Scout
Two months ago

NZ in financial strife?

Boti reporting that the cuzzies might not be around much longer:

http://www.botinagy.com/blog/kings24/?fbclid=IwAR152cC3DDGFPfD5helL9GQw2MILkjpuViGKziMeTowXdCIn8k80duuCBuk

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EssenX  
Two months ago

I struggle to believe this given the commercial partnerships they've brought on board this season. But I do think they are for sale.

Reply #933798 | Report this post


Ben  
Two months ago

Srsly, how long has it been since Boti has been a reliable news breaker, if ever.

Doesn't pass the sniff test for me that NZ is suddenly reported as being in financial trouble, and that the franchise will immediately be tossed to the Gold Coast next season.

In the same report, Boti suggests Ninnis has a chance at contuing as HC with Adelaide next season. Yeah nah mate.

Reply #933799 | Report this post


Scout  
Two months ago

Yep - hence the question mark after the post.


Boti used to have street cred re information he put out there....not sure now.

NZ have become a solid part of the league, respect the way they play and they also seem to have solid support, so I hope they stay in the league for a long time.


Reply #933801 | Report this post


hoopie  
Two months ago

I can't see LarryK burning the NZ set-up just to establish the Gold Coast.

And if someone is trying to raise financial support in NZ by making it look like their local team could lose its licence, then that would have to be a pretty clumsy way of doing it.

I call BS

Reply #933804 | Report this post


Q Anon  
Two months ago

Teams dont make money and are only as good as the owners pockets. 36ers dont have a 3rd import. Brisbane and Illawarra missing sponsors on uniforms. Cairns cant retain their best FA's

If the TV numbers are as wonderful as the self promotion is , those things would not be happening.

Owners are being told their teams are worth up to 30 million BUT Perth sold for 8.5 Million to Hutch who has his own financial stresses. Perth was the only profitable team for a while under Bendat. 36ers have been shopped around , Brisbane and SEM open to anyone who wants to put money in.

NZ was great when the Blackwell's could use it to offset gains in other business'

Boti usually speaks with well known entities within the league so believe he puts this forward with some type of foundation.

Reply #933805 | Report this post


KTL33  
Two months ago

Boti is on the money with this one. Scoff all you like, but it's well known in league circles what’s going on.

Reply #933806 | Report this post


The Phantom  
Two months ago

Boti may not have the finger on the pulse as much as he used to have, but doubt he would put such a big story out without reliable information. Surely for an entire countries basketball team you would expect some conglomerate to assist, even the government would help out. Would be a real black eye for the league if a successful franchise even with a small history is shut down or moved to where sports teams go to die, the Gold Coast.
But the league has really gone downhill. Perth despite the recent resurgence is a shambles, Sydney is a mess and how long do their fans stay loyal. Don't even talk about Brisbane and Adelaide. Hawks and Cairns are often a day to day proposal, Phoenix is an appropriate nickname, are they due to burn out again. Tassie is doing well, but winners are grinners. If they drop a level, can their infrastructure survive.
League really looks like fools gold, a few lottery picks in NBA, talks itself up as second best league in world and franchises worth millions and obligatory ex NBA players as owners just for a bit of publicity when All Star John Wall joins his team for a shoot around. Firepower might as well come back and sponsor league. Will NBL go down the netball path?

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KET  
Two months ago

It would be bizarre for Boti to be that wrong. Where there's smoke there’s fire.

Shame though because Breakers appeared to be very well run and plenty of sponsors!

Reply #933809 | Report this post


LV  
Two months ago

It wouldn't be surprising at all if this is correct

Let's hope LK and others keep pumping cash into NBL and the clubs

Reply #933810 | Report this post


GordonG  
Two months ago

Got nothing really to do with what Boti is talking about, but one of the best things on the branding side of things is the Breakers being sponsored by Manuka Honey - and the floorwipers wear shirts that say "Worker Bee" on the back. Gold...

Reply #933811 | Report this post


Dunkman  
Two months ago

Horrible news if correct.

Reply #933812 | Report this post


Sebastian  
Two months ago

Once I saw the name Boti there was no point reading anymore

Reply #933813 | Report this post


Anonymightymouse  
Two months ago

Matt Walsh has publicly stated this isn't true, for what that's worth:

https://twitter.com/mattyvincent44/status/1744355787760132273

Reply #933814 | Report this post


EssenX  
Two months ago

Given that the article talks about 36ers chasing Maor, could this be fake news designed to unsettle the Kiwi camp?

As an aside, 36ers are dreaming if a players coach like Maor looks past the way the 36ers have treated people in recent years and joins them.

Reply #933818 | Report this post


Mystro  
Two months ago

There's an article in the NZ Herald today with Matt Walsh stating there is zero truth to this rumour.

