Aussie
Two years ago

NBL teams crowd averages so far this season

Perth Wildcats 10,780
Sydney Kings 8,973
Adelaide 36ers 8,085
Melbourne United 7,431
SEM Phoenix 5,119
Brisbane Bullets 4,797
Tasmania JackJumpers 4,231
Cairns Taipans 3,849
NZ Breakers 3,814
Illawarra Hawks 2,758

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Anonymightymouse  
Two years ago

I think Tasmania should be higher than that with all sellouts. I don't know why they list 4231 each week when last year the sellout capacity was around 4800. There definitely wasn't 600 spare seats on Saturday.

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KET  
Two years ago

Interesting figures albeit early in the season. Some of those may decrease as the season progresses.

I wonder how many tix are free?

Perth and Tassie might benefit from an easy to use ticket transfer or on-sell system for members to maximise attendance.

Sydney's figures are good, hopefully they can keep growing to one day average 10k.

Good start for Adelaide but only 2 games. It well even out. If they have a successful season, they might be able to average 6.5-7k, but otherwise I think they’d be happy if they average 5.8-6.2k per game.

Decent United and SEM numbers so far. Brissy is ok.

Cairns it’s a bit too low - do they usually sell out? Is it a members not showing up issue?

NZ is a bit poor...what’s the stadium capacity?

Hawks is an atrocious crowd figure. Bottom plus Monday night games won’t help, but I don’t think NBL were wrong to kill the Illawarra name off… make them NSW Hawks and split their games between a few locations.

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Pablo Escobar  
Two years ago

Illawarra's numbers = extinction

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ME (he/kangaroo)  
Two years ago

We've been playing this game with the Hawks for a while now. They'll get close to extinction and then the 20 fans they have start saying that somehow LK is to blame for the way the team is going. The fact is the interest isn't that high in Illawarra. Either they find a different way to make it work and make revenue for the team or they fold. I know we dont want teams folding in today's NBL but I am not sure how they survive on 2K fans.

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Dunkman  
Two years ago

Hawks have had two Monday night games and have a shit team, you can see why punters won't turn up. Goorg mate pulled up stumps after two seasons and so back to square one. The local guy and Ball should have got the license not the US guy and goorg mate.

Hawks stadium is a crap place to get to, no parking. Homebush is also crap but Sydney have a good team and money invested by a passionate owner. Hawks owner is US business man that probably now realises that this isn’t a money making venture and pulled funds. I’m not certain where the hawks go from here.

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AngusH  
Two years ago

Yeah I don't know why the Hawks are being stuck with so many Monday night home games, but it just exasperates their issues with the roster woes they have.

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KET  
Two years ago

Yeah there are a lot of factors that go into the success of a club, and it's not about blaming people for not showing necessarily either.

The NBL these days are far more acutely aware of the factors that goes into a successful team than previous NBL managements. They did everything right with Tassie - which is easy to do when you’ve got a property development business and a State Gov willing to invest heavily.

For Darwin they’ve said you gotta have infra and has to be right on the quay.

Going back to the Hawks, there’s the die hard fans of which it’s a diminishing and small number of 2.5k odd. They’ll go through lots of shit to watch their team.

Then there’s the families when deciding what kind of entertainment they want to go to, is a Hawks Monday night game right? Is it worth it to go to the pain of parking and accessing the place?

Then there’s the corporates - is it worth going to after work? Can it be a night out with dinner before, drinks at a bar after?

Is the stadium an attraction in itself?

If all these things are no, then you’re only going to win over fans if you’re successful and even that is a big "if".

Adelaide Oval was big for changing the dynamic of what going to the footy meant for a lot of people, if you don’t have that advantage for basketball it’s a lot harder to compete with other sports or other forms of entertainment. Or even just competing with streaming of the game.

Perth probably has all boxes ticked except perhaps price point which is inevitable with such high demand. Sydney have done a remarkable job considering it’s a bitch of a place to get to.

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AntAntAnt  
Two years ago

Agree re JJs crowd figures. There's something off with them as there was barely a seat free on Saturday night. Certainly not 600 less than last season. And just weird that its been the same exact figure three games in a row (was like this last year too, albeit a higher figure).

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Perthworld  
Two years ago

Brisbane Bullets 4,797

I don't understand this one.

