part will be a problem just the injury concerns.

Agree Weedy, very deep talent pool.
Turner would have been the only change in place of one of the bigs if she decided to take part, but she didn't and is focusing on AFLW.
One of either Evans or Scott (or both) look to be heading over as injury insurance but SA HP seem confident their team will be 100% considering still 7-8 weeks out from AJC.
Should be a very competitive tournament on the girls side, looking forward to it.

@XXXX, Whats your take on Poppy Myers? Bottom age with a huge upside im hearing?

@Weedy I'm hearing invitations for U17 Crocs and Sapphires Camp next month (March) have already gone out with most players selected from last year's U16 Asia Cup teams + standouts from NPC, ECC etc who do you think will be on the list of players in those camps?

Under 17 Boys World Cup is June 29-July 7 (Turkey)
Under 17 Girls World Cup is July 13-July 21 (Mexico)

Normally they wait until after AJC U18 in April before selection, an earlier first rd selection camp is possible though.

Aus camps aren't very big compared to other nations, 24 per group would be at the high end.


Team from last year...
Perkins
Lehmann - Coe
Hall
Hodges
Aherne
Notoa
Taylor - Coe
Russell - Coe
Somfai - overseas
Fagan - Coe
Crook - Coe
Jackson

I don’t think they drop anyone from Coe
The only 2 changes I can see would be Aherne/Notoa to Seumanutafa and new Coe holder Dakic. Would be very difficult to overtake anyone at the Coe based on history.

Other names potentially might get a look…

PG
Dimarco
Agnew
Thompson
Fotu
SG
Corasaniti
Bond
Bobongie
Nousis
SF
Bijkerk
Finney
Petrie
Reisinger
Mead
PF
Francis
Wightman
Hanson
Juffermans
C
Buttsworth
Mcrea

I know you're taking an educated guess, but that list is pretty far off. Several kids who were invited to the NPC aren't listed and will take spots at the camp.

I haven't seen much of Poppy Myers as she doesn't play VJBL. From AJC's and Country Cups, she looks ok but hasn't really stood out. It's pretty difficult to assess kids who come from isolated areas though, she would have nowhere near the experience of most of her peers.

I hope they don't select the team for the u17 WC till after the u18 AJC's. Agnew and Whiteman are both considerably better than some of the girls that would be front runners, but they both need that tournament to show it.

@weedy any idea where the U15 Oceania with be hosted ? When do you think they will name that extended squad ?

Thank you @XXXX

Again it will be interesting to see how the Qld South Boys go. They only have two players from the state championship winning team and left of the highest scorer in the tournament (yes I know scoring isn't everything) and what most people considered the best PG in the state (he made All Australian at schoolboys last year.......and yes I know that not all the good kids play in that tournament.

I've also heard on the grapevine that one of their bigs has done his ankle really badly and is a huge chance of not getting back in time for the tournament. They have good 2/3 spots but lack overall size.

Lets be honest - the team from last year with Rocco and Roman underachieved. They had two generational talents on one team and couldn't get it done. The pressure is on these boys since it is in Qld South again and it will be interesting to see how they go.

Jayhoops, I'm just listing all the regular names that have popped up over the last couple of years. The National performance camp did not guarantee any of those players WC selection, u17 or future U19, Not even U15s with 09 in attendance.

U15 Oceania selection happens after AJC U16, later on in the year.

Yeah I just thought a person of your intel would know who's hosting it

That's fair enough Weedy, and you're definitely correct that the NPC invite didn't guarantee anything for this. I just know that several NPC athletes have been invited to the U17 camp that aren't on your list.

I hope it didn't come across as having a crack at you. It was a bit blunt of me reading back.

The location I believe was decided in December 2023, read somewhere it was Fiji but I doubt it.

Cheers Weedy!

On Facebook - SA members in the AUS camp for WC... clearly Ruby Perkins is NSW !

We are very excited to announce the nine South Australian athletes that have been selected as a part of the Under 17 Australian Junior Squad to attend the Emus and Sapphires Camps in preparation for the 2024 World Cup.

SA Men attending the Emus Camp:
Alex Dickeson
James MacKenzie
Isaac Riddle

SA Women attending the Sapphires Camp:
Abbey Jones
Aspen Crase
Coco Hodges
Keira Gardiner
Ruby Perkins
Sienna Lehmann

Please join us in congratulating our incredible South Australian Representatives!

https://www.bnsw.com.au/news/u17-australian-crocs-sapphire-squads-announced/

@frogface wasn't someone talking about SA Basketball copying and pasting the selected teams from previous selections? Whoops accidents happen!

Madison Ryan as a double bottom ager making the squad! Good for her!

Aherne + Smith from Tassie.

VIC u17 camp

B
Akhuar
Beauchamp
Brammall
Cheeseman
Daniels
Duff-Tytler
Krasnadamskis
Kuany
Pilimai
Robinson
Sewell
Vaughns

G
Dakic
Fagan
Ryan
Wightman

The mens u17 camp is complete and the womens is up to the 3 day, is there any news? who did well, the mens have a lot of new faces and a number of them should make the team.

Just the first camp, another next month after ajcs I believe.

Yes, there is the u18 championships and another camp which should have only 16 players. but was there any news on who did well, etc?

I don't think this camp meant a whole lot. What they do at the upcoming ajcs will be the reference to keep or cut.

More importantly, why have a camp 2 weeks before the AJC? Not sure the reward outweighs the risk.

Hopefully they all get through unscathed. The 07/08 age group is a very deep talent pool and should be one of the better AJCs in recent history.

Yeah bit stupid. Have the ajcs and 3 camps after.
24 > 18 > 12

Agree blue, should be a great tournament in both boys and girls.
Much closer than the last few years.

Strong word is Sienna Lehmann is out with a stress fracture in the hip. Wishing a speedy recovery but a huge hit for SAC.
Should be fit if the 17WC.

One of several CoE athletes dealing with or having dealt with with stress fractures

Oh is that right @sabreTooth? Thats disappointing if true.

The draw for the mens U17 world cup has been drawn and its a great one for the Crocs

fiba.basketball/world/u17/2024/news/lineup-confirmed-for-fiba-u17-basketball-world-cup-2024-in-t%C3%BCrkiye

drawing these teams in group D

Egypt
Germany (5th in europe U16)
Canada (2nd in americas U16 - not a strong team, scraped into the final and lost to USA 118-36)

Even better the USA are in Group B so we shouldn't meet them (all going well) until the final games,

"All 16 teams participating in the event will advance to the competition's Final Phase with a single-elimination format in place from the Round of 16 onwards.

The teams from Group A will face teams from Group B, based on standings within these groups (1st vs 4th - 2nd vs 3rd) and teams from Group C will face teams from Group D."

Egypt we win I reckon.
Canada we lose, Germany probably still favoured to beat us.

Heard Ryan from VIC was one of the best kids at the camp. Jessie limited due to back.

I think this is the 23 at camp but I could be wrong.
Might be off by 1 or 2.

Rough Height / Surname / State team / Y.O.B
5'7 Perkins NSW M 07
5’8 Lehmann SA C 07
5’8 Hall NSW M 07
5’9 Thompson SA C 07
5’9 Seumanutafa QLD S 07
5’9 Dakic VIC M 07
5’10 Hodges SA M 07
6’0 Notoa QLD S 07
6’0 Aherne TAS 07
6’0 Reisinger QLD S 07
6’1 Russell ACT 07
6’1 Taylor VIC C 07
6’1 Mead NSW M 07
6’1 Wightman VIC M 07
6’1 Crase SA M 07
6’2 Ryan VIC M 09
6’2 Gardiner SA M 08
6’2 Hanson QLD S 07
6’3 Fagan VIC M 08
6’3 Smith TAS 08
6’3 Jones SA M 08
6’3 Crook NSW C 07
6’4 Jackson NSM M 07

Lots of other good players did not make it.

Thompson from SA Country didn't go to my knowledge unless she was a last minute inclusion.
Petrie from Queensland South was there
List pretty much spot on as usual Weedy.

Expecting Agnew, Thompson and possibly others to get an invite to the next camp if they show out at AJC. Some of the guards have been battling injury of late, so that’s where the movement will be, if any.

Not expecting much movement from the Asian Cup team. Fagan / Gardiner a coin flip on talent but Fagan likely to get a spot due to CoE scholarship.

Petrie, that's the one. Cheers.
A few lucky to make camp, a few unlucky to miss out.

Thompson = No

Might almost be time for a Men U18 thread and Women U18 thread now the games are truly about to begin.

Good luck to all who were selected, some strange selections have been observed by many already, and the opportunity for those that were selected above others to stand up and see if they really were worth the selection, best place to show is on court!

Prediction

Women: NSW Metro for Gold
Men: VIC Country for the Gold

Let the games begin

No real surprises first day.

Maybe qld n men just over wa m.
Vic m women did not look good first game.

Is there sickness at the tournament? Lots only playing 6-7? And only listing that many??

Nah, just not shown in the stats.
A few players in sa c mennand others dont show up.