Reply #933820 | Report this post


Anonymightymouse  
Two months ago

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/nz-breakers-owner-matt-walsh-denies-claims-the-team-could-move-out-of-new-zealand/6POUFM3FAZFLBIUMEF6NLHDHUE/

"There's no validity to it. I would note that this guy, whoever he is, also didn’t reach out to me for comment," Walsh told the Herald.

“As an ownership group, we’re committed. In terms of the financial standing of the club, it’s never been better, certainly in our six years of ownership. The league is booming, and we’re growing right alongside the league.

“We’re about to enter a new media rights deal, and we’re in a great position. I’m not sure where this guy heard this, if he made it up, or if somebody’s got an axe to grind with the club, but I can assure all Breakers fans we’ve never had any discussions about moving the club to Australia or anywhere. The Breakers are going to be around long after I’m gone.”

Reply #933822 | Report this post


Perthworld  
Two months ago

You can't rely on Boti these days, it's as if he is trying to continue his former glory with News Corp by relying on weak sources.

In saying that I appreciate him blogging about the league but he should stick to match reviews and opinion pieces.

Reply #933824 | Report this post


Cram  
Two months ago

It wouldnt be unusual for an owner to say rumours are untrue even when they are ("the coach has our full support!") but this seems unlikely. The situation would have to be absolutely awful for the league to give up on NZ and associated eye balls and media, let alone have an immediate plan

Reply #933827 | Report this post


MACDUB  
Two months ago

Interest in NZ has fallen pretty hard.

They were all the rage years ago but people don't care much for them anymore here

Reply #933833 | Report this post


LoveBroker  
Two months ago

I wouldn't be surprised if NZ took a bug financial hut fron the pandemic.

Almost 2 seasons of low home games, plus potentially the increased costs of housing the team in Australia for long stretches.

I hope this is not correct or if so that NZ can recover.

The league is better for NZ being in it.

Reply #933834 | Report this post


AngusH  
Two months ago

I hope Walsh is telling the truth - much better for basketball in our region to have both AU and NZ teams in the NBL.

Reply #933835 | Report this post


EssenX  
Two months ago

A lot of sports teams are struggling to rebuild their audiences post-COVID and the Breakers had two seasons where their members and fans routines were broken. But attendances late last season were healthy and improving this season. This will take time to rebuild and not helped by tighter household budgets at this time.

Reply #933837 | Report this post


Bullets  
Two months ago

I call bullsh*t.
Despite the doubters (including many here), commercially the league is in the best position it's been in for a long time, possibly ever.

Reply #933841 | Report this post


The Phantom  
Two months ago

Bullets, can you share your information?

Reply #933844 | Report this post


Bullets  
Two months ago

@The Phantom
Am I an insider? No.

But I am in business and have been privy to what sort of cash sponsors are now willing to invest to be part of the league.
With all viewership metrics trending positively, the league continues to expand its commercial reach.
In fact, the number of partners on board now is greater than at any stage in league history.
Once the broadcast deal has been renegotiated, that will help clubs further.

Re the Breakers, undoubtedly they would be under considerable financial hardship after a hellish few years but that doesn't mean they will imminently fold. Matt Walsh’s comments reinforce this.
Moreover, LK has been on record several times saying no further clubs will fold under his watch.

Reply #933847 | Report this post


Q Anon  
Two months ago

It's fine to say the league is in its best commercial situation in years. When you are off a low base that isn't hard to do.

The TV numbers are still horrible and on par with what they were, or less, a decade ago.

Attendance is up but sponsors want eyeballs. Getting 10k to Sydney instead of 5k doesnt move the needle on sponsorship measurement.

The other thing that has moved up is player salaries. Players are on roughly tripe what they were a decade a go. So the business' cost base has 3x'd while the income hasnt offset that to date.

Reply #933850 | Report this post


MACDUB  
Two months ago

So in short Q Anon, teams aren't any more profitable - it’s just that they are bankrolled now by owners with deep led pockets who use spending on an NBL team as some form of offset/spending money against their main business income?

Reply #933851 | Report this post


LV  
Two months ago

The other thing is with sponsorship, there's an element of "the place to be". To be blunt, NBL is cooler and better than it used to be. Business people are more likely to purchase box seats and put some money in.

[The TV numbers are still horrible and on par with what they were, or less, a decade ago.]

Have you got a source on that

Reply #933852 | Report this post


Q Anon  
Two months ago

Best TV ratings from last season was 66,000 for a game.

SEM V Kings December 10 2023 got 21,000 viewers and this is "good" according to the NBL when they are spruiking x% increases year in year.

