Anonymous
Two months ago

Bogut’s Side of The Simmons Story

Bogut just dropped his tell all on Simmons, what's everyone’s thoughts? Seems that BA did make some mistakes, however the big takeaways were the politics of it all between Simmons’ camp, the Vic Gov and Fed Gov. Also while Bogut said Lemanis made some mistakes (not picking Ben in 2014) he was tremendous throughout this whole experience in terms of putting up with all the stuff going on and to be faced with a situation where you could be responsible where millions of dollars would not go to junior grass roots is tough. Seems like BA ultimately got caught in the middle with all the politics with ultimately getting pressured into letting Simmons play the warmup games. Bogut however did say multiple times that BA can be and has been useless towards its players a lot of the time and even said in his opinion Simmons himself isn’t to be blamed the influence of his camp appeared to be all over this, right even to the point of someone contacting BA directly. Seems like a whole tone of bullshit going on and granted only one side of the story

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Zodiac  
Two months ago

Bogut can drop what he likes this is a guy who promoted the absolute batshit insane Pizzagate conspiracy theory, I wouldn't ask the guy for his opinion on the weather.

Reply #858465 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

And now sluggate...

Reply #858469 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

BA politics may not be perfect but surely unless there's mafia stuff going on you look past it to play for your country in the Olympics.

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Anonymous  
Two months ago

Stuff about the vic government is mostly bs, they pledged and gave money long before those games.

Reply #858482 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

What I took from the Bogut spiel is that Simmons is a precious cupcake.

Say what you want about Boges, but I actually think it was a good deep dive that explains Simmons' sentiment towards representing Australia.

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X  
Two months ago

Bogut isn't as smart as he thinks he is.

Reply #858503 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

I'd be very happy if he was in our Olympic team.

Reply #858506 | Report this post


Bullets  
Two months ago

Can we have a link to this or is it on the Rogue Bogues podcast?

Reply #858509 | Report this post


Ben  
Two months ago

You'll need to listen to the pod that dropped today.

Fwiw Bogey presented the story plainly with no sentiment. Up to the listener to come to their own interpretation on the matter.

Reply #858516 | Report this post


rjd  
Two months ago

Very interesting story. Makes Ben Simmons appear like he is pushed around by his agency/family. Indicates that Simmons is easily controlled. It appears he puts himself on his own island. No contact with other players. (I wonder if he is even still friends with Exum.) Shows the good character of Lemanis in prioritising grassroots funding instead of his own job when confronted with being blackmailed by the Victorian government. Demonstrates BA ineptitude in repairing relationships. Consistent with Bogut's no-nonsense attitude to want Simmons out of the preparation games if he isn't committed to the World Cup. Also the rest of the senior core group, that they understandably rejected the idea of Simmons playing in only the Melbourne preparation games. And makes the Victorian Government appear outright evil.

Worth listening to this story.

Reply #858533 | Report this post


koberulz  
Two months ago

How do we listen to any of this, exactly?

Reply #858535 | Report this post


Another Anon  
Two months ago

Think it's obvious Simmons is controlled by his family. His agent is family, stories of his off season being run by uncle instead of the club....
All adds up.

Reply #858550 | Report this post


Alpha  
Two months ago

Podcast - Rogue Bogues by Andrew Bogut, hope the link will work

https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/rogue-bogues-by-andrew-bogut/id1541789772?i=1000527814971

Reply #858552 | Report this post


Luuuc  
Two months ago

Also here:

Reply #858554 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

Bogut says David Patrick hired to NT at request of Klutch Sports.

Reply #858555 | Report this post


koberulz  
Two months ago

At what point in those two hours? I have zero desire to listen to the entire thing.

Reply #858559 | Report this post


ME  
Two months ago

Sounds like a lot of fuckery and games being played between Ben, Ben's management and the Boomers.

I think it is fair to say Basketball Australia probably didn't do a great job recruiting Ben in the early days. Yes, they should have kept in touch and dropped in on him when he toured Victoria with LSU. I don't think he should have been just gifted a Boomers spot in 2014, but there is every reason to believe BA dropped the ball creating a relationship with him. Shit, I actually knew Mattise Thybulle was qualified to play for us way back in 2019 before anything had come out of BA about it. It seems like they're not always on the ball about who their best prospects are and who actually falls under their guise.

Anyway, I don't think Basketball Australia's ineptitude in this area justifies everything that has happened since.