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Ben  
Two years ago

Feel for the Hawkies.

Already struggling with local interest, having to deal with two Monday night games.

Monday night games = awesome for people who like watching hoops on tv. Shit for local supporters turned off by games being played on a 'school night' and shit for the teams that have to manage guaranteed reduced attendances. Are teams compensated by the league somewhat for Mon-Thurs fixtures, knowing that revenue would be significantly reduced on these nights?

Realistically with the exception of holidays, fixtures should only be played Fri-Sun unless teams specifically request to host matches on other nights.

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Astor 32  
Two years ago

Hawks are at home Thursday week too. That wont draw many, particularly if they drop the next 3 (and probably will)

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Ben  
Two years ago

Perthworld - Brisbane so high as they've only had one home game.

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Moose 32  
Two years ago

Hawks have a decades old reliance on the newspaper and local radio for marketing.

Issue being, does anyone still buy a newspaper or listen to radio?

They need to engage in an online marketing strategy with tight targeting to the demographics they want to attract.

NBL's scheduling of midweek games feels like some have mentioned here, a strategic decision to force Hawks out.

If only Larry let Paul Smith buy the team, aye? Or Lamelo's crew.

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Dunkman  
Two years ago

LaMelo had coin but the main money man who still has company name on back playing singlets was the main man. He's supposedly got money in a lot sports in the Illawarra region, football certainly one off them, race horses another. His problem I believe or rumour has it he was against the share games with Canberra, which never happened anyway due to Covid.

You do get the feeling that Illawarra are in the sites to get the chop or become a two town team. I wonder if Smith would be happy to own two franchises. Yes Smith the one that everyone wants to hate but been super for the nbl. He could be king of basketball in nsw.

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Zodiac  
Two years ago

Can't own two franchises that's why Hutchy had to sell his stake in United after the Wildcats purchase. Unless you're LK of course.

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NBLTigers  
Two years ago

I'm worried about Illawarra, their the last team to play in every season since the NBL’s establishment.

Since the Kings already have a strong rivalry with the Hawks they should relocate them to Sydney and call them the South Sydney, West Sydney, North Sydney Hawks whoever has the strongest bid.

At least they can keep their history and play some games at the WIN Entertainment Centre. Keeping the history and Hawks name is important.

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Zodiac  
Two years ago

And fans in Sydney would go out and support a Hawks team why?

Unfortunately this death by a thousand cuts thing has been going on with the Hawks now for about a decade and the NBL always steps in to prop them up because they're the only foundation club left. They've clearly got a cheap roster, they're not competitive and their crowds are still abysmal. I think it might be time at the end of the season to bite the bullet, wind up the Hawks and transfer the licence to Canberra or wherever.

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LV  
Two years ago

Love what the JJS are doing,

Months in advance you can only buy single seats at their home games.

NBL has absolutely nailed it and then everything has gone right for them on the court too. It's a fairytale. Long may it continue.

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LV  
Two years ago

United gave away 1,500 seats to their Sunday game, which was the first sell out this season (first sell out since pre covid I assume)

They also ran a promotion giving away free seats to their Thursday night games to all 3 and 5 game members who signed up in a given week. Didnt help with a paltry 4,449 on the first Thursday night game though.

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Perthworld  
Two years ago

Perthworld - Brisbane so high as they've only had one home game.

Makes sense plus I totally forgot about Baynes being a huge attraction.

Reply #902523 | Report this post


NBLTigers  
Two years ago

Sunday's game wasn’t sold out. There were heaps of empty seats up the top plus my area near the court had some empty seats. They must count member seats who don’t attend to the total attendance which doesn’t make sense. My row is nearly empty most games, not sure why though.

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LV  
Two years ago

Didn't look sold out, but I'm sure they announced on Social media that it was

Reply #902526 | Report this post


LV  
Two years ago

Official figure is 10,300 so yeah, official sell out

Reply #902527 | Report this post


NBLTigers  
Two years ago

Crazy when I was at the game, definitely empty seats. I know some people move seats during the game.

I knew some friends who couldn't go so they must just add the members who already bought their seats.

