Wow
Last year

Forestville U16G Penalised Points

I see Forestville's Div 2 girls team have been penalised nearly all of their points from the summer season, therefore knocking them out of grand final contention.
Anyone know why?
Seems a harsh penalty whatever it was for a group of 13 year olds !!

Topic #42741 | Report this topic


Anonymous  
Last year

My guess is they played someone without a clearance - probably the one that moved from Mavs.

Reply #673541 | Report this post


Wow  
Last year

Seems like a harsh penalty for what I'm guessing is an honest mistake !!

Reply #673546 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

Happened to Norwood Div 1 12 boys in winter last year, rules are there for a reason.

Reply #673547 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

It may have been an honest mistake, but as 547 says: it's a rule, and a very simple one to follow.

I don't know this was the case FWIW, but it wouldn't surprise me given the already-long list of oversights from Forestville's manager in his short tenure.

Reply #673556 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

The penalised girl was my sister, had no clue about it until the end of the season, very tough on that team

Reply #673598 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

Reply #673601 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

They cleared her but the paperwork got lost betweena change over of directors. Mavericks salty about losing a player it seems, very harsh to do something like that even if she wasn't cleared. Penalising a group of young girls out of spite is just pitiful and isn’t sportsmanship in the slightest

Reply #673602 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

Mavs have nothing to do with it, just took BSA this long (as with the Norwood U12 player) to find it and deal with it. Seems you might be the salty one.

Reply #673603 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

Considering the first round game was MAVs V FEBBC. Knowing all memebers on the board, some very closely , if there was a Clearance breach or problem on online I would have hoped one of them may have mentioned it before the end of the season or AT least after the first round...good luck finding coaches EASTERNHILL/MAVS ...... I hope this UPROAR in u16div 2 gave you all purpose in life you required to feel good about yourself. Because as far as I know a 13yr old girl is training hard with her team... just think about that for a moment ... you .. you're 13, you’re doing what you love with people who think you took their season away... yeap that’s what you did eastern Mavs ... it was no secret. Your trials were a month before forestvilles ... you had So much time to lodge a complaint... then she scored 20+ first round ... no compliant .... but end of season.... AND this is what gets me... this community, my community said nothing mothers of my children’s friends people I scored games of basketball with, Mother’s of boys who shares state basketball wins with said nothing ...

Reply #673604 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

oh boo hoo hoo. go complain to the administrators tbat were incompetent.

Reply #673607 | Report this post


Showgrounds 23  
Last year

It's not the first time this has happened to a team. There are reasons the rules are in place, if Forestville have done the wrong thing too bad. I don’t see why this is the Mavs fault???

Reply #673610 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

Correct ... I agree ...u16 girls div can't be taken lightly ... next thing you know THIS MUST BE "boo hoo’d" out in public ... did you really say that ??? I dare you to say that to her parents .. hero

Reply #673612 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

Did the division 1, team lose points also?

Reply #673613 | Report this post


Career 42  
Last year

I don't believe so Anonymous

Reply #673614 | Report this post


Chewie  
Last year

Clearances can take time for a number of reason. Always interesting when this happens. Be thankful it's sorted in summer...imagine if it had gone through winter as well.

Reply #673624 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

2 weeks, Chewie. That's how long a club has to clear a player, unless they are non-financial.

Reply #673632 | Report this post


Anon  
Last year

A formal complaint was lodged by Mavs apparently, therefore Basketball SA must deduct points. Otherwise it would have just been a slap on the wrist.
13 year old kids shouldnt be made to pay for what sounds
like bitterness from a club.

Reply #673637 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

Feel bad for the kids, but with all the kids that Forestville and Norwood claim from other clubs after they develop them, they should be way better at checking the paperwork is all in order.
And I know personally that Norwood go out of their way to make clearances difficult for div 1/2 kids that want to go elsewhere, that they will take the full amount of time before they clear them. Entirely within the rules, but most other clubs will grant clearances within a day or so after receiving the paperwork and everything is all correct.

Reply #673639 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

Devils advocate here. no bias or association with either club.

Why shouldn't mav's complain, why shouldn't any club complain. If the clearance had been granted and the problem lie with the club receving the player then why shouldn't points be deducted for playing a non registered player. whether it be div 1 or div 6.