NSW Country upset Vic Metro in the girls!
Vic Metro played even court time for their squad and it backfired. Crook dominated with 26 & 8 at 80% from the field.
NSW Country play the other undefeated team from pool A tomorrow, SA Metro. SA have looked a bit inconsistent from their first 2 outings and have already shortened their rotation to 7-8 players. They are heavily relying on star, Hodges, but getting some decent contributions from Niemann and bottom agers, Gardiner, Tredrea and Crase. They need others to step up if they are going to realistically challenge.
Crook may dominate again?

2 horse race in Pool B
NSW Metro and Queensland South are probably the 2 favourites for the gold medal game and are playing like it.
Their clash on Wednesday should be a highlight.

First decent look at Tredrea, can see why she's easy to coach against and doesn’t blow the lights out at district, so left handed it’s not funny..why her club coaches allowed her to go left and not work her right side all this time is beyond me!

Lehmann, Taylor, Somfai not playing this year.
Fagan injured early, not sure how serious.
Thompson, Corasaniti are 2 names trying to make a case for u17 selection early on.
The rest on the list we already know.


In the boys, Gillespie and Schubert have been good for sa c. Cottons been good, Robinson also over 3 games. Cheeseman done a good job at pg for vic m.

Disappointing loss by the Vic Metro girls today. Shot very poorly for most of the game and it was costly in the end. Full props to the NSW country girls for the great win. Crook was simply outstanding today. Vic girls need to regroup and make sure they avoid that 4th spot in the pool.

@blues67
Not sure what game you are talking about today. I watched a fair bit of the SA girls v Tas today and from what I saw only Gardiner play well. Hodges seemed very quiet with 2/12 shooting, but agree she is a star. Nobody else looked to have a good game. Stats also back up the fact that Gardiner was in a league of her own today.
Shout out to Ahearn from Tas who fought hard and chalked up 25 of her own.

@weed slug do you mean Krystal Thompson??

Is there a link to the program this year?

Frogface, every player in the history of basketball has a tendency to go a preferred way, Just because she's a lefty highlights it more, James Harden has made a career out of going left. The comment about district basketball sounds like you are very close to the SA basketball scene and everyone on this forum is well aware of the club jealousy that exists within that state. It was just a "positive" observation that she and two other bottom agers for SA have contributed to their team so far. Leave the criticism to coaches.

Billo,
Sorry, I was referring mainly to their game vs Queensland North. Hodges was brilliant and was critical to their win. Only saw the last quarter vs Tasmania followed by the NSW / Vic game. Big test for Gardiner and the other SA bigs vs Crook.

@Deepwombat:

https://www.competitions.basketball/competitions/national-championships/u18-njwc/livestats

Thanks Bear, I actually meant an online version of the printed program that lists the players heights.

Frog face. silly comment really!

I think Tredrea has been good for a bottom ager at her first AJC, dont get the criticism above. taylor the top age starter is really struggling with her lack of a consistent shot and id have Tredrea pick up more of her minutes

Gardiner statistically has been good but is also turning it over a fair bit and doesn't look to be at her best yet. Have seen at previous tournaments that she gets better as it goes on. Hodges also not yet firing on all cylinders but pacing the team on offence and defence

Overall they havent played really well yet but have the top end talent, bench depth will be the test once the starters fatigue/injury concerns etc

NT men yesterday had 64 Turnovers, total of 98 for two games, feel for the lads and hopefully they are getting resources from BA to assist in their programs.

Good at least to see the NT men here. Disappointing they can't field a women's team. Agree with your point re support from BA, benchballer.

Still early, but so far underwhelmed by quality on the women's side. SAM and VICM below expectations. The "better" SAM players not living up to their reputations. I expect VICM will tighten up their rotation significantly at crunch time. QLDS look like they could give NSWM a competitive game - would be good to make things more interesting. NSWM currently less than the sum of their parts, but strong enough top 5-6 players to get it done regardless (especially with key players not there from other teams).
Seems to me that some of the weaker teams could help themselves with a better job on their scouting reports (maybe just trouble executing, or both).
NSWC games the highlight for me so far, playing to their strengths and with heart and belief.

IMO

Stock Up - above expectation so far
-
Finney
Thompson
Gardiner
Corasaniti
Bond
Petrie
Crook
Aherne

Expected more from so far
-
Dakic
Mead
Smith
Fotu
Chopping
Wightman
Hanson
Agnew
Nousis

Re NT:

- In NSW, there are about 250,000 boys aged 15-19
- In Vic, there are about 205,000 boys between the ages of 15-19.
- In NT, there are about 250,000 people in total, and only about 7,500 boys between the ages of 15-19, spread far and wide and without significant resources.

The lads are going ok, all things being considered.

Thompson no shock should have been at Aus camp

What is the injury to Fagan?

I have heard there is a consideration to make a combined territories team - ACT and NT. Not sure if that would make much of a difference or be a good thing or not.

@sabre tooth: Fagan has a torn up ankle, new injury, not the same as recent / past 12months injury. May be out for the tournament, no official word as yet.

No good at all hope she has a speedy recovery

Fagan-Ankle.

Even with Lehmann coming back soon, that u17 WC team needs another pg behind Perkins and Thompson looks to be a good option.


Eg
Perkins-Thompson
Hall-Seumanutafa-Lehmann
Hodges-SF + CF (Lots to choose from below)
Somfai-Fagan(some say not ready)
Crook-Jackson(no other options except maybe Hinder)


Assume 2 from, tough decision to make
Taylor
Russell
Gardiner
Petrie
Finney
Bijkerk
Mead
Aherne
Notoa
Dakic

Dakic looks a lot slower than she was & Agnew has not been overly impressive. Trout is clearly one to watch though, should she be on that list Weedy?

I don't think so, I’d be bringing in Hinder in from overseas to see how she does.

@WeedySlug Who is Hinder?

6'6 C based in the U.S, Russell Hinders daughter.
Pushing 6’7, known as an elite rim protector.

2 good games in the women coming up nsw m vs qld s and vic m vs sa m.
Another great game for act and Coe player Russell 15-9-9-4-4
Thompson > Dimarco in a loss in todays sa c v vic c clash.


Sa c boys doing really well despite todays close loss. Schubert and Gillespie crocs maybe?
Vic c and vic m cruising at the moment. Qld s to come.

Looking forward to watching Vic Metro play QLD South in the boys tonight

be tough to pry Schubert from footy

Qld s couldn't get it done vs nsw m with hall in foul trouble.
Not a great game but close throughout.
Stats people not great this game.

Very interested in the Vic M vs SA M girls game tonight. Early call, but if Vic M lose, which is likely given the form so far, it's possible they finish as low as 4th by finals, Tassie look like a tough side. Meanwhile, Vic Country have a chance with a win tomorrow to finish second in their pool.
That couldn't have been expected pre tournament!

True, they have been terrible.
Good wake up call for basketball vic, womens program seems to have some issues.

Gardiner > fagan was my opinion before this even more so now

15-7 at the half for Gardiner in 17 mins.
Fagan over her injury and looks to better at C than pf it would seem. 4 and 5 in 6 mins.
Hodges solid, dakic offering very little.

SA choking in the 3rd, great fightback by vic m.

VICM is hanging on by the volume of open shot misses by SAM

Yep quite a few layups missed.

The Vic bottom age girls, lead by McMechan, Nousis and Fagan have been the difference in the second half

SA M gonna get it done. Hodges excellent whole game, tale of 2 halves for Gardiner. Jones sneakily fillin up the rbd numbers.
As bear said, the 08s of vic m gave them a big boost.

Mcmechan and Hastings(nsw) 2 good 08s already quickly snatched up by nz.
Paea, hippolite, mailei, thomson, Vukona, te paki also made the nz 07/08 WC list.

Vic m v qld s boys thriller.

QLD S!
Not sure Cotton can do that again if they face each other in the finals.

Impressive game from the QLD S boys. They got a lot from their sets, and Indy Cotton was consistently dangerous.

Vic M offense looked ineffective by comparison. I thought Henry Sewell should have got a lot more minutes, especially after the QLD S centre went out injured.

Vic Metro Women's leaders (past and present) have a lot to answer for. That was a poor game of basketball and really highlights Victoria's fall from grace. Ironically SA seem to be following Victoria's model as well with the change in high performance. It will be an interesting few years for both programs.

Why was Fagan not subbed on until the second quarter, but able to play over 20 minutes?

SA were really carried by their stars without much polish. Unless they improve, that's not going to get it done against NSW Metro or Queensland South.

Frogface's comments seem all the more accurate four days in.

It's not just the girls side of things that's in trouble (Vic M)

WC G?
Perkins - Thompson***
Hall - Seumanutafa* - Lehmann**
Hodges - Russell - Taylor**
Somfai - Gardiner***
Fagan - Crook/Jackson****


*Hope comes good, has not looked at her best.
** Have been locks by BA since the beginning and injuries to both probably not gonna change that.
*** Deserve a spot based on what they have done 1/2 way through the tournament.
**** whetter or not they take both is up for debate, they may go smaller at the WC and bring in another guard/forward or look elsewhere for another centre.
Dakic the outlier who is at the Coe but has looked off the mark this tournament.