Reply #902528 | Report this post


WC95  
Two years ago

I suspect the NBL have just about given up on Illawarra. Their crowds are a total lost cause and it really doesn't matter anymore whether they scrape in 4000 against the Kings on a Saturday night (in what would be their best selling game), or 2000 on a Monday night. Might have something to do with the TV contract. Put the lowest supported club on Monday nights is basically saying theyve given up trying to get more people in. Perhaps better ratings on TV than attendance matters anymore in Illawarra. Club needs to fold. Not enough people care.

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WC95  
Two years ago

Tassies crowds are interesting. Sold out memberships, and the same crowd figure each week of 4200+ yet last season it was around the 4700 mark. Have they reduced the capacity there? I thought the plan was to expand the arena over time (or did I just hear that in my mind and its not actually true)

Also the large amount of free ticket give-aways at Melbourne's games are a bit concerning.

Reply #902532 | Report this post


WC95  
Two years ago

NZ has that average because they played their last game away from Spark Arena. For what reason I wouldn't know. If I was the club owner of a team that has just played 2 seasons on the road, I'd be having all my games at the biggest and best arena available.

And doesn't Spark hold 9000? That place should have been sold out in minutes, yet only 5600 attended their first home game in 2 years???

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koberulz  
Two years ago

The new ownership has been trying to push them as being a genuine New Zealand team, rather than just an Auckland team that happens to be called New Zealand.

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Mystro  
Two years ago

NZ played at Trusts Arena instead of Vector as it had another event on.
Trusts is much smaller but used to be the home court of the Breakers prior to the Blackwells moving the team to the NSEC.

There has been a lot of sport on in Auckland as of late and the Breakers have been competing for spectators.

With the team playing well of late I expect those crowd numbers to rise.

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Anonymightymouse  
Two years ago

"Tassies crowds are interesting. Sold out memberships, and the same crowd figure each week of 4200+ yet last season it was around the 4700 mark. Have they reduced the capacity there?"


No the stadium hasn't changed and it's been pretty much full, so not sure what the story is there.

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Cram  
Two years ago

The "sellout" thing just means tickets exhausted. giving away tickets to people who don't show up will do that.

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hAwKhEaD  
Two years ago

The Hawks have a few problems.

Ticket prices are ridiculous. $35 for the cheapest adult seats.

I don't actually think the team is that bad, they are just missing a point guard and a real head coach.

Better entertainment would help too.

Reply #902565 | Report this post


McBlurter  
Two years ago

"Illawarra Hawks 2,758"

May as well go back tot he Snakepit and save rent.


"Brisbane Bullets 4,797"

Nissan Arena is 5,000 capacity isn't it? What can be taken from this?

They're not going back to the BEC anytime soon are they?

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Anonymightymouse  
Two years ago

"The "sellout" thing just means tickets exhausted. giving away tickets to people who don't show up will do that."

Giveables are usually redeemable vouchers, in which case they don't become a ticket until someone actually books one.

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Anonymightymouse  
Two years ago

Was Baynes' first game Brisbane's first-ever sell-out at Nissan Arena?

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KET  
Two years ago

NSW Hawks, market them throughout the state, play 6 home games in Illawarra, 6 in Newcastle, 2 vs Kings at Qudos

And then hope for the best.

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koberulz  
Two years ago

Yes, converting the Hawks into a second Sydney team is guaranteed to work. Look at how the Spirit are thriving.

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LV  
Two years ago

Rebrand to "Southern Hawks", same uniform. 7 games in Wollongong, 3 in Canberra, 4 in Sydney.

Leave one of the home games vs Kings in Wollongong

Would be a good compromise, would potentially pick up new fans in Canberra and Sydney without alienating the base.

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LV  
Two years ago

And over time, assess the traction they're getting

The ideal would be eventually maybe 6 Gong, 6 Sydney, 2 Canberra or something like that, to really tap into Sydney fans who don't like the Kings, but you wouldnt schedule 6 games at Qudos in year 1

Kind of like how the Tigers were gradually transitioning back to John Cain before LK turned them into United. Played 4 games there in the last season as Tigers

Reply #902575 | Report this post


McBlurter  
Two years ago

Can any of you think of a hybrid team in any sport which has worked?

The NRL has been the highest profile sport which has attempted this with 3 JV's.

1 folded, the other 2 are basket cases.

