Years ago

Who should be in the Boomers 12 for Spain?

So who should be in the final 12 for Spain ahead of Monday morning's announcement?

This is what we came up with at PnR in our "Three in the key" round table:

Three in the Key: Selecting the Boomers for the 2014 FIBA World Cup

Unfortunately we have Broekhoff once again pegged as the last man cut, just like he was for London 2012.

Topic #34991 | Report this topic

Years ago

Like the team LC! think it should be on the money

I have

Baynes Jawai
Andersen Bairstow Motum
Ingles Simmons
Goulding Newley or Broekhoff
Delly Exum Martin

comes down to Newley or Broekhoff,whoever performs in camp better, -which player is hitting their the open shots consistently, that has been Newleys biggest weakness in a boomers uniform and the Boomers will no doubt need to be able to stretch the floor and hit open shots

Reply #484814 | Report this post

Years ago

I am inclined to think Lemanis might want to play Simmons more than just garbage minutes though, given his meteoric rise over the last couple of years into an extremely talented and versatile player and the fact he has added considerable size to his frame

Reply #484815 | Report this post

Years ago

The best team would be


However they would probably need another pg so i'd probably have to swap Broekhoff with Martin.

Reply #484817 | Report this post

Years ago

Am I the only one who thinks that Simmons is gong to be able contribute more to this team than Exum?

Reply #484819 | Report this post

Years ago

1.PG Dellavedova 6'4
2.PG / 3.SG Exum 6'6
3.PG Martin 6'1
1.SG / 2.SF Ingles 6'8
2.SG Goulding 6'4
1.SF / 3.PF Simmons 6'9
3.SG / 3.SF Newley 6'7
1.PF / 3.C Anderson 7'0
2.PF / 4.C Bairstow 6'10
1.C / 3.PF Baynes 6'10
2.C Jawai 6'10

1 of Broekhoff 6'7 SG/SF or Motum 6'10 PF

Reply #484820 | Report this post

Years ago


Then whoever. There really isnt a consistent knock down shooter available and thats going to make it really hard to compete again.

Please no Anderson. We need to be looking forward.

Id be using this as a stepping stone to Rio.

Reply #484824 | Report this post

Years ago

And if Damian Martin or Adam Gibson are on this team over a more versatile option with upside and legit international talent i will be stumped again.

why does everyone keep saying Martin has improved his shooting. Look at his numbers from last year. horrible.

Reply #484825 | Report this post

Years ago

martins numbers were 44 FG% / 42 3PT% / 61 FT%

Reply #484828 | Report this post

Years ago



Damian Martin could make it but I think Delly will play major minutes so doesn't need two backups imo.
We look solid in the wing positions. Whilst some might be against Andersen playing as we look to Rio I still think he has one more tournament left in him. He can shoot the three and play as a centre if needed.
Plus he beats Worthington hands down.

Reply #484829 | Report this post

Years ago

What about Maker? I thought we wanted to 'blood' him before the US try to?

Reply #484833 | Report this post

Years ago

Mick - "why does everyone keep saying Martin has improved his shooting. Look at his numbers from last year. horrible."

44.4 FG% and 42.1% from three. That's horrible to you?

Reply #484834 | Report this post

Years ago

Maker is not ready for this level, even if he is already 7'. He would be pushed around far too much, and in any case he is not part of the squad.

Maker has said he would make himself available for U19 World's next year.

Reply #484841 | Report this post

Years ago

Great article LC. The arguments are well made. That team is solid.

I also think Broekhoff might be unlucky again. He is up against Newley in a swingman role, or Motum as a scoring forward, but is likely to lose out in both roles.

I thought Motum might be up against Andersen for a spot on the team, but you make a good point about the value of having another scorer and also about that extra big as insurance if Jawai is not fit or Jawai and Baynes follow their foul-prone reputation.

As for the 3rd point guard as has been traditional in Boomers teams since Goorjian, I wonder, if Delly goes down, we are basically goners. In that case, our tournament would be in tatters and we may as well throw Exum into the deep end for experience, using Ingles as a backup point. So perhaps sacrifice that 3rd PG for another shooter, and let Broekhoff in the team. ;-) (Of course, this assumes that Exum's form warrants being the primary backup PG).

Reply #484846 | Report this post

Years ago

Cant we just have Maker as the 12th man. Next to zero court time apart from junk time and get him into the Boomers early like we did with Patty.

Reply #484849 | Report this post

Years ago

I think the Boomers team in the article is right on the money.. Despite the lack of Patty, I think it is going to be a very good team that could find itself deep in the tournament if the chemistry is right

Reply #484852 | Report this post

Years ago

Great article LC, it was good to incorporate multiple views, even if ending with the same team.

It would make a great topic for an extended podcast/conversation.

Reply #484856 | Report this post

Years ago

Thanks for the feedback.

We all felt bad for leaving Broekhoff out as he can offer something to the team, and not just his shooting.