WC B?
Always harder to make but at the moment.

Daniels / Cheeseman / ? Foxwell/Bruton
Cotton / Dickeson
Beauchamp / Walker* / Gillespie or Robinson or Duff Tytler?
Schubert? / Kuany
Nyuon? / ? Sewell/Pilimai

*injured

Early days, probably missing a couple.

Is your WC girls list missing an outside shooter Weedy? I've been impressed by a few like Finney and Reisinger. Although they were both off the mark in today's game.

Perkins can hit some, but not her priority. Speaking of Perkins, she carried a heavy load in today's game, especially with Hall in foul trouble. I don't think it's wise to be playing her for nearly 40 mins in a group game.

Pool A in the Men looks very strong, top 4 all even. Pool B a lot weaker Vic Country look like they are cruising with Daniels not even out of first gear yet. If they don't snap out it could be the top 4 teams in Pool A, into the final four. SA Country still unknown, lost to VIC country, and have only beaten NSWM, ACT and NT, who only have wins amongst themselves. Maybe should have beaten QLD N but were out coached and don't use their bench, too heavily reliant on the starting 5, some over the border are suggesting they left a couple out that would be quite handy about now. Not sure if the two you mentioned are ready for next step @weedy Schubert probably should have been looked at last year a bottom ager. See what happen in crossovers, and well selectors decisions have always been a little bizarre so who knows.
Cheeseman, Beauchamp, Cotton, Kauny, Sewell and Pilimai all look the goods. Dickeson just a bit off at moment. Bruton looks like the surprise package, playing well in a strong pool. Looking forward to the cross overs.

Good win by the SA M girls over Vic M, well played to them. They look to be well coached, always look to have a good balance and seem to be the thorn in Vics side lately. Reigning champs, so was never going to be easy. Vic M girls have a lot of work ahead of them if they want to earn a medal from here.

Vic M didn't shoot well tonight, but having said that the SA girls missed a lot of dollys under the ring and to be brutally honest maybe could/should have won by more.

Nousis stepped up more and had a good game. probably the only consistent Vic shooter tonight. Gave a spark tonight off the bench. Agnew was okay.

I have to agree with above comments of Gardiner > Fagan, but all of those easy misses must be a worry. 6-18 shooting and at least 15-16 of those shots were from within 1-2 metres. But still looks to be having a very solid tournament so far.

Both Finney and Reisinger have played above expectation, Finney especially with her 3 pt shooting, but not sure you take her on that alone.

The 3 guard lineups with Perkins/hall/hodges, a 6'1 forward playing the 4 and somfai at the 5 i thought was our best lineup in asia. Might have to go a little bigger in the post at worlds. Rebounding in this age group is pretty terrible...


Garlepps go to before injuries was something like

PG Lehmann
SG Hall
SF Taylor
PF Russell
C Somfai

PG Perkins
SG Hodges
SF Notoa/Aherne
PF Fagan
C Crook/Jackson


Somfai got sick early and came back late, Russell got injured early and Hall got injured in the middle but played either side.

Fast forward to WC and I think the lineup should probably change. Just my opinion…
Will Garlepp swap some players?, I dunno, maybe just 1. Didn’t really play Aherne, Fagan or Jackson a whole lot.

Maybe other peeps would be happy with... ?

PG Perkins
SG Hall
SF Hodges
PF Gardiner
C Somfai

PG Lehmann / Thompson
SG Seumanutafa
SF Taylor
PF Russell
C Crook / Fagan

Somfai? They won't pick her after her exit from the Coe

She'll be there, no doubt.

Great news, I hope they do, she's important

What is going on with Vic Metro girls? Do we just overrate them each year?
To me, they are poorly coached, he never lets their players on court to settle and gel, constantly subbing.
Likely now to crossover with an elite Queensland South team in the quarter finals with the likelihood of a 5th to 8th finish.
Again, poor from 3 last night, 2 for 28!

agree Blues, poorly coached, 4th last year and looking likely to do worse this year, how does he keep getting reappointed?! Clearly any shot is a good shot, is this his philosophy or is this the Basketball Vic 'style of play'??

Vic M girls currently losing to Tassie by 10 halfway through the 2nd, this is surely unheard of??

Aherne is out also...

Brookens and co, BV should probably drop them asap.
Girls completely disinterested from the beginning.

Feel sorry for the girls that this is the best BV can do for them

Must get a grilling at half time, like the sa game much more energy after the break.

Fagan refusing to lose!

Still losing but nice to see some effort from the team.
Would need to replicate this 1/4 going forward or they are no chance of progressing to the semis.

Nyuon by far the most productive big on the boys side.
Another big game against one of the favourites.

Good for Tassie, beating vic m without best player.
Smiths best game this tournament, 16-11 + 6 blocks...

G Finals more than likely

Nsw m v vic m
Qld s v tas
Nsw c v vic c
Sa c v sa m

so good by Tassie, very disappointing for Vic M

The Vic M boys looked much better today against Tassie. They really outclassed them and their offense gave them a lot more easy looks.

Dash Daniels with a triple double.. 19P, 11R, 10A, 3S ,2B
close to 5 & 5

Also in the same game Ajak Nyuon (ACT) went for 24 points, 2/3 3 point, 10/10 free throws, 10B, 2A, 4B

Daniels playing like that is very much needed for aus if we are to do anything at the WC.

Seumanutafa havin a shocker of a tournament in the group stage. Both her and Dakic who have come off long term injuries have been well below standard.
Looks like Aherne for Tas will be out for sometime.

Qld s and vic c shooting around 25%-30% through 3/4s...

Schubert with another monster game 27-12-2-6 in another loss for sa c.

Whilst there may be other problems for both Victorian Under 18 girls teams, shooting averages are terrible. Vic Metro shooting 19% from the 3 and 59% from the foul line. Vic Country shooting 22% from the 3 and 50% from the foul line. Both teams shoot a high percentage of their shots from outside the 3, so the effect is even more exaggerated.

Shooting was an issue for this group in u16 and also last years u18 cohort. The trend will continue if they don't select kids who can shoot. Those selecting the trams are at fault here, there are plenty of girls who can shoot that were overlooked both this year and previously.

Free throw percentages are down for both Men and Women compared to 2023.

M: 61.1% to 56.6%
W: 59.1% to 54.4%

Only Tasmania and NSW Metro Women are (barely) shooting above 60% on free throws. Outside of those two and Queensland South, offensive efficiency has plummeted.

Both the Men and Women are scoring about 3 points fewer per 100 possessions as well compared to 2023.

NT and WAC Men seem to be dragging the average down though, as there are plenty of teams with respectable efficiency scores.

Last chance really for 07/08 athletes to prove themselves before the WC.


U17 Women WC Draw at 3am tomorrow morning.
Tournament 13th July(Mexico)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mOpW3eyZBHA



U17 Mens WC, 29th June(Turkey)

Drawn already

Pools

A
Spain
Lithuania
Phillipines
Puerto Rico

B
China
USA
France
Guinea

C
Argentina
Turkey
NZ
Italy

D
Egypt
Germany
Canada
Australia

The Vic kids are forced to do SDP if they want to be eligible for State team selection. SDP consists of 2 shooting sessions per week, with the HP coaches. Something is not quite adding up here.

I have to first say well done to the Tassie girls, played with passion and heart especially missing their captain Aherne. Shot very well in an intense game. Some times a team just wants it more than the other.

It is hard to fathom as a Victorian. We have such a deep talent pool to select from (and we pick 12!) and Tassie doesn't quite have to same depth pool to choose from. Plus they have lost their top scorer. So the question is how bad did Vic M want to this win this game? Coming off 2 losses already and staring down the possibility of 4th place in the pool. You have to come out breathing fire in the first quarter and we didn't. Is that on the girls or on the coaching staff? Probably both, but one group is well experienced adults, and the other 16/17 year olds. They are still "juniors", so I would be looking more in one direction. The talent is there, just don't know if the desperation was there today. But give the Tassie girls all credit as they showed everyone that they are a talented group with plenty of passion.

Girls draw

A
Japan
Spain
Argentina
Finland

B
Italy
Mexico
Mali
New Zealand

C
Puerto Rico
Australia
USA
Croatia

D
Chinese Taipei
Egypt
Canada
France

Can someone explain why NSW metro boys aren't in QF as they finished 4th in pool?

They finished with the same wins and losses as SA Country, but SA Country beat them head-to-head.

Point differential (which the ladder is sorted by) is only used as the final tiebreaker I believe.

I believe the rules are if it's a 2 way tie on win/loss it’s then head to head, if it’s a 3 way tie or more it’s based on percentage.
So SAC beat NSWC so SAC go through!
I think !!

Aha. Thanks.

A disappointing result for BNSW either way.

A disappointing result for BNSW either way.

Nyuon comes up big again.
32-12 with 7 blocks.
Puts him Top 5 in points and rebounds, 1st in block shots.