In all cases, they've been 2 indifferent parties at best, and 2 antagonistic parties at worse.

In this instance, you're going to a Canberra audience and saying "Well it's not a Canberra team, but you're basketball fans. You'll appreciate 4 games of NBL level basketball anyway!!"

If Wollongong doesn't support, in adequate numbers, a Wollongong team.... you're proposing they will support a team with even less ties to Wollongong, which players 6 games a year there?

The model is "we will desperately seek a stadium... anywhere ... which will fill up to support us... while we don't identify as being part of the community fabric."

I think you're misguided around why teams get support in the first place.

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KET  
Two years ago

" Yes, converting the Hawks into a second Sydney team is guaranteed to work. Look at how the Spirit are thriving."

Who said it's guaranteed to work?
The Hawks in their current iteration doesn’t work.

NBL wants a second Sydney team and fancies Newcastle as a possible expansion, so a “whole of NSW”/everyone else v Kings makes sense as an option.

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Perthworld  
Two years ago

"Brisbane Bullets 4,797"

Nissan Arena is 5,000 capacity isn't it? What can be taken from this?
Baynes, Aron.

Reply #902578 | Report this post


Perthworld  
Two years ago

"Brisbane Bullets 4,797"

Nissan Arena is 5,000 capacity isn't it? What can be taken from this?

Baynes, Aron.

Reply #902579 | Report this post


KET  
Two years ago

"Can any of you think of a hybrid team in any sport which has worked?"

I don't think Canberra would work. Either the Cannons return or nothing IMO.

A theoretical “NSW” Hawks isn’t a hybrid, it would reflect the AFL a model where for example Port has its specific base, and Adelaide actually represents South Australia sans Port Adelaide area.

So Hawks represents the non-inner city Sydney base plus anyone inner city who supports them on the basis of them not being the Kings

“If Wollongong doesn't support, in adequate numbers, a Wollongong team.... you're proposing they will support a team with even less ties to Wollongong, which players 6 games a year there?”

I think a lot of people point to the location and not being a great stadium as critical reasons for lack of supports - why bother go if it’s not an attractive option.

But if you’re going to find a way around that potentially factor, it would be:
1) less games makes for a cheaper membership which may reduce the barrier of entry for families - an easier drawcard than “go to the effort to buy 6 individual tickets”
2) if the Hawks drew considerably stronger state support and became a bigger club, it might actually gain more traction?

I would suspect the 36ers in a regular season game would draw a better crowd than Mt Gambier in Mt Gambier, for example.

As long as you don’t draw too far of a disconnect with the base (ie don’t go to Canberra), it’s not a terrible opportunity.

Not really much to lose tbh, they’re in survival mode by those crowd numbers.

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Astor 32  
Two years ago

St George Illawarra Steel-Hawks

Reply #902581 | Report this post


McBlurter  
Two years ago

The NRL bulldogs were the owners of the original Razorbacks license.

The motive was a leverage piece for a stadium complex to be built in Liverpool, the NRL dragons did assist with grants for the Hawks around this time too.

I'm not sure the NRL appetite is there anymore, but if they were I'd suspect you'd try Penrith or Parramatta first

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LV  
Two years ago

SEM are a hybrid team. Playing games out of Knox and games from John Cain.

Obviously Knox is an outer suburb of Melbourne (25-30km from city), not quite the same as Wollongong, but still. Plenty of Melbourne's population lives East of Knox and Knox is easily accessible whereas JCA is not. It taps into two different markets potentially.

Geelong in the AFL plays 2 or 3 MCG home games a year (and in some seasons has been as many as 4) plus all their finals (and they’re the most successful team in the AFL over the past 20-30 years, meaning loads of finals). So by season’s end, a typical season would’ve been say, 8 games in Geelong and 5 at MCG (3 Home & Away games and 2 finals).

Hawthorn and North Melbourne have a hybrid approach in the AFL, playing 7 or 8 home games in Melbourne and 3 or 4 in Tasmania. They’ve both been doing that for many years. Tasmania wants their own team but for now, the arrangements remain. Both clubs have consistently attracted decent crowds especially Hawthorn.