Clubs know they can't play players that haven't been cleared. If Forestville erred or if Norwood erred then they clubs/teams wear the penalty.

why is there spite in all this yes, sure U16s girls have been made to pay the price of administrator's but surely it isn't that hard to get the paper work in order and I believe in the case of both Norwood and Forestville they have full time paid staff to take care of this, unlike some other clubs who rely on volunteers.

if you fail to register your car, and drive it on the road and get caught and you will, many cameras on intersections will catch you out. You can't complain you didn't get the rego papers. the onus is on you to pay the fee to drive on the road, the onus here was on Forestville IMO to not play a player that had not been cleared. not the childs fault, nor the parents fault, nor mavs fault the fault lies with f/ville.

Reply #673640 | Report this post


Anon  
Last year

Anon 602
If the player has been cleared, Forestville would have the paperwork and can provide it to BSA as proof.

Anon 604
Not sure that those people would know whether a player has been cleared or not? I am sure most people assume that a clearance has been given if the player is playing for a new club.

I am sympathetic to the affect this has on players involved in the 16 G2 team as they may have lost the ability to contest the summer season GF (if they were placed 1st or 2nd) due to administrative oversight.
However, this is a direct result of Forestville not adhering to the bylaws that are put in place so clubs do not play ineligible players. There is no way that blame can be directed at anyone else.

Reply #673644 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

Mavs have lost that many players and their reputation is in the toilet. Poor form for a D2 transfer. From all accounts the family didn't owe $ to the club. Very sad for this young girl

Reply #673647 | Report this post


Really?  
Last year

This is another black eye on the state of Basketball in SA.

Whilst I feel badly for the Forestville girls, by the laws of the game, the club is at fault for playing a player from another club without receiving a clearance first.

That said, how does BSA let this happen for 9 games over a season without finding the issue and fixing it in the first instance? In the best interests of the sport and its participants!

There are numerous mechanisms to stop this from happening and BSA as the 'leader of the sport in SA' have the duty to provide governance structures that benefit the sport positively.

Previously, the competition staff would have CSO check the database at stadiums and notify them of players on score sheets who were not registered. Often this would simply be an incorrect spelling or other such error. But often they found and fixed non registration errors.

Secondly, BSA has had the option of using stadium scoring, which again would not allow for these kinds of issues to occur.

Finally, and this is purely a personal view, BSA has had a habit of doing a great job of dividing clubs to stop them from working together. And currently the clubs have been seeming to become more and more united in its concerns about BSA management.

I would hope the the new CEO and his competition management staff would be able to recognize that they are at fault here for allowing this to occur unchecked and to provide a reasonable solution for the future.

So if you are a member of the Forestville team, I suggest they you take this up with BSA and not direct your concerns to Eastern Mavericks. As a united Basketball Adelaide and their clubs is far more likely to be able to generate improvements of this nature.

Reply #673648 | Report this post


Really?  
Last year

Btw anon above me,

If the player had requested a clearance then it would be automatically granted within 2 weeks. The only way this outcome could have occurred is for no clearance to be applied for in the original instance.

And this highlights the issue for clubs.

Whilst people are pointing the finger at Forestville admin for the oversight, I believe its impossible for any club administrator to know the origin of all new players to their club. or more importantly, for parents to know their responsibilities when changing clubs. Believe it or not, not all parents have a sporting background and understand that there is an actual clearance requirement when changing clubs.

With the number of players entering and leaving clubs during the season changeover, it is inevitable that someone will slip through the cracks. And over the last 10 years ALL clubs would have been guilty of such issues at one point or another.

The difference now is that rather than BSA finding out after 1 game and giving a club the ability to fix the issue, now it lets teams forfeit seasons, and clubs pay forfeit fines, and inter club spite to increase before taking action.

Reply #673652 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

"I believe its impossible for any club administrator to know the origin of all new players to their club"

The player trialed with Forestville well after the club manager's appointment, and her current club (at the time) was well known, but also easily accessible information.

"parents to know their responsibilities when changing clubs"

These particular parents are aware of the protocol, having moved older siblings to Forestville in recent years.

"it is inevitable that someone will slip through the cracks"

It's certainly inevitable when a club manager and/or administrator doesn't do their job. I agree.

Reply #673653 | Report this post


Wow  
Last year

Just wondering who it is that enters the teams and scores into the sportstg website.
Surely when entering the final scores each week and entering the players names from the score sheet there would be a "flag" raised if a name on the score sheet could not be entered onto the website.
Surely this would raise any issues early in the season !

Reply #673654 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

I highly doubt the fault lies with the parents or Mavs.

Forestville and/or BSA have dropped the ball.