You look at the whole World Cup thing, and there really was no valid reason for him to pull out. It is basically the same reason he's giving us this time, "yada yada yada, I have to work on my game." His game remains the same, and will remain the same I guarantee it.

Whether you blame Ben's agents or not, there has been a constant dance with Basketball Australia. Now that BA actually know what they could have in Ben, they've jumped every hoop, from hiring and firing coaches, to potentially even upending Australia's preparation to fir him into the USA warm up games. None have worked. He's been healthy at each major tournament of the past two years and he's appeared at none.

Victoria putting the hard word on the Boomers is beyond disgusting but I'd expect nothing less from their government.

As for Ben, sounds like in the end he just disappeared. He was at training for two training days, everything signed, sealed and delivered for him to play, then when it came time for confirmation nothing came of it, and Ben fluttered away.

Now you can blame his agents if you like, but his inability to contact the team and say anything solid falls directly on him when all is said and done. Ben is a grown man. His agents WORK FOR HIM. So I wont really be hearing any excuses about why he wasn't in contact.

Then we have the latest saga. It makes me wonder, did Ben ever actually contact the Boomers to say he wasn't playing or Brian Goorjian have to make that call himself after silence and evasiveness from Ben and his management?

Either way, I think the days of courting Ben Simmons should be over. The national team is either something he wants to do, or doesn't. I don't think we can afford to have governments basically extort us into playing him or not playing him, contracts hanging over our heads that we never signed, and the like.

Invite him to the camps. If she shows up, wonderful, he's in. If he doesn't, we have to move on.

As for anyone comparing this to Giddey, I don't see any correlation. I don't think Giddey is nearly as precious as Simmons has proven to be, and I think the relationship between him and Basketball Australia is probably much better than what it is with Ben. The stakes also aren't quite the same either.

Reply #858562 | Report this post


rjd  
Two months ago

Approx 1:12:45 onwards, koberulz.

Reply #858565 | Report this post


koberulz  
Two months ago

So the short version is that Ben Simmons is a colossal bitch.

Reply #858568 | Report this post


ME  
Two months ago

"So the short version is that Ben Simmons is a colossal bitch."

Pretty much. I know outwardly Goorj and Mills are supporting him but privately they'd all think he's a dick

Reply #858569 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

Bogut's story feels incomplete though.

He said the Vic Govt. threatened to withdraw funding if the Boomers didn't let Simmons play in the exhibitions.

Lemanis/Boomers agree to let him play, but they don't hear back from Simmons' camp as to whether he agrees.

Simmons is then at Day 1 of the training camp, but doesn't attend the rest and by inference won't be playing in the exhibition games.

Vic Govt. provides funding anyway.

I'm guessing the gap is Simmons realised it was for the best not to participate, and withdrew from the sponsorship deal with Vic Govt? Hence Vic Govt. didn't withdraw funding.

Reply #858574 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

Or maybe the Victorian government thought twice when they saw the Boomers bend over backwards to get Ben to play, and then have Ben come out with the Crown casino accusations when he's meant to promote Victorian tourism. Might have even voided their deal?

Reply #858582 | Report this post


Nostraballmus  
Two months ago

I watched the press conferences for the quality tournament finals. Listening to Satoransky talk about his dream to play in the Olympics as a kid, Luka the same. Olympics even more than the NBA. Respect to Ben, his carefully stage managed journey has always been about the nba and nba only. Any national team participation seems to been filtered through 'how does this help me get to nba' and no different now. Perhaps as national team play was never a thing for his minders, you can understand it.

It’s ok, he just doesn’t want to play for the Boomers. There are plenty that do.

Reply #858595 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

Fair enough, but stop this dance of "I will play, I won't play." Just come out and say you're out and never intend to play for Australia.

Probably doesn't want to do that as knows it will hurt his marketability.

Reply #858597 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

I understand agents can be really slimy hence the advertisement of as if he'll play only to do the bare minimum for the cheque to come in, but it makes me wonder about Simmons as a person.

If he doesn’t want to play that’s fine but don’t act like you would even if it’s just for the money ultimately. Sure there are excuses some of which are valid in terms of him not playing, but I wonder in general just about his character. To me it’s either he’s another slime ball who’s just after the money (which no one would blame him if he was at least honest) or (what I’m more leaning towards) is he’s an introverted kid who’s basically been told what to do his whole life by his inner circle (whether it be family or his agent).