In the past TV was getting 100k viewers on FTA





Reply #933853 | Report this post


Anonymightymouse  
Two months ago

"The TV numbers are still horrible and on par with what they were, or less, a decade ago."

This is only if you're using the old average viewer ratings. The way people watch sport has changed enormously in the past decade with streaming far more widespread.

The other factor is the NBL is now getting $$ as part of a broadcast deal, and is controlling the production so get $$ from advertisers too.

The NBL and its club's revenue is through the roof from a decade ago, which is needed because expenditure has gone up significantly too.

Reply #933854 | Report this post


KET  
Two months ago

"In the past TV was getting 100k viewers on FTA"

Are you specifically picking out the ONEHD and Ten days?
That's a radically different market size and demographic to 10Peach!

I’d be interested in comparisons to the Fox Sports days and how similar market size leagues have been going in such a fragmented market with different technology adoption. I think these would be less misleading!

Reply #933867 | Report this post


EssenX  
Two months ago

Business people don't buy sports teams to burn cash. The tax benefit derives from non-cash expenses such as depreciation, both on the initial purchase and showing losses annually for tax purposes (although these losses might be ringfenced in some countries). However, the team should still be cashflow positive (or worst case neutral). No one is burning cash for tax purposes and burning $1 to save 14-35 cents. If teams were burning cash then they’d be falling over like they were 15-20 years ago.

Reply #933882 | Report this post


Perthworld  
Two months ago

I'd be interested in comparisons to the Fox Sports days

20-30k was considered good back then.

Now LK's NBL talks up a 20k audience as growth. It's all smoke and mirrors.

Reply #933890 | Report this post


The Phantom  
Two months ago

So if LK was to suddenly pull all of his money out of the league and his teams, the league would flourish? If it wasn't for him the league would be deader than a dodo. He can't afford to have another team go belly up if he wants to sell teams. Unless there's a mega rich owner that concedes they're going to lose money, tv deals are now the only real option in terms of sports teams being rich and making a profit. I'm surprised there aren't meat raffles at half time to supplement the income. Agree with the smoke and mirrors, the place to be, influencers courtside to pretend it's like being at a Lakers game. How many times do we have to see and hear how big a fan Brendan Fevola is of basketball? Wasn't the league totally worried at the start of COVID how losing attendance revenue would be the nail in the coffin.
Still interested Bullets how you know so many businesses willing to put in major money.

Reply #933918 | Report this post


Q Anon  
Two months ago

@KET yes because we keep being fed that everything is bigger and better than it's ever been when the reality is that it is a long way off. Until it's on a main FTA channel it's a second tier operation.

Yes it all presents well as the product is more polished.

The NBL is a pathway to the NBA, you mean like it was for Heal, Gaze, Bradtke, Brunson and so on 30 years ago? Remember when there was a bunch of NBL guys drafted like Newley , CJ Bruton and Ben Pepper.

Sydney and NZ are the only teams with Tier 1 corporate sponsors on their uniforms.

Most of the corporate boxes in Adelaide are empty for game. Those people have paid for the tickets and still dont attend. It's far from the massive success we are being sold.

Owners being told their teams are valued at 30m is purely VC blue sky pump. The owners are in to try and create a wave to ride to the next valuation.

Reply #933924 | Report this post


Nightwing  
Two months ago

One person is benefiting from the commercial growth of the NBL and NBL1 and its not the clubs. It's LK

Yes he and his mates have done a lot for the league but they're also the only ones who have financially benefited

Reply #933926 | Report this post


Aussie  
Two months ago

Once the broadcast deal has been renegotiated, that will help clubs further.

I wonder what would be considered a good result for next season?

Hopefully every game live on ESPN (Foxtel) and Kayo again.

Maybe two live games on a main free to air channel (Maybe Channel 10) every Sunday and perhaps one live game every Friday OR Saturday night?

Reply #933927 | Report this post


Dunkman  
Two months ago

Who watches free to air tv anymore, everything is streamed.

I'm glad LK came along and don’t have a problem with him making money, it’s far better than no league at all.

To many negative nans around here.

Reply #933928 | Report this post


Aussie  
Two months ago


I'm glad LK came along and don't have a problem with him making money, it’s far better than no league at all.

We all should be.

If we see him at a game, we should all go up to him and thank him

Reply #933929 | Report this post


Bullets  
Two months ago

@The Phantom: I work in the hardware sector.
Bunnngs along with several of its suppliers are supporting the league.
I can't go into specifics but let’s just say my company was given the opportunity to jump on board but its was too high for us to justify within our marketing budget. However, competitors of ours took up those opportunities.
Does that answer your question?

Reply #933935 | Report this post


Bullets  
Two months ago

@ Aussie: I 100% agree! At a bare minimum, he deserves our respect.

Reply #933936 | Report this post




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