Interesting result(s) and early game score trends for the U18G so far. Looks decidedly like pool B is / was a stronger group than pool A, which upon reflection is an even more damning result for Vic M teams selection and or program. The Vic C girls appear to have been the stronger squad of the two if their games vs NSW M and QLD S are anything to go by. SA C are more than holding their own vs SA M so far also.
This whole tournament has not gone to script, which is actually very refreshing. We seem to be hung up on the Vic M squads having won every National title before the tournaments begin and then discount that each game is a two horse race and sport is not meant to be easy nor one sided. Yes, Vic has a large talent pool, but that historically, across all sports does not stop the players or teams that have greater desire to win and compete at every challenge. Honestly, I think that is where the Vic M squad has dropped off, desire to compete vs losing without looking like you were beaten.

Sa c pulling away early from sa m is surprising.
Gardiner almost already with a double-double and Thompson causing havoc with 6 steals in 12 mins.

Whoever wins this SA clash might just be the most unconvincing top 4 team I've witnessed. SA Metro should eventually be too much to handle, but Country doing this without Lehmann makes it even more damning for Metro.

Tas keeping pace with qld s without aherne. Again... surprising.

Thompson is a star

Much better start from vic m girls. Another upset looming ?

Would it be an upset or more a surprise after their underperforming to date?

Upset, nsw m were the favourites going in.

HP Manager O'Hea now supporting as an assistant on the bench.
VICM lacking a centre which is again hurting them. Fagan has the height but more suited to the stretch role. Will be a good second half.

Her future is probably PF but I think she is best at centre atm, Having her sit at the top of the 3 point line gives them nothing down low. Altering shots and using her athleticism to gather rebounds should be the aim early on in her career imo.

Through to semis(Girls)

Qld South
Vic Country
Sa Country
Nsw Metro

5 wins from 5 games for Pool B vs Pool A, the "upsets" have form now. Gotta give some love to the Vic C girls, just played a strong and disciplined game from start to finish. Dimarco has an engine that just keeps revving, big heart and was the main focus of their win.
NSW M started a little tentatively, then broke the game open from half time. They looked like the team that finished on top of the ladder and will be hard to beat for the gold IMO

Nice to see two country teams getting through on the girls side. Crook subdued against Vic C, which was key for them.

Thompson was excellent for SAC. Surprising how dominant SAC were especially given their previous results.

Vic M girls disorganised and lacked composure. finishing was poor.

Hopefully Bijkerk's injury isn't serious. If so, NSWM bench looking thin ... 2 injured and 1 player who must only be there for development.

A QldS v NSWM rematch in the final is where the money is I guess. But I always enjoy an upset!

Re Vic Metro, I hope the adults with jobs don't lay the results on the kids with aspirations.

Through to semis(boys)

Qld north
Vic metro
Vic country
Sa metro

Could be an all-Vic final for the boys. Many were predicting that pre-tournament

The VicM girls coach deserves credit for his past success and I'm sure will own the poor results this time.
I would say they are very well set for a big comeback next year - lots of good bottom-agers getting great experience this year. SAM will also bounce back strong after this early exit. NSWM on the other hand should enjoy their run to the final, it will be a while before the next one in 18s - completely new team and coach next year.

08/09 combined is great news for vic m girls but will they pick the correct ones next year. With this years u16 choices, I'm not so sure.

The result of Vic Metro Girls is a reflection of the Coaching (his reappointment is a joke and doesn't even coach in the age group at VJBL level with nepotistic choices - 7 out of the 12 girls were picked in Under 16, they have not selected the best of the best and the results reflect this. What they have selected is Children whom parents have played - remember their children are taking the court, not their parents so kids who perform have missed out because their Father or Played NBL/WNBL. It's a joke and the boys club needs to stop. The results speak for themselves.

Several of the girls named in Under 16 Vic Metro team this year aren't playing already - ACL injury and Suspension.

@Suburban Mum, I'm interested to see what players you believe have missed out on making the U16 squad and the ones you feel shouldnt have made it.

Fakalata on talent alone is the correct choice. She was not officially suspended via tribunal hearing at the time of the team announcement, though has been subsequently.
Ljubicic injured her knee minutes before the team was announced to the squad and there was no medical indication at that point that she'd be out for the tournament.
Brown is recovering and will be fit for the tournament and was in the squad as a bottom age player the year before.
Anderson is an emergency player and is also recovering from stress fractures though will be right for the tournament.

Thats four players, i'm not sure of the other players you're referring to?


Elisa Brown - Casey
Marianela Fakalata - Dandenong
Taya Hanan-Datson - Diamond Valley
Evie Haywood - McKinnon
Jasmine Jones - Kilsyth
Valerija Ljubicic - Nunawading
Sophie Richardson - Camberwell
Madison Ryan - Sandringham
Laura Seiz - Melbourne
Indy Springett - Kilsyth
Vanessa Tavete - Casey
Matilda Trout - Bulleen

EMERGENCIES

Emma Anderson - Dandenong
Ceejay Caddy - Diamond Valley
Cleo Barbakas - Nunawading
Clea Clark - Dandenong
Tesloch Puoch - Dandenong
Tiedore Puoch - Dandenong
Jayda Scarafilo - Keilor
Eliza Shanahan - Nunawading

4 on that emergency list should be there above others imo, pre injuries.
7 of the 20 should be fighting for jnr n.t spots, not just state spots.

good response weedy - I was worried we were going to start singling out players!

To suburban mums post, in general terms, conflicts of interest are a factor in most selection processes where subjectivity is involved, well beyond just basketball and probably affecting multiple teams at this tournament. It can be more obvious when the weaker performers have some association with the coach or are, to your point, "connected" in some way with decision makers and influencers, but it's not always obvious. The state bodies should be doing more to protect the coach from themselves (they are only human and we all have biases, often subconsciously). I'd argue that the VicM coach not coaching in the same VJBL age group is actually a good thing, and should be a minimum requirement before appointing a HC. There are lots of things the states can do to make the process fairer, but it'll never be perfect. Although picking the teams using AI probably isn't too far off !!!!

Basketball Victoria - you reap what you sow! What do you expect from years of picking favourites rather than talent!

Not surprised with the outcome of 18G VICM's performance. The coach is not the only problem - the team selection is also a factor. There are so many talented kids out there that don't get selected but for some reason, we see the same kids in the state teams year in, year out. Surely with the population and size of Melbourne there is a huge pool to pick from.


BV's teams selections processes are corrupt and have been for years.

BV's state team selection MO usually involves the following:

* Selectors/coaches work at either private grammar schools or basketball academies. State teams are heavily skewed with players from these schools.
Check the current teams and you'll see many from Haileybury, Wesley, Rowville, Templstowe etc .

* The SDP program is a money making machine for BV and nothing else. Case in point, talented kids that don't participate in SDP don't get a look in for state representation.

* It's a well known open secret that the state teams are 90% selected before trials begin. It's astonishing how many injured players sit on the sideline during the trials and make the team!

BV needs a massive overhaul.

That same VicM coach won a gold medal with a team no one gave a chance to 2 yrs ago. People like Suburban mom said the same things about that team also. Coaches usually get a 3 yr cycle in Vic so his appointment should have been expected because he found some success.

Wake up and realize this isn't your Mom's state of basketball in this country anymore. We should be excited that the playing fields are leveling out. There is more talent in every state and there are more resources in every state also. The days of VicM coming to nationals and just running over teams and being dominant are over.

Congratulations to VicC men and women. Question, is VicC part of BV also or is that a different state? Because It def looks like the mens and women's programs have done extremely well. I agree VicM women have not had a great tournament but I doubt it was on purpose. Victoria still has 3 teams in the Semifinals..is that not state dominance? How bout we get around them..

Based on BV's 2022 accounts, the HP income was $866,763 and the HP Expenses were $1,994,560. So funding deficit for the High Performance programme alone of over $1million. That total deficit is about the amount received from government for the whole of basketball in Victoria. Also, State team income was $273,359 and State team expenses were $709,793. Again a deficit funded by others. In total, $2.7m spent on HP and state teams, benefiting quite a limited number of people.

TBH, didn’t realise these things were so expensive and exceeded the money received from government for the whole of government.

I'm an outsider (NSW) looking in to Vic and I still see a strong program. As Juice points out - 3 teams still in contention, and realistic chance of an all Vic boys GF. I'd happily take that and look forward to a bounce-back next year from a well positioned metro girls team.

NSW is where the autopsy is needed. Neither boys team made QFs, and only the metro girls remain in contention, and the selectors of that team have left the cupboard empty for next year.

Also from NSW
Vic M girls will bounce back next year they've had 5 bottom agers do great at this tournament that will set them up for a very solid group next year.
SA metro girls will also bounce back but I think VIC M girls will get them next year if the right group is picked.

Victoria is still a very strong group

There's a reason the Vic Metro girls coach has been at so many clubs. Just talk to the clubs that have moved him on.

That same VicM coach won a gold medal with a team no one gave a chance to 2 yrs ago.

Not true at all Juice, everyone expected that team to win and were surprised/disappointed that more of them were not in the Sapphires team/squad.