Wollongong clearly struggles to support an NBL team

But the idea of having only one NBL team in NSW should be unacceptable to the NBL brass. So I think rebranding the Hawks, and slowly attempting to win over Sydney while keeping Wollongong the base, is worth a try

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McBlurter  
Two years ago

"SEM are a hybrid team. Playing games out of Knox and games from John Cain."

If the games were spit between Knox and Geelong Arena it would feel a lot different.

They're not a Hybrid team, they are still bound by defining their community links to SE Melbourne and they're selecting two venues for the same audience/fan base.

For all intents and purposes Knox, Dandenong, Nunawading and (maybe?) Sandringham and Frankston

It is also explicitly NOT Coburg or Geelong.

The tribalism is 'us' vs 'not us'.

A team in Wollongong, Canberra and a district/region of Sydney is going to find it hard to define who the 'us' is, who is the tribe.

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Anonymightymouse  
Two years ago

SEM are not a hybrid team. The two venues are both in Melbourne and it's a 30-40 minute drive from one venue to the next to see a game. That's a pretty short trip in Melbourne.

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LV  
Two years ago

For people who live in Narre Warren, Pakenham, Cranbourne, Clyde (growing outer areas) Knox is within arms reach but getting to JCA very different

As I said, "Southern Hawks" based in Wollongong is similar to Geelong based in Geelong

Geelong has been playing games at the MCG forever and has a substantial fan base in Melbourne. Hawks could aim for similar

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Anonymightymouse  
Two years ago

No, it's not a split club. I've lived further out than all those places and central Melbourne is not a difficult trip to get to a basketball game. People have travelled from outer suburbs to basketball games at Melbourne Park for decades and decades.

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KET  
Two years ago

Yeah I wouldn't be going the Canberra route, maybe a Cannons team in the future will be there anyway.

NBL wants a second Sydney team, and the Hawks could continue their role as the challenger NSW team rather than shoe-horning a third team in.

In the same way we see Melbourne broadening their scope to Bendigo etc. I think it’s easier for the Hawks to re-frame without killing off or disengaging their Illawarra base too much.

They’d need to put some serious marketing capital in and change the narrative so that it’s not just another attempt to kill off the Illawarra name (like last time).

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LV  
Two years ago

It depends on your level of commitment. Both your interest in basketball and your family circumstances

As a parent, I can tell you that, I dont go to basketball half as much as I used to

I can also tell you that, for people in those outer areas, driving 15 or 20 minutes to a suburban stadium (with free parking?) would be a much more enticing proposition than driving an hour and then paying for parking.

Or 1.5 hours (3 hours round trip) via public transport, and driving to and from the train station if they want to reduce petrol, parking and toll expenses.

Casey is a fast growing area. Basketball is growing massively too. Phoenix would be running school programs out there. Having a stadium nearby is a massive incentive for the casual fan who might be interested enough to go to a game in Knox, but not interested enough to make the long haul to the CBD. Smart move by SEM

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NBLTigers  
Two years ago

It's pretty easy getting to JCA by public transport. Just park at a near by train station not far from the stadium which has parking.

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KET  
Two years ago

"As a parent, I can tell you that, I dont go to basketball half as much as I used to"

Out of interest, do you think the accessibility of every game on tv/streamed is a factor?

Obviously back in the day there would only be select games streams so going to the bball was probably more of a thing and more of a built in routine.

I get the feeling AFL suffers from this these days as well, sometimes it just better to have a chill night and watch at home.

I get the feeling different demographics need to be catered for: what's the optimal times for family bball during that holiday period when the parents just want something they can go and make sure the kids are entertained for a few hours and hopefully tired after.

When it’s not school holidays when is the optimal time to take advantage of your after work corporates or your young adults?

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LV  
Two years ago

Yes Kayo is absolutely a factor for me too.

I mean, $13.75 a month if you split with someone ($27.50 2 screens). That's the cost of a pint of quality beer at a nice pub.

And for that, I can watch any AFL or NBL game live, or delayed (ie after kids are in bed). Or on fast forward if I'm short on time, or want a less forensic viewing

I'm amazed at how well the AFL is doing keeping crowd numbers so high. Being a Winter sport played at mostly outdoor stadiums, in an era of suburban sprawl where people live further away from city centres and competing against streaming.