I don’t doubt he’s upset at not being picked and BA’s no attempt to stay in contact with him so I get why he’d be pissed off at Lemanis and BA, but to drag the other players and their WC prep along with fans and junior grass roots into it seems pretty shitty.

It’s quotes like Danny Greens one recently and the stories of the Sixers picking a shooting coach for him to only be scrapped by his agency, and other journos sayings he’s an introvert really rings a bell with what Bogut said in terms of him being there one day and not the next without communicating to anyone. The other thing that Bogut kept repeating was how he doesn’t think Ben himself is to blame, which strikes me as Ben the person is fine to deal with when he’s alone, but the moment his inner circle gets involved it seems to become a shit show every time as he’s got all sorts of people in his ear telling him what to do and ultimately are only fussed with the money and probably the percentage of it that they get.

I know he’s still young and has time to play for the boomers, but I seriously get the impression unless he grows a backbone or changes who’s in his inner circle, then we won’t be seeing him play for the boomers ever.

Reply #858599 | Report this post


Anon  
Two months ago

Hope he's enjoying working on his game, with the chick at Wimbledon. What a joke, there is no excuse, agents this, BA that.
It's about representing your country.

This guy is only interested in gold chains and poontang.

Reply #858603 | Report this post


ME  
Two months ago

Well playing for the Boomers isn't necessarily profitable. It's something you have to want to do. Every time Ben has looked like he's on the cusp of playing there has been some deal tied to it, whether with the Victorian government, or four and twenty pies.

I don't really care about his agents and handlers, it comes down to Ben. He's a grown man now. He either wants to play or he doesn't. If he's so easily dissuaded then his passion isn't where it needs to be and he needs to stop toying with the national team.

And today, yet another photo pops up of him on another date with this Maya bird. Yeah, it's his off-season. Yes he has every right to go on dates and do what he wants to do. But what no one is seeing is videos of this "work" he's meant to be putting in on his game.

In a month's time the Olympics will be over. In a few months he will be back on court.If he hasn't made major strides in his game, no one, not Boomers fans, and not NBA fans, will be happy with him. This "working on his game" stuff isn't just an expectation of Australians but of everyone who watches basketball. He's being paid 200 million dollars a year to work 7 months and put the ball in a ring. The more people keep seeing his lack of dedication towards those ends, the more he will be rightfully disliked for it.

I think Ben is a lost cause on a few fronts. He's a lost cause to the Boomers and a lost cause to the NBA. Yes, he will continue to "play well" within his skill set through the regular season, and will be an All Star again. And that's all great. But when the money is on the line he's going to continue to fall short because he lacks the killer instinct and drive that the truly great players have.

Reply #858604 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

This is Boguts way of grabbing headlines and crapping on vic government. Look how many articles are out now quoting him saying the government threatened ba team. It isn't about Simmons.
This guy is a Victorian who has a real hatred towRds the state for some reason since he came home. Now in Sydney, owning part of Sydney kings and follows all,the media that crap on Victoria. Maybe someone knows the real reason . if you follow him on Twitter or his podcast , every story involves vic politics in some way. The truth is the vic government payed all that money overtime, and atleast 40 mill before knowing Ben was bever over here. I think bogues is talkin crap again... I think he just added that part in.

As for Ben his handlers, the casino incident, the lemanis effect, the poor ba communication, the pressure, his attitude etc are just some of the reasons Ben hasn’t put the green and gold on.

Reply #858609 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

Would love to know what happened between vic and Bogut that his constantly talkin crap,about the state and praising nsw but then when quiet the last 2 weeks for some reason...

Reply #858610 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

Bogut seems like 2 different people these days.

Reply #858612 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

I listened to his sluggate podcast, lol I dont think he's ever been to dandenong. The dirtiest city in vic.
I’m not surprised they found slugs, rats, mice and insects in the warehouse.

Reply #858613 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

Apart from growing up in Dandenong of course!

Reply #858615 | Report this post


Nostraballmus  
Two months ago

Well made points as always ME. I think perhaps Ben is also a bit burnt out hy the whole thing. You know everything in his life has been the push to get to the NBA, for him and heavily those around him. I reckon he's probably a bit over it and doesnt want to work hard wants to hang out, have some fun now, be a young man. That's all good. As per Anon's, just own it, stop the charade.