Another terrible performance by vic m, beaten by nsw c. Finishing 7-8 in a 12 team comp, doubt coach gets another go now.

He's already on his 3rd and said he wasn't going around again.

He didn't even want to do it this time, it was offered to him because there were no other applicants... which is pointing to a more serious issue at BV.

wow! How can there be no applicants for a Vic metro HC role?! If that's true, the problems run very deep.

QLD s smash sa c, Thompson out early.
Notoa triple double!

Final nsw m vs qld s

Cracking start by SAM boys vs Vic country boys. 13 point lead 4 min in.

Am I right that Vic M girls selected 5 bottom agers? If so, it does not seem to me to be a a strategy that you would take in a talent pool as deep as Vic to try to win the 2024 U18 tournament. If seems to me that would be having low expectations of on winning the 2024 U18 tournament and setting up for the 2025 tournament.

Similarly NSW M selecting no bottom age in 2024 is tantamount to to giving up or having lower expectations in 2025 and only on winning this year.

Is it possible state selectors would do this? Backing years that they think that they have a strong group coming through rather than the best players/team?

Bruton has been a big surprise, consistant throughout.

Well done to sa metro boys...

Indeed SAM men very much outplayed VicC. foul count was interesting

Vic m vs sa m boys final
Nsw m vs qld s girls final

Hoopstragic - the bottom age VicM girls were among their best performers. I think the problem they had was more with poor game plan and execution rather than sacrificing this year in preparation for next year as I think you suggest?

NSWM would win this tournament (or at minimum get to GF) with their top 6-7 players + ANY 3 or 4 others from their final selection squad, which is clear given which players are getting meaningful minutes. The opportunity to strike a balance and get success this year + prepare for next year was there, but the HC wanted to reunite his winning team from U16s 2 years ago (even those not playing meaningful minutes then and now).

I think the priority should always be to do best possible at each tournament, but it's hard to envisage a scenario for most teams where that couldn't include some bottom agers. Otherwise is the HP program acknowledging they haven't developed a good pipeline of talent and don't value development - surely they wouldn't do that?

@Steed With respect to V metro, perhaps, but then selection of the squad and including those left out, plays a part also?

NSW Metro, likely have the best 8, and that hasn't changed from 2 years ago. That the last 2 players in the squad are privately coached by, and in the NSW metro coach's representive association team that he coaches, undoubtably is a complete coincidence!

I do find myself wondering whether the best outcome for basketball junior development would be singular year groups. starting from U14, then 15,16,17,18,19, 20?

Hoopstragic - It's a good point re overall selection for VicM. I'm just not familiar enough with the VicM players omitted to know whether they would have replaced top or bottom agers, and what difference it would have made this year. I just know that the bottom agers overall performed well.

I think having 2 age groups per tournament is still the right thing. Makes them more of a special event and it also challenges the bottom agers - which again comes back to development, which I think is important, but BNSW HP apparently less so. And we're on the same page re some of the hometown picks with NSWM girls - that's the sort of scenario where the state HP orgs need to step in and provide oversight to protect the coaches from themselves.

Yes agree with challenging the better bottom agers, but that also omits some other potential players and, generally speaking, though we as coaches might like to think that we are good at talent identification, but the wider the net, the better the catch.
Having individual age groups does not preclude players playing 'up' and allows more tom compete on a national stage.

The players selected were the best available, according to those within the program, and regardless, the talent in the team is more than the other states have. What is interesting though is some of the most impactful players in the age group in VJBL aren't even in SDP, which means they aren’t eligible to even trial for the team. Im not certain as to why they specifically weren’t in SDP, but I do know that it’s seen as a waste of time and money by some, and find their rep or even school basketball coaching more beneficial for improvement, so prioritise that. If it’s that they weren’t selected, that raises questions.

There are a lot of good comments about the Vic M girls selection process. But regardless of how that got to this particular team of 12, they have enough talent in that team to have done way better than they have.

def WA M
lost NSW C
def Qld N
lost SA M
lost Tas
lost NSW M
lost NSW C

Their only 2 wins have been against extremely average teams who have struggled.
If their team of 12 are behind at half time (of 7v8 play off) against a depleted Tasmanian line up of 9 then I can see the coaching staff taking an early flight back to Melbourne. Surely they don't finish 2-6 at these Nationals? Holy smokes!!

Tas beat vic m girls again, my goodness. Hopefully they review what went wrong.

Wow, full marks to the Tas girls for knocking off Vic M TWICE! And Tas were missing Aherne, Smith only 2 points and Chopping 3 points. Undersized but played with heart and passion. I think there is a lession in there somewhere for Vic.

you go into the final game with a size advantage and depth advantage and get beaten comfortably. Hmmmm.
Vic M shot a woeful 22% (18-80) compared to Tas 33% (21-62). 18 more shots is quite significant.

Puts a full stop on an extremely disappointing week for Vic M.

The Vicm girls performance is a culmination of awful decisions by successive HP managers going back some time. The introduction of VNPP was a start, they have made decisions at a very young age on who the best players are going to be, which they have mostly got wrong because its simply not possible to project where 13-year-olds will end up. This is a massive misallocation of resources and leads to poor future decisions because these kids are preselected in State teams without any requirement to perform. For the kids who are actually amongst the best in the age group, it takes them out of the environment that helped them get there and put them in an environment which is often inferior in terms of coaching and competition compared to what they can get at their clubs or privately. If VNPP had the best coaches and selected the best players this might be different, but neither is the case in reality.

Selection decisions on SDP and VNPP are far too heavily dictated by height, which filters out kids born later in the year and late developers. The largest pool of talented kids is always going to be amongst the guards but they deselect so many that there is no competition for those who are left which is equally as detrimental to those who are selected, iron sharpens iron, there needs to be a large cohort of kids at each position competing with each other if they want to maximise the chances of producing elite senior players. The opposite is true of the tall girls, they make it too easy and pick too many before they are good at basketball and provide little incentive for them to get better.

The pathway starts too young with FDP, its not possible for them to make good decisions at this age because of the huge variation in both development and experience of the players. Many of these kids are also not ready to take sport seriously and it puts some of those kids off the sport. Because of the number of kids and the huge variance in current playing ability its also not an environment for the better players that is conducive to improvement.

SDP used to be 2 morning and one evening for shooting, with it being compulsory for kids to attend at least 2 sessions. This was reduced to one evening and one morning to allow for FDP and because most kids only went to 2 sessions. In reality the non-attendance issue was a product of both the dedication of some of the kids involved or the quality of the sessions.

The sharp reduction in the number of kids as the they get older progressively reduces the quality of the training partners the best kids have, at the same time they take more into VNPP which exacerbates this. Hardly any u18 kids continue with SDP consistently, and a large number drop out, after the State teams are picked. it doesn't appear that the HP coaches have ever seen this as an issue with the program. Because only SDP and VNPP kids can be selected for the State team there was a small pool of top agers. It's entirely possible that some of the kids not in there didn't try out but there is a large pool of tip age u18 kids who are clearly superior performers to many of those in SDP, the result being less competition at ECC and a poorly picked State team.

Th HP coaches continually talk about shooting being the master skill in basketball, but their selections at every level do not reflect this. Vic Metro state teams continually shoot around 20% from 3 and 50% from the line. This was the case for the 07/08 girls in both u16 and this year and for last years u18 team. This will continue if there is not a premium placed on this skill.

My hope this that this result brings about some substantial change, but I'm pessimistic given recent history where every significant decision seems to make the program worse.

And on a side note, Vic Country just won bronze by a landslide.

Congratulations to those girls, the coaching staff and families of all involved.
If you were to only listen to or read most forums, you'd swear there was only one Victorian girls team competing at these competitions.

Fortunately, they did not and continued their self belief and never gave an inch.

I'm not convinced that there is a whole lot wrong with the Vic M selection, in fact when you read back past comments prior the start of this tournament, many had them as medalists or even favorites. So the issue seems to be either the way they were coached or the teams mindset for each game. They looked to me as though they were waiting for someone to do something and very few did.

And on a side note, Vic Country just won bronze by a landslide.

Congratulations to those girls, the coaching staff and families of all involved.
If you were to only listen to or read most forums, you'd swear there was only one Victorian girls team competing at these competitions.

Fortunately, they did not and continued their self belief and never gave an inch.

I'm not convinced that there is a whole lot wrong with the Vic M selection, in fact when you read back past comments prior the start of this tournament, many had them as medalists or even favorites. So the issue seems to be either the way they were coached or the teams mindset for each game. They looked to me as though they were waiting for someone to do something and very few did.

Nearly all players who were decent in Vic m got cut from SDP by Ohea , So they weren't eligible to tryout for state, but there definitely were som impactful players that one hundred percent should of made the team and made SDP, there's to much politics with in BV

Those players who have other sporting commitments are getting shafted for those that attend every camp.

Tight game.
Seumanutafa injured early.
Finney scorchin in the first half from 3.

XXXX - you are 100% spot on.

The key issue is that it should be a development programme, but it actually is a "here and now" programme.