NBL is also doing well. And has competition. Spring racing, cricket, the December silly season where there's multiple Christmas events every week for friends/ kids schools/work/family/ church/insert organisation here/etc

The authentic face to face experience, the appeal of being there, the buzz of the crowd is still very culturally strong in Melbourne and this year proved covid didn't break it

But for me, in my stage of life, the convenience of Kayo and my comfy couch is tough to beat

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Reader  
Two years ago

South East Melbourne crowds seem to have improved? Well done to them. I feel for the United fans who have been served up some very poor and boring performances from their team so far.

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Anonymightymouse  
Two years ago


"NBL is also doing well. And has competition. Spring racing, cricket, the December silly season where there's multiple Christmas events every week for friends/ kids schools/work/family/ church/insert organisation here/etc"

Exceptionally well really. It's just a shame it can't seem to crack the TV market in terms of ratings, although that is definitely improving even if slowly.

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Derider  
Two years ago

If they fold the Hawks or move them to Canberra or whatever, I will never watch another game of NBL.

Reply #902638 | Report this post


Perthworld  
Two years ago

If they fold the Hawks or move them to Canberra or whatever, I will never watch another game of NBL.

If relocation happens will you streak at the first game like that Cannons fan did in Newcastle at Hunter Pirates opening night?

Reply #902640 | Report this post


proud  
Two years ago

Hawks are doing fine, they started more competitive than was expected and they've now faced some hurdles and are trying to learn from them on the fly. Sure the stadium needs to be massively upgraded though and a secondary income stream would be tremendous (like hotels or shops near the stadium).

Losing Illawarra would be a massive mistake as mentioned above multiple times the league continues to put them in unfavourable home scheduling and for this reason I think we need Darwin or Canberra too and spread the shit scheduling between more 'regional' sides... did we not have a Sydney vs Adelaide stand alone Friday game like a week or so ago...surely that should have been a double header.

All this talk about Tassie selling out and whatnot just makes me think the LK truly fucked up, if they made th stadium 10k capacity then we would get a true indication of the support the club has and most importantly you get the impression that more people outside of Hobart can attend their games but if they keep selling out then is it worth it for those up north to Even drive down and attempt to see a game.

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KET  
Two years ago

Who would have supplied the money to upgrade it double in size?!

There would have been a totally outcome to Tassie having a licence if the state gov was forced to cough up for a 10k stadium IMO.

Reply #902648 | Report this post


Dunkman  
Two years ago

Win stadium at Illawarra has restaurants, clubs, all with in a few minutes walk of the stadium. The problem is they are expensive and there is no parking. While it could do with a revamp the stadium is quite acceptable for spectators.

Reply #902655 | Report this post


WC95  
Two years ago

On TV, the Wollongong Entertainment Centre doesn't look that bad. Does it really need an upgrade? I know it's about 25yrs old, but it presents well on TV. And isn't it right on the beach too? I thought it's location was ideal, but I guess it's not.

The Hawks are the only club that hasn't improved on its crowds since the pre LK era, and they have always had a low base. I wouldn't blame the league if they wanted to relocate them to Darwin for a year to see if there's any improvement. Could be the end of them, but I think their time is nearing it's end anyway unfortunately.

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Anonymightymouse  
Two years ago

"Win stadium at Illawarra has restaurants, clubs, all with in a few minutes walk of the stadium."

He means owned by the club to generate extra revenue.

Reply #902659 | Report this post


Anonymightymouse  
Two years ago

The discussion around Tassie's stadium size missed the point that they simply refurbished an existing stadium, albeit a very rundown one that needed a lot of work. To increase the capacity would have required a huge amount of capital that wasn't available.

Reply #902660 | Report this post


Perthworld  
Two years ago

Meh, it's nothing new - 'proud' always has the weirdest takes.

Reply #902664 | Report this post


Dunkman  
Two years ago

Which clubs own own restaurants and clubs ?. The stadium is in an exceptional place except for parking, and it's ok internally, not great but fine.
Even the best run clubs struggle to show a profit though smith says kings do. Get Ball back in and let’s go from there.

Reply #902665 | Report this post


Perthworld  
Two years ago

Clubs don't even own their stadiums. "Hotels and shops" LOL.