I for one don't think a Boomers singlet should be cheapened by any player picking and choosing if and when to wear it. The door should now be closed for mine.

As for Bogie, maybe he still carries beef with Vic over not being picked for that state side in under 16's....

Reply #858616 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

Bogut like Maradona are really good at one thing, their sport, I loved watching both. I learned that as soon as they open their mouth to not listen.

Simmons is for Simmons, it's how all real wealthy people behave these days, I don’t like it but it’s his choice. As others have said just be up front and don’t say you are in when you know you don’t want to be there.

Reply #858617 | Report this post


ME  
Two months ago

Bogut disagrees with the Victorian lock downs and the far-left stances the government tends to take on things. I don't think his gripes with them is any deeper than that.

Reply #858627 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

And nsw?
It's deeper than the andrews government and leftie views, whatever that means these days.

Reply #858628 | Report this post


Isaac  
Two months ago

And today, yet another photo pops up of him on another date with this Maya bird. Yeah, it's his off-season. Yes he has every right to go on dates and do what he wants to do. But what no one is seeing is videos of this "work" he's meant to be putting in on his game.
One event is in public. Another would be in private. He didn't take or provide the photo. He's played dozens of basketball games under significant pressure and then looks to take a couple of weeks off. He might've had professional advice like "Take a bit of time. Don't touch a basketball, just clear your head. Then we'll start a new program mid-July."

If he's spotted with a female celebrity: "So typical."
If with an unknown female: "Can't even get celebrity ass any more."
With male friends: "Only cares about hanging with his entourage."
With family: "Typical. He's so coddled."
Alone: "Not even his family want to be seen with him now."

And when there has been video of him training, he gets rubbished for only putting up shots in training, or beasting on lowly scrimmage fodder or whatever else. "Look, they're putting out videos trying to pretend he's doing real shooting practice now." Write him off now and chill. Or give him the off-season. If he's no better in subsequent seasons, accept (then or now) that his disposition works against him like ours do for us and our foibles. Hell, right now I'm procrastinating. I'm GOAT-tier at procrastinating. I procrastinate by reading research on procrastinating. I'd get the yips on a court. I'd definitely say "I'm taking a break for a few weeks before I think about basketball again."

It wouldn't surprise me if Mills wasn't still privately supportive. He might wish they had Simmons with them, but I don't know that he'd trash him behind his back. Maybe, but I just can't remember him ever setting a foot wrong. Each year, I have more respect for him.

There was a story today about how Durant couldn't be convinced to ignore lame Twitter debates. One of the best players in the world, nothing to want for, and he just can't not create fake accounts to make sure he's mentioned in random top-five all-time talks or whatever. So he's getting distracted despite being one of the best. Imagine that, but for Simmons' post play-offs. I'd take some time off too.

Reply #858635 | Report this post


ME  
Two months ago

Fair argument Isaac. I just think given Ben's history with the Boomers it's hard not to be irritated

Reply #858639 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

Isaac "goat level procrastinator" Foreman.

Driving around in his Ferrari instead of working, just like Ben Simmons.

Reply #858640 | Report this post


LV  
Two months ago

Fair points Isaac.

I don't have any problem whatsoever with Simmons enjoying Wimbledon with his new girlfriend after a long season. Good on him.

But the frustration stems from the long history and the patterns. The pulling out of the 2019 World Cup, the constant changes of mind, the taking over a week after playoffs to make up his mind and properly inform Goorjian when he was already in London.

Reply #858643 | Report this post


Isaac  
Two months ago

ME - no issue with being frustrated or disappointed. Or not expecting him to be there despite noises to the contrary. Mostly contrasting the reaction to mental health withdrawal of Broekhoff, and the likelihood the same is a factor for Simmons. The media runs stories about the Wimbledon girlfriend to get everyone fired up, and the bait is predictably taken. See new thread just posted.

Anon - the Ferrari doesn't drive itself!

Reply #858654 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

Not wrong about Mills, either, Isaac. Class act. And despite the talent in the pipeline, if Simmons isn't there in 2024, who's our best player? I can see Patty looking that far ahead and wanting to do anything he can to keep open the possibility that Simmons will suit up one day.