There is a significant difference.

Very easy to pick a kid that has grown early, and is just going to cap out at 15 / 16. They still pick kids for State teams who will never play past the age of 18, because they will go to football or they will end up being the same height they were when they were 14. That is not developing basketballers for Victoria, that is just picking kids who will get results for underage tournaments (and sometimes it backfires as well).

More difficult to pick and persist with and develop a kid who hasn't, but has application and basketball IQ and who will get there in the end.

Nsw metro get it done. Gold u16-u18, u20?
Hall and Finney fantastic, Perkins solid once again and vallances best game off the bench.
Notoa outstanding for qld s all tournament, pretty close to averaging a triple double.


Camp invites next month?

Perkins / Thompson / Notoa / Lehmann*
Hall / Bond / Corasaniti / Seumanutafa
Hodges / Aherne / Finney / Taylor*
Gardiner / Russell / Petrie / Somfai*
Crook / Jackson / Fagan / Hinder*
*MIA

A few others clearly did not perform.

Looks about right weedy. high quality basketball today and super impressed by Notoa. would have been great to see the game playout with Seumanutafa on the court. But NSW just way too many weapons firing today.

Do you think BA will buck the trend of automatic selection for CoE scholarship holders?

Also I believe they were only planning on taking around 16 to the next camp.

Yes 16. Probably 20 needed with quite a few injured.

I think BA will do the same as previous years unfortunately, guarantee all or most Coe athletes.

It would be too embarrassing for BA to do otherwise, and might cause some at *high levels* to question whether the money is well spent if CoE athletes don't get selected because there are better outside the system.

100% correct, CoE athletes will always be automatic otherwise too many questions would be asked so BA needs to strip back how they select athletes for CoE. I think they select them far too young, it should be top age 18's being 16-17 year olds and not 15-16 year olds.

My comment above regarding under 16 Vic Metro team was there have been changes eg injury etc to the team selected, not about who was selected, that pertained to under 18 girls, the results speak for themselves in regards to that performance.

Also we have a family who has moved from NSW to VIC, both girls where selected in 16 and 18 teams without any history in participating in the SDP program, which is a must for team selection, they were selected for the State team and then added to SDP afterwards, how is that allowed when kids who aren’t apart of SDP can’t an invitation to selections?

Even game to the end. Vic metro overcome sa metro.
Beauchamp too good.
Bruton bigtime, keeps delivering for sa.

[State] - [2022 Result]

Men:
VICM - 1st
SAM - 4th
VICC - 6th
QLDN - 11th
WAM - 4th
SAC - 8th
QLDS - 2nd
TAS - 7th
NSWM - 5th
ACT - 10th
NSWC - 9th
WAC - 12th
NT - 13th

Women:
NSWM - 1st
QLDS - 5th
VICC - 4th
SAC - 6th
SAM - 2nd
NSWC - 9th
TAS - 7th
VICM - 3rd
WAC - 8th
WAM - 11th
QLDN - 10th
ACT - 12th

Biggest improvers:
QLN Men +7
VICC Men +3

QLDS Women +3
NSWC Women +3


Biggest falls:
QLDS Men -5
NSWM Men -4

VICM Women -5
SAM Women -3

All star 5s IMO

G
PG Thompson - sa c
SG Hall - nsw m
G/F Notoa - qld s
PF Gardiner - sa m
C Crook - nsw c

B
G Bruton - sa m
G Robinson - vic c
G/F Beauchamp - vic m
PF Schubert - sa c
C Nyuon - act

Weedy, curious as to why you would select Fagan as a 5 spot player, when she played all week as a rather ordinary perimeter player, average shooter and extremely poor decision making, 4th on her very average team in rebounding and nearly fouling out every game. If anyone was using the tournament for selections she wouldn't even make a list of 20.

She was the backup 4 playing limited minutes in asia and a 5 at this tournament although playing mostly away from the basket which is hard to fathom.
Neither suite her game this early on in her career imo, I believe her future is at the 4 like the role Magbegor plays for the opals but not yet.
Right now she should be solely an under the basket player where she has a clear advantage over all others, athleticism + 192cm.
Keep her close to the basket, crashing the glass and altering shots.
Having her at the top of the key on most possessions did not help the vics and is a big reason why she only averaged 5 rbds whereas the other true 5s all averaged 7-12 playing all minutes under or within 8ft of the basket
Alot fagan personal fouls came from trying to guard smaller players driving to the basket.

The other true centres 6'3+...
-Crook 12
-Smith 10
-Jackson 8
-Jones 8

If was picking the frontcourt for the WC, the pfs would be Somfai/Gardiner against similar sized teams, Crook/Jackson (or Hinder) at centre and fagan the reserve tweener depending on the matchup, form or injury.

Just my thoughts, Who would you take instead?

Finney and Vallance shooting in the Final 9/17 3s undoubtably critical, in a an exciting contest. Valance last 3 games with more court time definitely gave her shooting rhythm 12/22 3s, having made only 4 in previous 5 games.

Finney, Vallance and Jackson improvers. Compared to 2022.

So did Robinson, Bruton, Schubert and/or Nyuon do enough to force themselves onto the U17 boys world cup team?

Does anyone know why Nash Walker didn't play in these nationals?

Be interesting to see what happens @deepwombat. Since covid, Aust Rep squads haven't really been chosen on stats, so do wonder how they are picked, and has more to do with HP managers in respective states, of the 4 you mention, Bruton perhaps, looked a bit more versatile, but would be at the expense of one of the other SA lads already in the "Squad", new HP managers down there so maybe.

@weedys all star 5 selections (Men) poses an interesting question re stats V team players as well, some of those racked up the points stats, the "team" stats not quite so much, (happened not only this year) so would be interesting to learn from State coaches and National coaches what they actually are asking of players.

Defence looked lacklustre across the week, and shooting percentage was interesting.

Walker was apparently injured.

Was an interesting week to be involved.

@benchballer I agree with you that both Shubert & Bruton definitely deserve to be included in the next mens camp. Their stats were impressive.
They have a real issue in selecting the next squad if is based on performance cause the SA boys really stepped up. Existing squad is made up of predominatly COE players so how do they leave these guys out.
What is going on with NSW Mens. Both teams really underperformed. Based on stats some players did ok but overall to not finish in top 8 is surprising.

Way too early predictions for girls champs in 2025

U20
Hard to go past NSW, especially with metro and country meshing. Their bottom age guards, perimeter shooting, along with size inside with Crook will make them formidable.
SA (no Somfai), Queensland, Victoria all should be challengers for minor medals.

U18
Like NSW in 20's, SA Metro should be hot favourite. They will have 5 returning players from the 2024 team plus another that missed the tourney due to football commitments, on top of 2 very good bottom agers.
They need a change of coach however, blame from that QF disaster needs to fall on the coaching crew, they were out coached by their country counterpart.
VIC Metro probably the only real challenger but their program needs an overhaul to make me change my mind.

U20s is interesting. I wonder whether states will bring more than 10 players, given the depth that many have. For NSW it's really only Crook and maybe Hocking that would make the team from Country, but that displaces strong and proven Metro players if they don't.

Victoria (will take 12) and Queensland are in a similar position with at least 1-2 very strong country players. SA too, but they won't have the depth to take two teams of more than 10.

The U18 girls comp is much more open than that. NSW Metro has a big and balanced group. Queensland South will still be the biggest team there and will have Olechnowicz with another year of Nationals experience under her belt. Vic Country's program also seems to be trending in the right direction.

Vic Metro will no doubt change coach, so they might actually utilise their talent and depth effectively depending on who is appointed. They were much more capable than their last U16 and U18 performances have showed.

If SA Metro are serious about contending they will also make a change. Either bring in someone fresh or appoint the medal-winning U16 coach to U18's, which worked for NSW Metro this year.

18 girls - VicM, SAM and QLDS. Not enough experience with the NSWM girls to medal. Coach selection across the board is going to be interesting and key.

The difficulty with predicting the 20s so soon is not knowing availability (college, WNBL). NSW on the women's side are favourites, especially with strength at the bottom age who have more chance of still being available. NSW would do very well with 2 teams.

Biggest drama for BNSW could be the coach selection- Garlepp might want a shot at a 3rd gold and Hill likely pushing to keep riding the wave with his 16/18s championship girls. There will be a bunfight between those two over team selection if they take 2 teams.
BNSW seem to insist their coaches take an age group for 2 years before moving up. Which is why Hill was forced to take the 16s last year before getting his girls back in their top age this year. Hill won't be happy, but makes sense for him to own the consequences of his team selection this year. Regardless, it could all depend on Garlepp's decision and whether they take 1 or 2 teams.

Agree Jayhoops - Hilbig should replace McPhail with SA Metro U18 girls

Will be interesting if Ranford (HP Manager) has the stomach to make the hard decisions early

Athletes have been notified about the next U17 camp and it's starting to be posted on social media. Stacked with Victorians as usual.

Weedy I don't think you'll be too impressed unfortunately.