Reply #902668 | Report this post


Anonymightymouse  
Two years ago

It's quite common for sports clubs in Australian across a lot of levels of sport to invest in secondary and tertiary revenue streams. Buying into hospitality is certainly a lot easier than owning your own stadium!!!

Reply #902669 | Report this post


Perthworld  
Two years ago

Not common at all for clubs in second tier leagues like NBL.

Yes, AFL and NRL have legacy supporter clubs which revolve around poker machines which drain their communities.

Australian professional sports teams are unsophisticated when it comes to investment, not even owing stadia.

Reply #902670 | Report this post


KET  
Two years ago

Although they're starting to divest from the pokies/hotels investments

Reply #902671 | Report this post


NBLTigers  
Two years ago

I think the Illawarra Hawks will be fine, it's just the silly NBL giving the Hawks Monday night games. Like the previous comment didn’t Sydney play Adelaide as the only stand alone game on Friday night?

Will get a true indication of Illawarra’s crowd this Saturday night when they host Melbourne United.

Reply #902672 | Report this post


Dunkman  
Two years ago

Illawarra teams have got to show fight, I'm not confident this side got much of this. Hawks got play D, it’s at stage where they are better going to old stagers like White and Coenrad early to see if they can lay a platform. Add Froling, Swani, Harvey and see how it goes. Mango been a major disappointment and Deng is a 10 minute bench guy, not starter.

Reply #902680 | Report this post


Anonymightymouse  
Two years ago

"Not common at all for clubs in second tier leagues like NBL."

Incorrect. Clubs at far lower levels of professionalism than the NBL invest in hospitality businesses to generate revenue. It's how many lower level football clubs bankroll their match payments.

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Perthworld  
Two years ago

Sure but I clearly said second tier leagues and not amateur community sporting clubs which are way down the totem pole.

Second tier examples include NBL, A-League, Super Rugby.

Reply #902705 | Report this post


Anonymightymouse  
Two years ago

So professional, semi-professional and amateur clubs can do it, but not NBL clubs? Gold.

It's a good idea to limit the financial roller-coaster that can come with crowds etc in down seasons, provided you can find the right business to invest in. Given the Hawks play in that strip, having a venue nearby to direct people to and from would make sense.

Reply #902721 | Report this post


Perthworld  
Two years ago

No, because unfortunately NBL clubs don't have the means to do so which is why the original comment, which triggered this tangent, about the Hawks not having "hotels or shops" was ridiculous and isn't helpful when they are merely trying to stay afloat.

Reply #902767 | Report this post


Anonymightymouse  
Two years ago

I think you need to have a look at the 'means' of NBL ownership groups.

In terms of staying afloat, if you don't invest in your business to generate revenue, you won't stay afloat, and history tells us the basketball side of the Hawks' business is not sufficient. Proud's suggestion is a good one.

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Perthworld  
Two years ago

I think it's you who needs to have a look at their means in tandem with the willingness of ownership groups to do so (current count: zero) - specifically the Hawks who aren't even bothering to sign decent players which is their core business function.

Psst! Hey every NBL club, want to be let in on a little secret? Buy hotels or shops and then you don't have to worry about crowd numbers!

Reply #902801 | Report this post


Anonymightymouse  
Two years ago

No, there don't need to be any NBL clubs investing in alternative revenue streams (I strongly doubt that's the case) to believe doing so is an excellent idea.

Reply #902804 | Report this post


Perthworld  
Two years ago

It's a fanciful idea.

Reply #902805 | Report this post


Anonymightymouse  
Two years ago

Given that sporting clubs at professional, state league and local level do it in this country, it's not fanciful. Proud's suggestion is a good one for Illawarra if they wish to stay in Wollongong.

Reply #902808 | Report this post


proud  
Two years ago

My point regarding Illawarra ownership is also tjat if you are a multi-millionaire owner of a regional sporting team in a blue collar town then (if you're financially capable) the best way to show that community that you are trying to put their best interests at heart should be to invest in the community and through those other businesses such as hotels or shops to use it to advertise the team, to drum up more supporr amongst the locals, to have your players frequent these parts and feel like they are also apart pf the community and mot just here until March when they may never be seen nor heard of again.