Reply #484862 | Report this post

Years ago

Surprised at the comments on Andersen. He is a 3 time Euroleague champion, with NBA experience, who is still sought after by top European club and was a key part of the boomers offence at the last Olympics.

He won league MVP in Italy 2011/12 and Turkey 2012/13.

He is the only post scorer in the squad and the 2nd best 3pt shooter. He is in better shape now then the last 3 seasons.

The guy can play. Instead of using his age as a point of criticism he should be praised for still being so good despite his age.

This is the World Cup not the youyi games, they should pick the best players available and Andersen one of them.

Also he is a 5. He hasn't played 4 on any team since the NBA.

Reply #484870 | Report this post

Years ago

Judging from the past boomers squads for the Olympics and World Champs they normally pick starters and backups for each position then include a comb forward and an extra shooter.

I think the makeup of this squad reflects which positions they are undecided about.

Normally Worthington was a lock for the combo forward spot but this squad contains 3 of them including Worthington. Plus with Motum's play during the China series and the Summer league makes it very hard to leave him out of the squad. In these series Motum has displayed the quickness and range for the position plus the ability to stay in front of smaller player like Worthington has been so good at for the boomers.

*side note - watched the China series this year and this morning watched the Greece series from 2012 noticed that Worthington gets his shots blocked a lot in international games.

Besides Goulding the only specialist 3pt shooter is Broekhoff. Goulding shot 50% from 3pt line in summer league and to my surprise showed that he is no defensive liability at that level. That probability gives him the starting 2 guard spot given that boomers squads have recently struggled on offence. Will the boomers coaches still want an off the bench shooter? If so Broekhoff is the only option.

Full disclosure, I am a Wildcats supporter. I love Damien Martin, he is my captain. But defence has not been a deficiency for boomers squads of the last decade and a half. Defence and effort play is what Australian players are known for around the world (just listen to the NBA commentators). Gibson showed last year against China that he can run a team if he is allowed to play point guard (it frustrates me that Gold Coast and Adelaide move him to the 2). His defence is very good and he is much better on offence then Martin. The boomers need offence.

Lastly with no rim protector in this squad I don't see how they leave Jawai out of the team. If healthy Jawai can be incredible. If healthy he is the boomers missing piece.

Reply #484880 | Report this post

Years ago

Im liking:

Baynes Nevill
Andersen Bairstow Garlepp
Jingles Simmons Walker
Goulding Newley
Delly Exum

Reply #484893 | Report this post

Years ago

"I think the Boomers team in the article is right on the money.. Despite the lack of Patty, I think it is going to be a very good team that could find itself deep in the tournament if the chemistry is right"

Agreed. I think this will be our strongest team in a while. It's just a shame that Patty and Bogut couldn't be a part of it.

"Am I the only one who thinks that Simmons is gong to be able contribute more to this team than Exum?"

I think both will be able to contribute a fair bit. I just hope that they aren't used as 11/12th man, playing 2 minutes again. Especially if guys like Martin/Gibson are playing over them.

Reply #484903 | Report this post

Years ago

Excellent article, LC.

Reply #484913 | Report this post

Years ago

I think your article is on the money LC. Like you, I'd like to try and get Broekhoff into the team for that extra shooting, but also for his extra length and rebounding. I think he is fighting it out with Martin, Simmons and perhaps Bairstow or Jawai for the final spot. I think who makes it comes down to who performs in training camp and how Lemanis wants to play.

It looks to me like we are going to play small and press wherever possible (see Ingles comments, China series and Lemanis' Breakers teams) so I think that makes Motum extremely important and if he performs in training camp I could actually see him starting/ playing big minutes.

If that happens, then you have to question whether we need all of Andersen, Baynes, Jawai and Bairstow, who are all a little slow and best suited to play centre IMO. I think Baynes and Andersen are locks, but depending on how Jawai and Bairstow perform, you could possibly leave one of them out to create a spot for Broekhoff, whilst still having room for Simmons and Martin.

So, in that scenario, you could go with a lineup of:

Baynes Andersen Jawai or Bairstow
Motum Simmons
Ingles Newley
Goulding Broekhoff
Delly Exum Martin

The risk there IMO is Motum's inexperience at international level. Lemanis would have to be very sure that Motum was ready to play a pivotal role. If he isn't then you are quickly putting a lot of pressure on Simmons, which he probably isn't ready for.

However, there are a few advantages with this lineup:
1) You are developing a style of play for the Boomers that will suit its personnel more and more as players like Simmons, Exum and Maker come to the fore in future years.
2) It allows you to keep Martin, a player whose skill-set and experience would be very valuable to this team if we are going to press a lot.
3) It allows you to keep Simmons on the team and gaining experience for a role that I think he is predestined to excel at in a couple of years.
4) It allows you to get Broekhoff into the team for his shooting, rebouding and extra length to disrupt passing lanes.