10 Victorians wow.
what are the other surprises.
surely SA gets the rest

The old Coe guarantee ...
Didn't see garlepp around except mostly the nsw and vic games.

So far, officially listed...


BOYS
G Cheeseman - vic 07
G Daniels - vic 07
G Walker - tas 07
G Robinson - vic 07
F Beauchamp - vic 07
F Duff-Tytler - vic 07
F Brammall - vic 07
F Akhuar - vic 07
F Kuany - vic 07
P Sewell - vic 07
P Pilimai - vic 07

GIRLS
G Dakic - vic 07
G Aherne - tas 07
F Taylor - vic 07
F Ryan - vic 09
P Fagan - vic 08

I know this is a reduced (numbers) squad but very surprised Vaughns, VIC, didn't get picked. He was looking very good at the U18, really believed he would make the team..

That's 11 squad members announced from a perviously mentioned 16 limit, leaves potentially 5 more, most likely;
Nyuon
Dyson-Merwe
Cotton
Dickeson
Bruton or Schubert

It may be 18.

I think you could be right Weedy. I believe there's 17 in the Sapphires squad based on the names I know, so the Crocs might have followed suit.

Jayhoops / Weedy - locks for squad

QLD - Natoa, Petrie (?)
NSW - Hall, Perkins, Crook, Finney, Jackson
SA - Hodges. Somfai, Lehmann (injured still)
ACT - Russell

Seumanutafa - ruled out with injury I take it?

Doesn't leave many places for the likes of Gardiner and Thompson that actually performed when it mattered

One of those locks are out and add two Queenslanders to the mix.

Recent performances and probably what's needed...

Perkins 1
Thompson 1-2
Hall 2-1
Hodges 2-3-1
Notoa 1-4-3
Finney 3
Russell 4-3
Gardiner 4-3
Somfai 4-5-3
Fagan 5-4
Crook 5
Jackson 5

Controversial = yes, but fair I’d say.
Would never happen though.

Will watch COE and other nbl1 games which have 07/08/09 players.

Agree it's odd that Vaughns was not selected. He is a great talent and is not someone who is likely to go off and play AFL.

Yes, it was a surprise to me too about Vaughns omission. He's a quality player. I guess there were just too many others at his position to give him a spot.

I'd remove Fagan and Russell from Weedy's list, both total non shooters and not good enough close to the basket to make up for it. The rest I agree with, but not sure who id replace these two with. I was really disappointed with the performances of Wightman and Agnew at the AJCs, both are definitely good enough to make this team and can shoot really well, but didn't show it and don't deserve a spot on their performances. It's going to be a pretty disappointing team with all the COE girls there, a number are either injured too often, just aren't that great at basketball or both.

First hit out for the COE NBL1 teams tonight against tough opposition (Albury-wodonga). Injuries aside, will be interesting to watch those in the mix for WC spots. Should get a better idea of how they might be played at the WC.

XXXX,

Petrie or Taylor for Russell?

Smith, Jones, Wightman, Hanson, Trout, Juffermans, Mcrea, Buttsworth, Nightingale, Crase, Ryan, Hinder we're other post options if you wanted to replace Fagan.

It will be the 2023 Asian Cup team plus any CoE kids leftover.
All the "form" players from AJC, outside of these 2 criteria won't make it.
Terrible.

More than likely but it certainly needs to change. We cannot keep rewarding players if they do not earn selection.

Update.

BOYS
G Cheeseman - vic 07
G Daniels - vic 07
G Cotton - qld 07
G Walker - tas 07
G Robinson - vic 07
F Beauchamp - vic 07
F Duff-Tytler - vic 07
F Brammall - vic 07
F Akhuar - vic 07
F Kuany - vic 07
P Sewell - vic 07
P Pilimai - vic 07

GIRLS
G Seumanutafa - qld 07
G Dakic - vic 07
G Aherne - tas 07
G Notoa - qld 07
F Taylor - vic 07
F Petrie - qld 07
F Ryan - vic 09
P Hanson - qld 07
P Fagan - vic 08

NZ sending a pre tournament team to the u.s for exp.
Likely will be very close to the team for the WC. Lots of familiar names...

Chanel Enriquez-Paea, Outside of NZ > (QLD SOUTH)
Bailey Flavell, Harbour Basketball Association
Olivia Hastings, Outside of NZ > (NSW METRO)
Keriana Hippolite, Outside of NZ > (QLD SOUTH)
Pahlyss Hokianga, Basketball Hawkes Bay
Jennifer Mailei, Outside of NZ > (NSW METRO)
Taia McMechan, Outside of NZ > (VIC METRO)
Ophelia Powell, Canterbury Basketball Association
Emma Rogers, Tauranga Basketball Association
Cassidy Thomson, Outside of NZ > (NSW METRO)
Gia Vukona, Outside of NZ > (QLD SOUTH)
Kodee Williams-Sefo, Harbour Basketball Association


Much improved squad on last year with still 1-2 out.

Taylor is a lot better than the other 2 if she's fit, but she's barely played since the pandemic lockdowns. Personally, I wouldn't consider anybody who is a total non shooter, so that rules out Russell. Wightman is the best of the rest of the group by a very wide margin, but they shouldn't pick her because she's had 3 AJC's and hasn't performed in any of them. If Crase has a jump shot maybe her, I haven't taken much notice of her. The wing who should be in contention but was left out of Vic Metro side is Magnanini from Melbourne Tigers.

The Vic metro debacle has cost quite a few kids a decent chance and, in cases like Magnanini, any chance at making this team.

Crase is more a long term prospect at the wing spot, could be truely elite on the defensive end of the floor with her length but if she's to get to the next level she needs a jump shot to keep them honest.
Teams will sag off her like they did at AJC and let her fire away or make her earn them from the line knowing she’s only 40% from the line.
She would be someone that the CoE should invest in?

Most of the ones they want to invest in don't want to go and you end up with less talented players who are still guaranteed spots.
With nbl1 in place I don’t really see a need for a women’s Coe. What they should do is have a team in each conference made up of npp and spp state players.
Coe also in the weakest conference which does not help.

It’s good to see many 06/07/08/09 players getting minutes for nbl1 teams, has made a big difference. Hocking at eastern is a good example.

Update 2.

BOYS
G Cheeseman - vic 07
G Daniels - vic 07
G Cotton - qld 07
G Walker - tas 07
G Robinson - vic 07
F Beauchamp - vic 07
F Duff-Tytler - vic 07
F Brammall - vic 07
F Akhuar - vic 07
F Kuany - vic 07
P Sewell - vic 07
P Nyuon - act 07
P Pilimai - vic 07

GIRLS
G Seumanutafa - qld 07
G Dakic - vic 07
G Aherne - tas 07
G Notoa - qld 07
F Taylor - vic 07
F Petrie - qld 07
F Russell - act 07
F Ryan - vic 09
P Hanson - qld 07
P Fagan - vic 08


Just SA, WA and NSW left.

From Vic, 10 x '07 Boys and 2 x '07 girls. NSW will probably be the reverse, or will be there be any boys from NSW at all?

There's been plenty said about vic metro and the girls but how can states get one gender right and not the other.

@Weedy Slug. Olivia Hastigs to NZ is a loss. New Zealand real picking up recruiting Australian based players with links to NZ. Only 5 NZ based girls, would hate to be a NZ based player...doesnt say much for their development of the girls side of things.

Yes the kiwis are very active in recruiting potential Aus players early.

only 1 girl from sa I'm hearing

There's only so much nz can do given their geography and population.
It makes sense to pick players a short flight away playing in good competitions and being developed well.

Is nationals worth anything these days when it comes to nt selections?

From the BA website
"The U18 Women's player of the tournament went to Tasmania’s Andie Smith who showed that the Apple Isle doesn’t fall far from the tree. Andie’s sister Alanna is currently in the WNBA for the Minnesota Lynx and her father Darren played over 200 NBL games.

Not to discredit Andie, but how would they overlook Gardner, Hall, Notoa, amongst others?

To be the BA player of the tournament and not get a national squad call up.

"To be the BA player of the tournament and not get a national squad call up."

I don't know the young lady but if she’s not at the COE then that would probably explain it, under what appears to be the current selection criteria for national teams.

She was awarded "Best Defensive Player" for the tournament, there is no Best Player “MVP” type award at AJC.

She deserved the award, rebounding and shot blocking was elite.

I thought that is best defensive player too and that makes more sense, but odd that it is called "Best Player" on the BA website. Dash Daniel is listed as best player in the boys.

It remains strange that she didn't get a national team squad call up.

Is there a full girls and boys list yet?

Crocs/sapphires camp
Wa/sa athletes still tbd

BOYS
G Cheeseman - vic 07
G Daniels - vic 07
G Cotton - qld 07
G Dyson-Merwe - nsw 07
G Walker - tas 07
G Robinson - vic 07
F Beauchamp - vic 07
F Duff-Tytler - vic 07
F Brammall - vic 07
F Akhuar - vic 07
F Kuany - vic 07
P Sewell - vic 07
P Nyuon - act 07
P Pilimai - vic 07

GIRLS
G Perkins - nsw 07
G Hall - nsw 07
G Seumanutafa - qld 07
G Dakic - vic 07
G Aherne - tas 07
G Notoa - qld 07
F Finney - nsw 07
F Taylor - vic 07
F Petrie - qld 07
F Russell - act 07
F Ryan - vic 09
P Hanson - qld 07
P Fagan - vic 08
P Crook - nsw 07
P Jackson - nsw 07

@Weedy Dyson-Merwe from NSW/CoE is a 6'10 Post player.