My point on the 10k stadium for Tasmania was that we dont know how much support the team truly has within the whole of Tasmania and not just within Hobart, a bigger stadium does afford those coming from elsewhere more scope to attend games. I hope in the long term that the powers that be see the popularity and what the Jackjumpers mean to Tasmania and they can negotiate increasing the capacity somehow.

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Dave Marshall  
Two years ago

Perthworld, did the Cannons guy streak? I thought he just brought a banner that said "the Pirates don't exist" or words to that effect. I knew it was coming, because he'd been openly planning it on the Cannons forum.

Owning the stadium would be a massive help for any club that could pull it off, because not only do you save on stadium hire but you get the revenue streams from concession sales. To give an example, when we were at the stage that we'd take any sort of hail mary to save the Pirates, Bluetongue Brewery came along and said they'd sponsor us if they could have the pourage rights at the NEC. No such luck - the NEC was owned by the state government, and they'd just signed a three-year deal for pourage rights with one of the major breweries.

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Perthworld  
Two years ago

Perthworld, did the Cannons guy streak? I thought he just brought a banner that said "the Pirates don't exist" or words to that effect. I knew it was coming, because he'd been openly planning it on the Cannons forum.

My memory is hazy on this one but didn't a disgruntled Cannons fan do something that warranted being escorted out by security? The broadcast deliberately avoided showing it however an incident was reported online.

Reply #903123 | Report this post


Dave Marshall  
Two years ago

Yeah, it was a full-on pitch invasion, there were at least two or three of them. Matt Shanahan called them tools, if I remember correctly. I lost my VHS recording of that game ages ago, sadly.

Reply #903125 | Report this post


Zodiac  
Two years ago

I remember a female topless streaker at a West Sydney Razorbacks or Sydney Spirit game.

Reply #903127 | Report this post


NBLTigers  
Two years ago

It was pretty bad what the Hunter owners did to the Cannons. The whole marine theme wasn't a good idea. It was failure from the beginning.

Reply #903131 | Report this post


Dave Marshall  
Two years ago

The Cannons were unfortunately done for no matter what happened. They'd gone from crisis to crisis since the end of 1998 and were chronically low on cash. At one point before the license was sold to the Pirates, the original Breakers owners were trying to buy the license - I think Cal Bruton stepped in at that point and vowed to keep them in Canberra, and then the Breakers bought a new license (which no doubt pleased the NBL - they also charged the Pirates a transfer fee for the Cannons' license, and I strongly suspect that was the only reason that the hideously underfunded Pirates were allowed to proceed).

Sadly the Hawks' situation over the past few years has reminded me of the Cannons' struggles. It's a real shame, but as I know all too well, finding a decent ownership group is not an easy task.

Reply #903134 | Report this post


NBLTigers  
Two years ago

Hopefully the Hawks get the right ownership. Their stadium was rocking on Saturday night in that double overtime match. NBL need to stop giving the Hawks Monday night games, simple.

I did find it strange that Hunter didn't take the Cannons history when they transferred their license. I can’t find any lists of past Cannons captains and Club MVP awards. The nbl website from 2004 to 2008 use to do year by year lists for every nbl club. I thought Cannons/Pirates were basically the same club. I could find the Pirates short year by year list, but no Cannons history which sucks.

Victoria Giants page from 2004 has got history from Titans/Magic, Giants, Saints and Spectres.

Reply #903138 | Report this post


Dave Marshall  
Two years ago

The Pirates only kept two things from the Cannons - the license and the Polly Parrot mascot suit.

Reply #903139 | Report this post


Perthworld  
Two years ago

Yeah, it was a full-on pitch invasion, there were at least two or three of them. Matt Shanahan called them tools, if I remember correctly. I lost my VHS recording of that game ages ago, sadly.

That's right, now I remember.
I remember a female topless streaker at a West Sydney Razorbacks or Sydney Spirit game.

This is what I was confusing it with.

Reply #903141 | Report this post


NBLTigers  
Two years ago

That was one of Hunter's major downfalls, if your going to take their licence then at least honour the Cannons rich history. Hunter had a decent team in their last 2 seasons plus if you consider the licence change to Singapore they still finished in 8th with all those’s major changes going on.

Really hope the nbl resurrect the Cannons so much history which was lost be great for it to come back.

Reply #903142 | Report this post




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