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Anonymous  
Two months ago

2024 - Paris olympics possibilities

88 6'0 P.Mills CG - only one born before 90 fit enough you'd think, 35y.o Paris
92 6’0 B.Cotton CG*
93 6’1 M.Norton PG
92 6’2 M.Mccarron CG
97 6’3 D.Vasljevic SG
92 6’5 M.Creek SF
94 6’5 S.Dech SG
97 6’5 M.Thybulle G/F*
98 6’5 W.Mcdowell-White PG
00 6’5 J.Green G/F
02 6’5 M.King SG
95 6’6 D.Exum G/F
03 6’6 D.Daniels G/F
95 6’8 X.Cooks CF
96 6’8 J.Mcveigh CF
97 6’8 J.White CF
01 6’8 L.Travers CF
02 6’8 J.Giddey PG
92 6’9 N.Kay PF
96 6’10 B.Simmons PG/PF
96 6’10 J.Bolden PF
97 6’10 J.Hunter C
98 6’10 W.Magnay PF/C
95 6’11 J.Landale PF/C
96 6’11 D.Reath PF/C
98 6’11 I.Humphries PF/C
00 6’11 M.Maker PF
97 7’0 T.Maker PF/C
00 7’0 S.Froling C

*Naturalised

Might of missed a few...


born in 90 like Delly, Sobey, Broekhoff, Motum are not going to make to Paris at 34 imo,

Reply #858670 | Report this post


Nostraballmus  
Two months ago

Enough about Simmo allready. Let's move on.

Anyone checked in on Giddey ? Keen to be a Boomer but didn't make the cut. I hope he isn't disenchanted with the questionable? ommission for Sobey. Am a big Sobey fan and happy that he's been selected, but I'm not sure he'll play much and thus not sure what he brings over and above potential X factor Giddey and the investment in future engagement with the Boomers programme we may have gotten with taking him this time.

Spain started a 17 year old Ricky Rubio in an Olympic final v the USA in 2008. Gidds not at that level ??

Reply #858676 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

He is nowhere near ready. The end.

Reply #858677 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

Giddey was never going to the Olympics. The NBA draft was his priority.

Reply #858684 | Report this post


koberulz  
Two months ago

The difference between Simmons and Broekhoff is that Broekhoff doesn't have a history of fucking people around, has put in time with the national team previously, and made a clear and immediate announcement.

Reply #858698 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

Some observations from a Kiwi perspective:

- There are similarities to Steven Adams who also plays similar mins games with the national team then inevitably doesn't commit.
- Adams and his entourage trash Basketball New Zealand and for not covering his costs to play in junior National teams (even though he played, from memory, for the NZ U16 in a 3 game series in Brisbane and Basketball NZ can barely afford to cover the costs of its men’s National teams let alone juniors).
- The problem isn’t Adams or Simmons, it’s their advisors. This won’t change anytime soon. Focus on the best players that actually want to play. Celebrate the likes of Mills and Ingles and others who continue to represent Australia with pride. I’ll be cheering them on and I think it was lack of depth and fatigue that screwed them in the WCs and Australia is has depth to be a real medal contender this time round.
- Don’t get rid of the Coach and upend the programme for one player. For all his shortcomings recently with Brisbane, Lemanis had that Boomers team rolling.

Reply #858974 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

Adams has a genuine issue with nz basketball if you look deeper.
He did the right thing.

Reply #858977 | Report this post


EssenX  
Two months ago

Adams' grievances are exaggerated. He still benefited by playing in BBNZ tournaments. The people with whom he may have had an issue are long gone and there are others who assisted his journey. But at the end of the day, BBNZ funded no juniors at that time, including Adams. The $ involved in elite junior sport are sadly high, but Adams is not the only one affected by that.

He is doing some good with his camps, but he doesn't appreciate that national team performance affects funding and exposure for the sport greatly in NZ. If it wasn't for the 02 WC, we don't have the Breakers and the subsequent tournaments that the Tall Blacks participated in that greatly lifted participation. His participation would mean better results in the WC, possibly Olympic qualification, and overall more funds and exposure for the sport. He could then use that platform to criticise the sports funding model in NZ, the inequities therein, and how he'd like sports bodies to change. Instead, he's outside the tent just pissing on it.

Reply #859033 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Two months ago

Yea Bogut is just some right wing nut tbh.
Who loves them conspiracy theories.

Pushed Pizzagate.
Anti Vax
Anti closing lockdown

Anyone believing his sh*t are as gullible as him

Reply #860655 | Report this post




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