From SA Dickeson is a lock and the last spot is most likely between Bruton/MacKenzie/Riddle.

Cheers.

You would think

McKenzie
Bruton
Dickeson
Gillespie
Schubert

Just 1 would not be fair.

no Gardiner hodges or Thompson got to wonder what these selectors are actually watching

I think we are still waiting on those to be announced.

Sabretooth is nonetheless correct Weedy. I didn't want to draw attention to it, but who knows when BSA will get their act together and announce Lehmann and Somfai. That's everyone for the Sapphires form what I know.

It's hard to fathom how three of the best players at nationals -- one of whom has repped Australia as a starter -- can't get an invite for the squad, let alone make the team.

I heard somfai was in camp 3. Maybe it's the same for the other sa players.

Can someone please explain why squad selection announcements are so haphazard and done by the states and not by BA?

Bruton and Dickeson are the last 2 editions to be included in the Crocs squad of 16, as seen on the CoE's recent posts. All 07 born players, it's going to be tough to pick the final 12 for worlds.

Players cut from camp 1.

M Vaughns (VIC/NBA GA)
M Krasnadamskis (VIC)
F Pavely (NSW/ CoE)
B Diing (NSW)*
A Prosser (NSW)*
I Riddle (SA)*

* Bottom agers (2008 born)

Also, J McKenzie (SA) cut from camp 1, after good nationals.

Not cool.
Must be very frustrating for the players that performed.


I'm looking forward to an overhaul at BA, Peter has passed his used by date imo.
How can he remain when percentages across the board continue to fall at every level.

@weedy slug, the selections have been somewhat bewildering for the last 3-4 years really. Results on the small amount of internationals games played looks OK, but then you look at who they have been playing and half the Div 1 teams in Australia would beat the opposition (maybe NZ excluded). Recent tourny in Germany may be slightly different. It is quite bizarre some of the non selections over those years, you could probably create a team from the non selected that would beat the selected, esp on the boys side! Speak with people around Australia and it's the same thoughts. No disrespect to the players chosen as they are all good ballers but it seems to be harder to get out of Aust basketball teams than get in and that goes right to the top. Yet we then wonder why other sports are chosen over Basketball, when it comes to decision/career time. Time for full independent review from COE down and get Basketball pumping in high performance, has that feeling of a bit internal and decision made well in advance of actual competitions. We wonder why players not choosing (or leaving) COE and state teams?

Pavely broken leg ...out for 4 months

SA Somfai, Hodges, Lehmann, Gardiner added to u17 camp.
No thompson.

Where is this posted?

SA Facebook.

More than 16 but quite a few currently injured.

GIRLS CAMP
G Perkins - nsw 07
G Lehmann - sa 07
G Hall - nsw 07
G Seumanutafa - qld 07
G Hodges - sa 07
G Dakic - vic 07
G Aherne - tas 07
G Notoa - qld 07
F Finney - nsw 07
F Taylor - vic 07
F Petrie - qld 07
F Russell - act 07
F Ryan - vic 09
F Gardiner - sa 07
P Hanson - qld 07
P Somfai - sa 07
P Fagan - vic 08
P Crook - nsw 07
P Jackson - nsw 07

Gardiner and Hodges told at nationals they were cut and now they are back. what is going on there at ba?

Injuries, and lots of them.

Rumour mill in overdrive this morning. Word has it Ryan confirmed as making the squad.
Double bottom age player, fantastic achievement and a player for the future.

Yes, makes you wonder why they didn't take Olechnowicz then when so many guards are injured. Looks like they have been guaranteed spots eventhough they haven’t played for sometime.

Agreed, some head scratching decisions being made at the top i feel.
Ryan is an amazing talent and one i'm not upset about making the national team, however, it is a big loss to the Vic Metro girls squad for nationals in July.
Olechnowicz missing the cut is very strange indeed, she's a formidable force on court.

Also, Jessie May Hall not in the squad??

I think im getting confused between the 17WC squad and the 18 Asia Cup

U18 asia squad already selected (poorly once again). 06/07 players,

U17 WC selection is what's being talked about. 07/08 players, except Ryan who was born in 09 might have made it.

U15 oceania selection 09/10 happens after u16 ajcs.

Ryan has made the team: decided months ago, barring injury.

All players at the camp were told after the last session.

Did Olechnowicz make the camp? Thought it was just Ryan from 09.

Yes just Ryan, just 1 2009.

Other 09s like Olechnowicz, Hocking, Smith and Johnson are other ones to watch out for later this year. Maybe some vics if they can get out of the emergency list.

IamBear, you are correct about Ryan being a big loss for Vic Metro if she makes the Aus squad. There is still lots of Vic talent, but some of the bigs are thin on experience at the highest level.

I know she was not in the Aus squad, but just a comment on Olechnowicz after watching her play quite a number of times the past 2 years. Even though she plays often as a guard, her actual game style is more like a SF or PF. Does not really have elite ball skills, outside shot or jump shot, but is very powerful driving into the paint and can be a real handful. Obviously I have no stats on this but I would guess maybe 80-90% of her total points come from either inside the paint or the from the foul line. I have seen some games where that percentage has been 100%.
She will definitley be in Aus squads the next few years, but will be interesting to see what position they will get her to play.

Does anyone know the location and dates for 2025 U/18 AJC?

April 6th to 13th in Brisbane

Brisbane, 1st week of April

Moreton Bay council committed for 3 years, this will be year 3.

Thankyou Blues67

Any early predictions on 2025 U18 Nationals favourites and U17 Oceania Men and Women Teams? there's seems to be drop down in high-level talent 08 born in comparison to 07 class.

For the boys, I assume that Vic Metro will be favourites after they won U16 2 years ago. Their 2009 born U18 bottom agers are quite strong.

SA Country will contend again I'd say.

SA Metro and NSW Metro both underperformed 2 years ago, and may be stronger this time around.

Obviously this all depends on who has grown (height/strength-wise) and developed skills-wise.

Not sure about U17 Oceania. Plenty of talent in the 1-4 positions, but not sure who is going to play 5.

Girls probably

PG TBD
Hocking 09
Bond 08
Olechnowicz 09
Smith 09
Nousis 08
SF TBD
Ryan 09
Gardiner 08
Juffermans 08
Fagan 08
C TBD

Left a few spots open for debate.

Weedy where and when is the 17 Oceania played? I thought the Oceania was 15s?

That's this year, 17s 2025.

your knowledge on this is unbelievable Weedy. Thankyou. It totally confuses me

15 Oceania - This year ? where and when? Heard a Whisper its in Canberra late November ? Second hand chat of course
16's - Do what ?
17s - Oceania in 25 ? do you know where and when ? Or too early
18s ? - Do what ?

There are a number of junior FIBA tournaments that happen each year for different top age/bottom ages sets of athletes. Apologies if the formatting is screwed up:

Year 2009/2010 2008/2009 2007/2008 2006/2007
2022 U15 Oceania
2023 U16 Asia U17 Oceania
2024 U15 Oceania U17 World U18 Asia
2025 U16 Asia U17 Oceania U19 World
2026 U17 World U18 Asia
2027 U19 World

Take 2:

Year_2009/2010___2008/2009___2007/2008___2006/2007__
2022_________________________U15 Oceania____________
2023_________________________U16 Asia____U17 Oceania
2024_U15 Oceania_____________U17 World___U18 Asia___
2025_U16 Asia____U17 Oceania_____________U19 World__
2026_U17 World___U18 Asia___________________________
2027_____________U19 World__________________________

thank you Deepwombat

Till 2030

O = Oceania Champs
A = Asia Champs
W = World Cup

2024 U17 W 07/08
2024 U18 A 06/07
2024 U15 O 09/10
2025 U19 W 06/07
2025 U16 A 09/10
2025 U17 O 08/09
2026 U17 W 09/10
2026 U18 A 08/09
2026 U15 O 11/12
2027 U19 W 08/09
2027 U16 A 11/12
2027 U17 O 10/11
2028 U17 W 11/12
2028 U18 A 10/11
2028 U15 O 13/14
2029 U19 W 10/11
2029 U16 A 13/14
2029 U17 O 12/13
2030 U17 W 13/14
2030 U18 A 12/13
2030 U15 O 15/16

6 tournaments per year, 3 girls + 3 boys.

Weedy, I see you have a strong view on the COE and im not here to dispute that. I read with interest your concept of having a centralised COE program in each state and that allows those players to play in their NBL1 zone.
What age group works here do you think and would this potentially harm the weaker NBL1 clubs that need to push their elite kids up to NBL1 already?
Also does this affect the U18 program?