So while I'm not saying this is the team Lemanis will go with, I think it has some interesting possibilities to take advantage of the strengths of our personnel, both for this tournament and for the future.

Reply #484915 | Report this post

Years ago

I do agree we need to concentrate on offence. Broekhoff might deserve a shot in this. I dso Hope Newley is back to his best.. I feel like Europe turned him to shit.

Reply #484916 | Report this post

Years ago

I don't think Broekhoff should get in over Bairstow or Jawai. They should be locks.

I hope Exum gets more minutes than Newley.

Reply #484918 | Report this post

Years ago

My guess is Exum will get around 15mpg.

Based on LC's squad it could look like this:

Dellavedova (25), Exum(10), Martin(5)
Goulding(20),Newley(15),Exum (5)
Bairstow (20),Andersen(10),Motum(10)
Baynes(20),Jawai(15),Andersen (5)

Just a wild guess matchups and blowouts will alter those minutes.
In blowouts you would throw more minutes at Simmons and Exum

Reply #484921 | Report this post

Years ago

Thanks Beantown. Love your thoughts on the possible makeup.

Spot on about blowouts Steven - I'm hoping we get a couple of those ;)

Reply #484924 | Report this post

Years ago

Fair point above about Andersen often playing the 5 spot. He has often played the 5 for the Boomers, but has also previously tended to get minutes at the 4 alongside our most dominant 5, Bogut. At this stage of his career, does he have the mobility to play the 4?

Reply #484946 | Report this post

Years ago

Here's what I've heard from a couple of different people about the camp.

Bairstow has been absolutely super and looks sure to play a major role.

Walker has had a really good camp and he and Wortho seemed to be battling for that mobile PF spot with Motum struggling a little.

Exum and Simmons haven't done a lot, suggesting if picked (which I think Exum will) it will be more for development than to play significant roles.

Angus Brandt has been impressive but perhaps not quite enough to knock out a big name.

Jawai has been doing some good things but his fitness remains a bit of an issue.

Both Martin and Gibson have played well but it could be a toss of the coin between the two of them.

Going on that it could look something like:

Bairstow/Wortho or Walker
Newley/Broekhoff or Simmons
Delly/Martin or Gibson

I guess we'll find out tomorrow!

Reply #484969 | Report this post

Years ago

^ Ingles in the proper position at sg.
Not sure about Anderson at centre, at least starting wise.
Wortho over walker plz. Pretty crazy how motum has not been a factor when he's just been invited to the jazz training camp.

Reply #484975 | Report this post

Years ago

There's not too much question about Motum's offence, if he doesn't get picked it will be the other end where he just hasn't developed his game yet.

You can't take someone to the WCs in a key role (which mobile PF is) if they can't defend.

Reply #484976 | Report this post

Years ago

With Simmons tweeting he wasn't picked, it looks like a spot opens up for Broekhoff.

Reply #484978 | Report this post

Years ago

Thanks for the info Paul! Disappointed to hear Motum hasn't impressed defensively. He showed a bit more scrappiness on D in Summer League than I had previously seen in the China series, so I was hoping he might impress at training camp. Looks like we will see one of Walker or Wortho make the team in that mobile PF role.

Not good news about Jawai's fitness. If he isn't fully fit it isn't really good enough, considering how much time he's had to prepare. If Lemanis does plan to go small at the four, he could perhaps consider taking Motum instead of Jawai. That would give us a genuinely clever offensive big man as an alternative to Wortho or Walker should it be needed.

I noticed you have Andersen and Bairstow starting above there Paul. Do you see those two as complementing each other better than either combo with Baynes?

Also, any info on how much point guard Exum has been able to play in camp? Judging by Summer League, he needs the ball in his hands a lot to be effective at this stage.

Reply #484986 | Report this post

Years ago

Bear in mind it was just a couple of quick convos with people who were there, I didnt see a second of it.

I drew the conclusion re Motum because his offence is pretty good and I see him get a little lost defensively whenever I watch him.

With Jawai I think that means he will play burst roles as he does in club ball. With Baynes, Andersen, Bairstow and the mobile PF there I don't think that's an issue. Looking forward to seeing Nate play.

Yes, I think Bairstow's aggression as an interior PF and Andersen's smarts and shooting are a great combo that could be really tough to defend.

Reply #484987 | Report this post

Years ago

Without Simmons I hope we see this team;

Goulding, Newley.
Bairstow,Andersen Motum
Baynes and Jawai.

If Jawai doesn't make it they may go with Worthington and play Andersen at centre.

Reply #484991 | Report this post

Years ago

Can we still give oglivy a shot if jawai is not fit enough?

Reply #484993 | Report this post

Years ago

Or Neville...

Reply #484994 | Report this post

Years ago

Have to pick a team from a 20-man squad list provided to FIBA - we only know who 17 of those 20 players are.

With Simmons out, I can only now assume that Jawai and Motum are both in as I would not take Wortho.

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