Reply #673655 | Report this post


Anon  
Last year

This really annoys me.

Someone stuffed up. It is not up to BSA to scan tirelessly over score sheets and somehow recognize a new name with a new club.

The person in charge of clearances at BSA is extremely quick and efficient. I recently cleared my son from a club who wouldn't respond to my multiple emails asking for the clearance. I involved the BSA staff member in charge of the process and within 3 hours my son was cleared.

I had it in writing and i also looked on the sportstg - basketball sa club fixtures - clearances website and saw the name officially listed so knew i was ok to proceed playing him with his new club.

There is a process, it is not difficult. If playing in DIV 1/2 a coaching director or Head coach for the age level should meet with the parent and ensure the application has been lodged and also wait for word the official clearance is granted.

In this case, MAVS either granted it (as they have to within 2 weeks unless non-financial) and BSA secretary would be copied in as would new clubs secretary OR the parents of this child simply did not follow the process correctly to grant clearance in eyes of club and BSA.


Above there is mention of slap on the wrist being the usual penalty but not any more as doing this presents the opportunity to clubs to just take back door options.

Sorry to the girls who will miss out on finals because of this and to the girl in question but Basketball, especially at Div 1/2 level is a small community and figuring out the system and what is required isn't difficult.

Reply #673660 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

Move on everyone. Its Summer.

BSA fix your system so you get a warning when someone plays that is not registered. That means using the electronic scoring that you said you were implementing in your own strategic plan.

Clubs. Explain to all parents so you capture those who do not know that kids need a clearance that they must present a eatance before first game and direct them to the BSA policy and process.

Parents. Stop blaming everyone else and read and ask questions. Everyone is happy to find out about process for a car loan and read paperwork and buy a house, book a holiday and so on. Do the same for things that concern your kids. That is how everyone who has moved their kids have learnt. No one told us. We asked and read. Be accountable.

Players. Know that through your life adults will let you down. Grow to be a better adult than those that let you down. You now have the benefit of knowing that if you don't do your job or role in life, parent, employee or employer that apathy and failure to continuously improve will lead to letting others down. Don't be that person who does that to others. You are not the only player this has happened to.

Everyone. The reason a clearance would not be processed is it wasn’t submitted or all parties did ot get a copy. So everyine CC in club administrators of both clubs and the club secretary and add in the club manager and head coach (basketball operations manager is the latest title for them). The secretary and admin or office manager are nearly always two different people. Make sure you are paid up at the club you are leaving as that will prevent the clearance. State in your request you are paid up and expect anclearance within 10 working days as per the policy. Let everyine know you have read the policy and you know your rights. Your clearance happens when you have received a response confirming clearance and the name is on the clubs clearance lists. Only 1 club blocks their clearance list so almost everyone can check it.

Now for Winter. Everyone who has moved recently check your clearance status. You have a few weeks to fix between seasons and don’t let Junior Championships be lost because you have not checked. Clearance status is found under Club on the fixtures aite.

Reply #673664 | Report this post


Anon  
Last year

^ BRAVO! perfect post.

I want to copy and paste it onto Facebook.



Reply #673666 | Report this post


Career 42  
Last year

"Older siblings have moved to Forestville in recent years"

That's a lie they have not Anonymous.

It’s sad a season ends with a formal complaint to ruin a competitive season for 13 year old girls. From what I’ve heard she had been cleared, either BSA or Forestville are responsible for this, but still leaves a bitter taste in the mouth for what Mavs have apparently done.

Reply #673689 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

Not a lie, but not correct. My mistake.

Reply #673691 | Report this post


Anonymous  
Last year

Feel free to copy but edit my terrible fat finger mistakes and grammer first.

Reply #673695 | Report this post


???  
Last year

Bit odd this came to light right at the back end of the summer before finals. Feel for all that team to miss out. If the other complained officially why wait until now??? Could've salvaged the season if the complaint had been put in sooner. Clearly they were aware at the start of the season? Perhaps the timing was planned out of spite....?

Reply #673963 | Report this post


Anon  
Last year

^ doubt it. I would say the clearance was only published 2 weeks ago on sportstg and someone saw that, realised she had been playing uncleared and told someone.

Reply #673964 | Report this post


.  
Last year


Rules are rules - going back to it only makes it more painful. Learn from your setbacks and look towards next season.

Reply #673969 | Report this post


Anon  
Last year

^and educate the entire junior group of parents about club transfers and clearances so the process is smooth in the future.

Reply #673996 | Report this post




 

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